The Instigator
pusk_2611
Pro (for)
The Contender
NDECD1441
Con (against)

Education can be a boundary for imagination.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/18/2017 Category: Education
Updated: 6 months ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 516 times Debate No: 103241
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (2)
Votes (0)

 

pusk_2611

Pro

We've all been hearing this phrase probably our entire lives- "Imagination has no boundaries./ Imagination knows no bounds". It may indeed be true. The same way, I believe that education can be a boundary for imagination.
You may now ask me how? There are several examples I can give in order to support the topic. Let us suppose that I do not know the meaning of debate and also that I have absolutely no idea about the Internet. Now, considering these circumstances I wouldn't be able to imagine the working of debate.org . So, don't you think if I was educated enough to know what debate and the Internet is, in the hypothetical situation, I would very well be able to understand what debate.org is?
Therefore, I truly think education can be a boundary for imagination. Why else are educated people more creative?
NDECD1441

Con

I really loved the motion. Thank you for creating this debate. Now lets hop to it shall we?

stance : Education is not a boundary for imagination

burden of proof : Pro: Education demotes imagination by 100% (Because boundaries are limits of an area. Not a factor)
Con: Education is not a boundary for imagination even if it doesn't promote it

Points: Thank you for your points, now I would like to return a few more examples and a few points myself.

Education, knowing aliens do not exist (within our grasp anyway) did not stop me from imagining that I was David slaying Goliath in my own style and different outcomes. Knowing that 9+10=19 did not stop the 21 kid joke going viral. Knowledge and imagination may be 2 different things but knowledge definitely does not limit imagination. It is, in fact, your willpower that limits it. Even if knowledge doesn't promote imagination, it definitely doesn't demote it either and I believe my examples have proven that. The knowledge today may not be the knowledge tommorow. In fact, tommorow's knowledge was made by imagination itself. Imagination revives knowledge. Knowledge does not limit imagination.

Rebuttals :
Well from what I understand that you are saying, it seems to me as though you are saying that knowledge promotes imagination which, from what I understand, is not supporting your BOP nor stance. However, if I was mistaken, another possibility is that you were saying without knowledge, there will be no imagination. This isn't completely true plus, you example about internet (and judging from the era we live in now, seriously?) is only one while humanity has proved my point over a thousand times. A few million years ago, humanity's only piece of knowledge was survival and grunting. Almost completely no knowledge at all and yet... look where we are. Past geniuses thinking of ways to communicate. Imagination. After that, hyroglyphics then languages. Without knowledge, there wouldn't necessarily be no imagination. It is the reason why you have that gadget in your hand, on your table, wherever.

Conclusion: Overall, I have told you that knowledge doesn't really affect imagination and that without knowledge there still may be imagination. With that, good luck and I hand the debate to my opponent.
Debate Round No. 1
pusk_2611

Pro

Perhaps, you haven't really understood the topic. I am trying to prove that how the lack of education can affect one's imagination. Demoting imagination is totally out of the question. By boundary, I mean that without proper education, one will lack a creative mind.

" Knowing that 9+10=19 did not stop the 21 kid joke going viral."

What if you had no knowledge of addition? What if you did not know numbers? Would such kind of a person still be able to understand it as a joke? Obviously not.

" Knowledge and imagination may be 2 different things but knowledge definitely does not limit imagination. It is, in fact, your willpower that limits it. Even if knowledge doesn't promote imagination, it definitely doesn't demote it either and I believe my examples have proven that. "

I believe you have really confused yourself with the words 'limit' and 'demote'. Limit means that one's imagination can get affected by the amount of knowledge one has attained in the present context. However, demote is to discourage or reduce one's imagination in the present context.

" The knowledge today may not be the knowledge tomorrow. In fact, tomorrow's knowledge was made by imagination itself. Imagination revives knowledge. Knowledge does not limit imagination."

It is true that imagination gives rise to knowledge. In fact, imagination is the cause of this modern world we live in. But that does not necessarily mean that knowledge does not limit imagination. What if no one had any knowledge about networking. Then the Internet wouldn't technically exist.

"Overall, I have told you that knowledge doesn't really affect imagination and that without knowledge there still may be imagination. With that, good luck and I hand the debate to my opponent."

I too believe that without knowledge there still may be imagination. But how much imagination would exist? Imagine you are born in a blank world. There is nothing there. No plants, no animals, no humans, no land, no sky...There are only two things that exist, never-ending nothingness and you. Do you think you could attain any kind of knowledge from such kind of a world? No. Which definitely, in this situation, implies 'no imagination'. Apply the same thought to the present world, when you have less knowledge, you have less imagination.

With this, I hand the argument to be continued by my opponent.
NDECD1441

Con

Thank you for your reply, I shall now hand out mine.

"Imagine you are born in a blank world. There is nothing there. No plants, no animals, no humans, no land, no sky... There are only 2 things that exist, never-ending nothingness and you. Do you think you could attain any kind of knowledge from such a kind of a world? No. Which definitely, in this situation implies 'no imagination'."

I have two rebuttals for this point. Number one, it is obvious that there is no such world and we have absolutely no knowledge on this place. Yet you somehow conjured up such a place with such detail. This applies to what you were saying on - K (knowledge) = - I (Imagination). You asked me, a person who had no knowledge that such a world existed to imgine that I was there. One thing is certain, I will die. Yet again, even without any knowledge at all, I still could imagine therefore, slightly destroying your point. Number two, it was absolutely the same for aliens. We live in a world where aliens don't exist, which is, similiar to your IMAGINATIVE world. Lack of knowledge didn't stop us from thinking how they look like in movies and TV shows.

"What if no one had any knowledge about networking. Then the Internet wouldn't technically exist."

Well if we wanted a full understanding, we would have to go way back towards the root cause. I am not a history guy but the general idea is with me. My answer to your statement is you are wrong. Even without knowledge, we could still invent the Internet. How do I know that? Humanity has been exactly in that situation yet it proved you wrong. Lets go back to when the Internet wasn't here. They have knowledge on networking yes. However let's go back to when networking DIDN'T exist. They had math. Let's go back to when it didn't exist. Then we could go on and on until we find that we didn't have any knowledge of the sort yet was born the one genius who invented the first mathamatical calculations which led to the discovery of another to another so on and on up to the internet. See? ABSOLUTELY no knowledge yet discovered. Did you think that when we were born 'POOF' the knowledge of networking was inbound in our heads? No. For something to be discovered, you need to be stupid but imaginative. That was how the Internet and many others were formed therefore, destroying your point.

"What if you had no knowledge of addiction? What if you did not know numbers? Would such kind of a person still be able to understand it as a joke? Obviously not."

As I said earlier, even with absolutely no knowledge, you still would have imagination. I could use the timeline method again but I think you got the idea. Therefore, I shall elaborate. You mentioned math. What about english. Our ancestors had no knowledge of grammar, nouns, verbs, etc. Howver did it stop english from being created? No. Spanish? French? Portugese? Chinese? All of them started as nothing at all. No form of 'knowledge'. Therefore I state again that without knowledge there wouldn't necessarily be no imagination.

In all, one statement destroys all of your points. Humanity has proven that they had imagination even with no knowledge. Therefore, I say good luck to my opponent and hand the debate over to the government.
Debate Round No. 2
pusk_2611

Pro

Number one, it is obvious that there is no such world and we have absolutely no knowledge on this place. Yet you somehow conjured up such a place with such detail. This applies to what you were saying on - K (knowledge) = - I (Imagination). You asked me, a person who had no knowledge that such a world existed to imagine that I was there. One thing is certain, I will die. Yet again, even without any knowledge at all, I still could imagine therefore, slightly destroying your point. Number two, it was absolutely the same for aliens. We live in a world where aliens don't exist, which is, similar to your IMAGINATIVE world. Lack of knowledge didn't stop us from thinking how they look like in movies and TV shows."

You have, somewhat, misunderstood my point. It is absolutely true that you lack the knowledge of the 'World of Nothingness'. However, you possess the knowledge to understand the details of such a world. What if you did not know what blank or nothing meant? Now, come to think of it...Neither do I, nor do you, know how nothingness looks like or what colour it is. It probably has no colour but does that mean it is black or it is white? Nothing on paper = white. Nothing in the space = black. And the funny thing is, we don't really know if either of them are actual colours for sure. So, you see, neither of us can imagine this world perfectly. We can only somewhat make out how it appears with some of the details. Our lack of knowledge prevents us from imagining things in such a way that they actually exist. I may have gone slightly out of topic but imagination without, at least, some reality would mean a world without progress... so it was important for me to state this point.
When we are talking about aliens, I may slightly contradict my previously made point but here goes...
We are able to imagine things that we have never seen but, honestly, we do not know how it looks or even if it exists in the first place. Secondly, if we had ABSOLUTELY NO knowledge of the morphology or the anatomical structure of any organism, for that matter, I think that there is absolutely no way we could imagine the way aliens look.

" Humanity has been exactly in that situation yet it proved you wrong. Lets go back to when the Internet wasn't here. They have knowledge on networking yes. However let's go back to when networking DIDN'T exist. They had math. Let's go back to when it didn't exist. Then we could go on and on until we find that we didn't have any knowledge of the sort yet was born the one genius who invented the first calculations which led to the discovery of another to another so on and on up to the Internet. See? ABSOLUTELY no knowledge yet discovered."

The first teacher of the first of any organism is the nature. Humans started to count with sticks when they realised that some things were meant to be recorded in a different way. This realisation is what I would call knowledge. The knowledge that one cultivated from counting gave rise to some other knowledge and so on that has put us in the world we are today. If you believe imagination is the only thing one needs to have and have no knowledge to eventually give rise to something as huge as the Internet your wrong. There is no imagination when there is no knowledge. You are slightly are destroying your own point of how imagination gives rise to knowledge and not the other way round when you said that one discovery leads to another. This is how a chain of discoveries probably come up...
...knowledge-imagination-knowledge-imagination-knowledge-imagination....
I do believe that knowledge gives rise to imagination but more than that I believe that they go hand-in-hand with imagination being the area and knowledge being the circumference. If the circumference increases the area increases.

"What about English. Our ancestors had no knowledge of grammar, nouns, verbs, etc. However did it stop English from being created? No. Spanish? French? Portuguese? Chinese? All of them started as nothing at all. No form of 'knowledge'. Therefore I state again that without knowledge there wouldn't necessarily be no imagination."

Language came from the realisation that our kind needed a way to communicate. This realisation would've, probably, come from the communication among other animals. It first started in humans with actions and then with sounds. This realisation, as I told you earlier, is nothing but a kind of knowledge.

Imagination is a result of knowledge and there is knowledge to be attained from every single place. I request my opponent to share his points now.
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Debate Round No. 3
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Debate Round No. 4
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Debate Round No. 5
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by NDECD1441 5 months ago
NDECD1441
Sorry I wasnt able to finish the debate. The site for me had a lag not allowing me to post points.
Posted by NDECD1441 6 months ago
NDECD1441
Actually, I admit that I misunderstood the topic a little. Still a fun debate though. :)
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