The Instigator
CokeVoAYCE
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
tejretics
Con (against)
Winning
5 Points

Eminem is the best rapper of all time

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
tejretics
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/17/2015 Category: Entertainment
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 721 times Debate No: 77813
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (2)
Votes (2)

 

CokeVoAYCE

Pro

i know it's controversial, because eminem's not black, and rap is a predominately black music genre, but i think eminem has proven himself to be the greatest rapper of all time. a lot of you guys will claim shakur is the best, but i feel like shakur doesn't nearly match eminem's lyrical capabilities and flows when you compare their music side by side. eminem has demonstrated a strong understanding of the english language, and when you listen to his songs, you don't just see astonishing lyrical capabilities, but the emotion that he's able to describe in the way he sings his raps. for example, just listen to the song renegade, and compare the verses and emotion that flows in the raps from eminem's to jay-z's. it's clear eminem was superior in that song. https://www.youtube.com... also, listen to eminem's verse in the song forever, compared to drake, lil wayne, and kanye's verse. eminem always comes out on top. https://www.youtube.com... lastly, listen to eminem's verse in open mic, which showed his lyrical capabilities and how he was able to kill mics even before he was signed, back in 1996. https://www.youtube.com...

Eminem is considered one of the greatest hip-hop artists of all time. He was 83rd on Rolling StoneR05;R02;'R03;s 100 Greatest Artists of All Time[240][241] and 79th on the VH1 100 Greatest Artists of All Time lists.[242] In 2010, MTV Portugal ranked Eminem the seventh-biggest icon in pop-music history.

In August 2011 Eminem was called the King of Hip-Hop by Rolling Stone, which analyzed album sales, R&B, hip-hop and rap chart positions, YouTube views, social media, concert grosses, industry awards and critical ratings of solo rappers who released music from 2009 to the first half of 2011.[5] His second major-label album, The Marshall Mathers LP, was the fastest-selling solo album in US history[35] and was ranked one of the greatest hip-hop albums of all time by Rolling Stone, Time and XXL.[255] Rolling Stone ranked it the seventh-best album of the first decade of the 21st century.[256] The album's third single ("Stan") is one of Eminem's most critically acclaimed songs, with Pitchfork Media calling it "a cultural milestone".[257]
A number of hip-hop and pop artists have cited Eminem as an influence, including 50 Cent,[258] Usher,[259] Kendrick Lamar,[260] Ed Sheeran,[261][262] Lana Del Rey,[263] Big Sean,[264] J. Cole,[265] Skylar Grey,[266] Bubba Sparxxx,[267] Asher Roth,[268] Machine Gun Kelly,[269] Yelawolf,[270] Hopsin,[271] Tyler, The Creator,[272] Hollywood Undead,[273] Chris Webby,[274] Chance the Rapper[275] Stalley.[276] and Denace. Rap pioneers David Banner,[277] Talib Kweli,[278] Kool G. Rap,[279] Redman[280] and Jay Z have called Eminem one of the greatest rappers of all time.

https://en.wikipedia.org...
tejretics

Con

I accept.

The burden of proof lies *entirely* on Pro to prove the resolution as absolutely true. For this, Pro has to do the following:

(1) establish an objective criterion for what is "best"
(2) prove that Eminem fulfills that objective criterion

I would like to observe that a large part of Pro's case has been plagiarized from this article [1]. Everything from "Eminem is considered one of the greatest hip-hop artists of all time" is plagiarized from the same article [1], and while the article is sourced, it is not in quotes, thus is considered plagiarism.

Additionally, Pro cites >20 sources, and these sources are not seen under references. As such, I request voters to discredit Pro's argument.

References

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org...

Debate Round No. 1
CokeVoAYCE

Pro

The burden of proof lies *entirely* on Pro to prove the resolution as absolutely true. For this, Pro has to do the following:

(1) establish an objective criterion for what is "best"
(2) prove that Eminem fulfills that objective criterion

(1) i believe the criteria for best rapper would have to be best lyricism, ability to make you feel emotions in his songs, and flow (how good it sounds). good lyricism would include using a lot of poetic devices such as metaphors, rhymes etc. good flow would include smooth sounding rhymes along with tongue twisters etc.

(2) a. eminem is the greatest because he can make you feel all different kinds of emotions in his songs. he's known to be able to make you cry, with songs like "like toy soldiers," inspire you, like with songs such as "lose yourself," "8 mile" and many more, make you laugh with his slim shady character with songs such as "cum on everybody," "the real slim shady," and many many more.
b. eminem demonstrates his great lyrical capabilities strongly through songs such as "right for me," where he keeps the same rhyme scheme through the entire song, the song "quitter," where he's able to rap over tupacs beat, and create a better lyrical rap than tupac did on his own song, and many more. https://www.youtube.com... not to mention, in the song it's an attack on a rapper he was beafing with at the time, which he slays.

also, my next piece of evidence for eminem being the best rapper of all time is when eminem performs live the song "forever," at drakes own concert, and when he comes out the crowd goes crazy for him over the main artist, drake. he beat them all lyrically and with flow, and drake even admits it, calling him the greatest of all time. https://www.youtube.com...
tejretics

Con

Negation Case


Premise: An objective ‘best’ is impossible


For me to negate, I hold that it is impossible to consider anything as “best” objectively. This is, essentially, a Kritik of the resolution. The term “best” is inherently subjective – different people consider different things “best”, and it is not objectively certain. In Pro’s own case, Pro uses terms like “in my opinion” and “I believe,” which, inherently, show that the term “best” is subjective, and cannot be held to an objective standard.


The links: the resolution uses the term “best,” holding that Eminem is objectively the *best* rapper to ever exist. The impacts: the term “best” is inherently subjective, so there is no objective “best” for anything.


Counter-Case



A1: Objective criterion for what is ‘best’


Pro *fails* to establish a criterion that is objective to consider what is “best”. Pro establishes a criterion for what qualifies as the best rapper, but it is *entirely subjective*. Pro begins with “I believe”, which in itself implies the criteria is influenced by Pro’s own perception, thus is *subjective*, not objective. The Oxford Dictionary defines “subjective” as “based on or influenced by personal feelings, tastes, or opinions” [1].


Since it is implied by Pro’s belief and opinion, the criterion that Pro establishes is an entirely subjective criterion, while the resolution and Pro’s burden require Pro to prove that Eminem is *objectively* the best rapper, which Pro fails to do. As such, Pro misrepresents what is an “objective criterion”, committing two fallacies: red herring [2] and straw-man [3]. Thus, Pro’s criterion is unsound, and should be discredited by voters.


A2: Eminem fulfills that “objective criterion”


Eminem is the greatest because he can make you feel all different kinds of emotions in his songs.” The entirety of the A2 impacts are based on this assumption, which commits a logical fallacy known as bare assertion, since this is asserted without any evidence [4].


All Pro succeeds in showing is that Eminem is a good rapper – but this is insufficient to show Pro’s burden, which is to demonstrate that Eminem is objectively the *best* rapper. As such, presume Con in voting.


Thus, I have shown that Pro’s arguments are logically fallacious and fail to fulfill their burden. As such, the resolution remains negated by default, due to the burden of proof.


References

[1] http://www.oxforddictionaries.com...

[2] http://www.nizkor.org...

[3] http://rationalwiki.org...

[4] http://www.toolkitforthinking.com...

Debate Round No. 2
CokeVoAYCE

Pro

CokeVoAYCE forfeited this round.
tejretics

Con

I extend all my arguments.

My opponent has forfeited and plagiarized. As such, I urge all voters to please vote Con.
Debate Round No. 3
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by stoneddragon420 1 year ago
stoneddragon420
I would also like to say .. That even if be meets the criteria the whole thing is based purely on opinion. Even if he meets the criteria he still may not be the best to me and for preferences
Posted by Epicerdanu 1 year ago
Epicerdanu
If you want REAL rap, go listen to MattyB Raps, Liliblis or 4Poundz.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by Diqiucun_Cunmin 1 year ago
Diqiucun_Cunmin
CokeVoAYCEtejreticsTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: Conduct to Con for Pro's plagiarism and forfeit. Pro did not demonstrate that Eninem was the best rapper. He cited some songs of his, but failed to demonstrate how the songs supported his assertions (such as his ability to describe emotions) every time. Thus his arguments, while ostensibly substantiated, are weak. As the resolution said 'best', he should have compared Eminem with others to demonstrate that he is the best, but the comparisons he did make were, again, merely bare assertions ('d compare the verses and emotion that flows in the raps from eminem's to jay-z's. it's clear eminem was superior in that song'), and he made no real attempt to compare the qualities of Eminem's works with others' . Thus he does not fulfill the BOP, and arguments go to Con.
Vote Placed by TheJuniorVarsityNovice 1 year ago
TheJuniorVarsityNovice
CokeVoAYCEtejreticsTied
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Total points awarded:01 
Reasons for voting decision: ff