The Instigator
timou
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
DebateBehemoth
Con (against)
Winning
2 Points

End of world is so soon

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DebateBehemoth
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/22/2013 Category: Religion
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,285 times Debate No: 29431
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (1)
Votes (1)

 

timou

Pro

http://quran.com...
Allah said :when we put israeliens together, end of world become so soon.
terrorist israel was build at year 1948.
DebateBehemoth

Con

I am guessing the meaning of so soon in your sentence is near.
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My role to prove that it is further into the future.
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you sent a link holding the contents of the Quran.
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Let me start off by saying the Koran and the Bible contradict each other through the following scriptures.
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The story of Cain and Abel
After Cain killed his brother Abel, The Quran says that "Allah sent a raven who scratched the ground to show him how to hide the shame of his brother." Surah 5:31. This is not mentioned in the Bible.
The story of Noah and the flood
The Quran in Surah 11:42 & 43 says that one of the sons of Noah refused to go into the Ark and was drowned in the flood, while the Bible says that all three sons of Noah went into the Ark with him and were saved from the flood (Genesis 7:7).
In Surah 11:44 the Quran says that the Ark came to rest on top of mount Judi, While the Bible says that it was Mount Ararat (Genesis 8:4).
The Story of Abraham

Abraham's father, according to the Quran, is Azar (Surah 6:74), while the Bible says that his name was Terah (Genesis 11:26).

The Quran says Abraham had two sons, the Bible says they were eight.

The Quran says some of Abraham's descendants lived in the valley of Mecca (Surah 14:37),while the Bible says they lived in Hebron (Genesis 13:18).

The Quran says that Abraham had two wives, in the Bible he had three.

The Quran says that he built the Kaaba (Surah 2:125-127). The Bible has no record of that.

The story of Moses

The Quran states that the one who adopted Moses was Pharaoh's wife (Surah 28:9), While the Bible says it was Pharaoh's daughter (Exodus 2:5)

The Quran states that Haman lived in Egypt during Moses' time (Surah 28:6), while the Bible says that Haman lived in Persia during King Ahasuerus time (Esther 3:1).

The story of Mary (the mother of Jesus)

The Quran states that her brother was Aaron (Surah 19:28), while the Bible says that Aaron lived 1300 years before Mary (Numbers 26:59).

That she gave birth to Jesus under a palm tree (Surah 19:23),while the Bible says it was in a stable (Luke 2:7).

That Jesus spoke and made miracles at the time he was a baby (Surah 19:24-26). The Bible has no record of that. That Zacharias could not speak for three nights (Surah 19:10), while the Bible says he could not speak until the child was born (or for about 9 months) Luke 1:20.
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Meaning it is not enough proof to take scriptures in the Koran to decide that the end of the world is so soon.
Plus the link does not translate in anymeans the terrorist israel that was built in the year 1948.
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I admit to start with a decent argument to see if Pro is actually serious about this.

Debate Round No. 1
timou

Pro

How many differents bibles there is ???
======= >alot modified and corrupted bibes + contradictions..

How many differents quran there is ???
======= > 1 same copy of quran. Allah said that he will gard Quran because old books(torah and bible )
were corrupted .
http://quran.com...

Quran confirm the tue old books
http://quran.com...
DebateBehemoth

Con

Yet again all arguments you put are based on the koran.
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This following posts do not contradict the respect I have for the religion of muslim
6) Muslim Prayer Time Schedule can not be calculated for the location unknown for pre-islamic Middle-East and Asia.

The muslim prayer time (salat, salaat, solat, solah, adhan, athan, azan, ezan, ezen, azaan, namaz, namaaz etc.) is calculated by the special algorithms linked to the time of sunset, sunrise and a the time when sun is at the highest point and the length of the objects shadow e.g.
The Fajr prayer is mentioned by name in the Qur'an at 24:58.
The Asr daily prayer is mentioned by name in the Qur'an at 2:238.
The Dhuhr prayer is mentioned by name in the Qur'an at 17:78.

[Quran 17:78] You shall observe the Contact Prayer (Salat) when the sun declines from its highest point at noon, as it moves towards sunset. You shall also observe (the recitation of) the Quran at dawn. (Reciting) the Quran at dawn is witnessed.
This algorithms are doing quite well in many parts of the Earth. Even more, different Islamic centers help muslims to get the accurate prayer time in different locations with the google maps (e.g. www.pray-in-time.org)
But. The modern people know that there are places on the Earth where sun never goes on its peak or even a polar night or polar day can occur. For Asr, they have the only way to determine a time:
If the length of an object is 'x' inches. Its shadow's length at noon will be 'y' inches. When the length of the shadow becomes x+y inches, the time for Asr will have set in according to the majority. According to the minority, the shadow must reach 2x+y inches in order for Asr to begin.
This means that muslims living there will be unable to pray for half an year or calculate it using algorithms presented by Islam!
Try also to imagine muslim spaceman, going round the Earth many times per day and having sunrise every 80 seconds. The question can he observe the obligatory prayer times? No!
But let"s go a little deeper in future and try to imagine how Muslims landed on the other planets will make a salat, they would not have a sun at all. So, no salat on other planets?

First conclusion: The prayer times (times of salat) can not be calculated and observed at least at three unusual locations, e.g. polar and subpolar zones of the globe, space (e.g. Earth orbital space stations) and on other planets. Some muslims start discussions about it, e.g. you can find some at the Islamic portal mentioned above http://www.pray-in-time.org... But they are discussing how to calculate this time (e.g. http://ulugbeck.blogspot.com...). We think we should discuss another issue. These locations can hardly be named as unusual for modern person, it was unusual, even unpredictable for person of pre-Islamic Middle East. Though author (authors) of Quran was (were) a realy talented, the level of their knowledge about Earth, space and future development of the mankind was limited by the objective level of knowledges available in the society they lived in. The era of Geographical discoveries was far later and the space exporation begun just in 20th century. If it was God (Allah) whoes words are in Quran, He should have known the real situation with sun in all these "unusual" zones. For Him, a sun and a space are definetly the most usual things and usual zones. If it was Him, he would gave more universal way to calculate obligatory prayer times. It proves that words in Quran have no divine origin, it was made by man. This man belonged to his era with all level of knowledge those era had and this man had all the mistakes and misunderstandings his contemporaries had. If these parts of Quran are doubtful, no one can be sure about others in Quran and Islam
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5) FROM WHAT A MAN WAS MADE. ISLAMIC VERSION.

A fifth criticism of the Qur'an involves verses 5-7 of surah 86. They claim: Now let man but think from what he is created! He is created from a drop emitted - proceeding between the backbone and the ribs. (86:5-7)
This contradicts the scientific fact that semen is produced by the testicles, prostate gland, and seminal vesicles, none of which are between the backbone and the ribs. Critics note [20] that Hippocrates, whose writings were widely available in the pre-Islamic Middle East, [21] had taught that semen passes from the kidneys via the testicles into the penis, and that this is a plausible source for the idea in this verse. Muslim apologist Maurice Bucaille states that these verses are "hardly comprehensible" [22] and finds his own translations of them using meanings not found in dictionaries.[23]
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4) MOUNTAINS ARE CREATED TO PREVENT EARTHQUAKES? ;-)
A fourth scientific contradiction critics use is the claim that the quran says mountains were created to prevent earthquakes. In reality, mountians were created as a result of earthquakes,[16] and mountains do not render the earth's crust stable.[17]
And He has set up on the earth mountains standing firm, lest it should shake with you; and rivers and roads; that ye may guide yourselves; (16:15)
And We have set on the earth mountains standing firm, lest it should shake with them, and We have made therein broad highways (between mountains) for them to pass through: that they may receive Guidance. (21:31)
Critics say these verses show that the writer of the quran did not know the reason for the creation of mountians. These verses say that mountians were created to prevent earthquakes, while modern geology tells us that mountians were created because of earthquakes and not to prevent them. [18][19]
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4) MOUNTAINS ARE CREATED TO PREVENT EARTHQUAKES? ;-)
A fourth scientific contradiction critics use is the claim that the quran says mountains were created to prevent earthquakes. In reality, mountians were created as a result of earthquakes,[16] and mountains do not render the earth's crust stable.[17]

And He has set up on the earth mountains standing firm, lest it should shake with you; and rivers and roads; that ye may guide yourselves; (16:15)
And We have set on the earth mountains standing firm, lest it should shake with them, and We have made therein broad highways (between mountains) for them to pass through: that they may receive Guidance. (21:31)

Critics say these verses show that the writer of the quran did not know the reason for the creation of mountians. These verses say that mountians were created to prevent earthquakes, while modern geology tells us that mountians were created because of earthquakes and not to prevent them. [18][19].
I have ran short of time I shall continue soon.
Debate Round No. 2
timou

Pro

out topic
DebateBehemoth

Con

It is deifinitely in topic.
How could I trust your Koran predicting the end of the world if it's information is false.
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The koran has many flaws.How can we be sure this is not one of them?
Debate Round No. 3
timou

Pro

Quran is perfect and there is no flaws. you're brainwashed by rothschild family .
DebateBehemoth

Con

Yet again to put an argument based on personal beliefs would not win you this debate.
You can keep on posting your opinions but they would only matter if you have proof to back it up.
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MOON DOES NOT SHINE A LIGHT

A third claim that critics use is that the quran says the moon gives off light (some key arabic words in brackets):

Blessed is He Who made constellations in the skies, and placed therein a Lamp [siraaj] and a Moon giving light [noor] (25:61)
It is He Who made the sun to be a shining glory and the moon to be a light [noor] (of beauty), and measured out stages for her; that ye might know the number of years and the count (of time). Nowise did Allah create this but in truth and righteousness. (Thus) doth He explain His Signs in detail, for those who understand. (10:5)
See ye not how Allah has created the seven heavens one above another, and made the moon a light [noor] in their midst, and made the sun as a lamp [siraaj]? (71:15-16)
Critics interpret these verses to say that the moon shines light.[14][15] Muslims interpret these verses to be saying the moon reflects light from the sun, and not that it produces its own light.
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THE ORIGIN OF HUMANS IN QURAN CONTRADICTS SCIENCE AND CONTROVERSIAL ITSELF.

More examples of verses critics claim contradict science deal with the origin of mankind.

The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him: "Be". And he was. (3:59)
And Allah did create you from dust; then from a sperm-drop; then He made you in pairs. And no female conceives, or lays down (her load), but with His knowledge. Nor is a man long-lived granted length of days, nor is a part cut off from his life, but is in a Decree (ordained). All this is easy to Allah. (35:11)
Created man, out of a (mere) clot of congealed blood (96:2)
From the (earth) did We create you, and into it shall We return you, and from it shall We bring you out once again. (20:55)
It is We Who created you and gave you shape; then We bade the angels prostrate to Adam, and they prostrate; not so Iblis; He refused to be of those who prostrate. (7:11)
But does not man call to mind that We created him before out of nothing? (19:67)
================

Critics claim that these verses contradicts the scientific notion that man descended from a common ancestor with apes.[10][11] Some Muslim scholars respond by stating that the verses are not referring to human evolution, but rather to the origin of life, similar to many other verses, for example:

He it is created you from clay, and then decreed a stated term (for you). And there is in His presence another determined term; yet ye doubt within yourselves! (6:1)
One verse states that humans were created from clay (see clay theory of origin). Another verse also states that humans were created from mud molded into shape. 15:26 Also, the Qur'an also states that God created every living thing from/of water 21:30 24:45. The most common rebuttal by muslims is the denial of evolution being a fact.[12][13]
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Quran is wrong -1: Does sun have a resting place?
One example critics use states that the sun has a resting place, while it clearly does not:

Until, when he reached the setting of the sun, he found it set in a spring of murky water: Near it he found a People: We said: "O Zul-qarnain! (thou hast authority,) either to punish them, or to treat them with kindness." (18:86)

And the sun runs his course for a period determined for him: that is the decree of (Him), the Exalted in Might, the All-Knowing. (36:38)

Notable critics claim that these verses are a scientific error since the sun does not actually set in a spring of murky water. [8][9] Muslims respond by stating that this part of the Quran is a narrative from Zul-Qarnain's point of view; and Zul-Qarnain was describing the setting of the sun as he saw it (the sun looked like it set in a spring of water).

Do you think the explanation is satisfactory? We think it does not! Tell us what you think about Quran
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Quran is wrong! Step by step disprove of quran's divine origin

Muslims believe the Quran, in its original Arabic, to be the literal word of God that was revealed to Muhammad over a period of twenty-three years until his death. Muslims regard it as God's final revelation to humankind and view it as the closest thing to a part of God in the world.[2] Muslims also call the Quran the "Final Testament", "The Book", "Book of God" or "The Revelation."
The Qu'ranic revelations were originally memorised by Muslims as Muhammad spoke them, with some being written down on whatever was at hand, from stones to pieces of bark. Compilations of the Qu'ran began under the Caliph Umar, but it was Uthman who decided upon a definitive copy and destroyed all other versions. All of the Muslims use just one Quran and there isn't any differences among the sects. The Quran has never changed in substance since.
Critics of Islam often point to the Quran to prove that it is not of divine origin and therefore conclude that Islam is false. The divine origin of the Quran and the morality of the Quran are hot topics of criticism in Islam.
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As you can see while The Koran was proven wrong the bible no matter how hard scientists try could not meaning they could not find proof that God does not exist even the things in the bible have scientific proof mixed with religion Ill name one.
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The cutting of the Read Sea
EVIDENCE
Red Sea Crossing Discovery
by Ron Wyatt

The Route of the Exodus Journeys
- Locate Midian
- Where was Rameses?
- Leave Egypt the same day (Egypt Proper?)
- Where was Succoth, Etham, Pihahiroth, Migdol, Baalzephon
The Exodus Evidences - by Ron Wyatt
- Finding the chariot wheels in the Red Sea
- Timing of 18th Dynasty of Egypt
- Which Pharaoh's ruled and Statues of Moses, King Tut not a king?
Evidences and Understanding the Exodus - by Ron Wyatt
- The Red Sea Crossing SIte
- Mount Sinai, Route from Sea to Mt. Sinai
- Elim, and the town of Al Bada (Jethro's home)
- Rephidim (Split Rock), the Altar evidence
1998 Dive - Ron Wyatt, Bill Fry and group.
In December of 1998, Ron Wyatt, Bill Fry and 7 others (9 people) traveled to Nuweiba at the Gulf of Aqaba in Egypt. They spent two days diving where they believed the Red Sea had parted and Moses and the Israelites crossed.

They saw several items that appeared to be coral encrusted chariot wheels with their cabs. There were several bones that had been coral encrusted, including a human femur (upper leg bone). That bone was tested and confirmed to be coralized human femur. These items were photographed showing clear and distinctive shapes of bones laying on the floor of the sea.

Everyone that went was convinced this was the red sea crossing area. "What a rare privilege it was to view, first hand, the evidence that God has preserved." - Bill Fry 1998 Dive
Human bones at the crossing site.

Human bones and horse hoof found in the Red Sea at Gulf of Aqaba. 1998 Dive

May 2000 Dive Trip
This dive trip included: Ross Patterson from Australia, Viveka Ponten from Sweden, Michael Redman and Aaron Sen from Britain and Tor Larsen from Norway.

It was a series of dives from May to September of 2000. Their main purpose was to chart the contours and depth of the underwater bridge or "landbridge". Some items were found, but nothing that could be removed without destroying [also against Egyptian law to remove coral].

At one dive they discovered a wheel shaped coral. It was the size of a chariot wheel. It had the hub and 6 spokes. This was located at about 28 metres. The diver with the metal detector swept it and got a positive reading around the rim, but not the spokes or hub. The diver that first located it tried to move it, but it wouldn't budge.

There was found to be metal in several corals along with rust color that looked like iron. The remains of would have mostly rusted away but leaving tiny amounts of metal traces. They've been there since 1446 BC.
Debate Round No. 4
timou

Pro

you copy and past tring to make sense :D

you said: Critics claim that these verses contradicts the scientific notion that man descended from a common ancestor with apes.[10][11]

this is my theory , apes were humans
http://quran.com...

this is for you . http://quran.com...

you didn't prove anything, what is this? http://quran.com...
Allah created Adam ,so simple ,i don't see what is your point .
you're stupid when you say "As you can see while The Koran was proven wrong " LoL , what a loser ,you didn't prove anything wrong because Quran is perfect.

you said "the Qur'an also states that God created every living thing from/of water 21:30 24:45"
are you dumb ? wihout watter ,there is no life.

you said "Until, when he reached the setting of the sun, he found it set in a spring of murky water: Near it he found a People: We said: "O Zul-qarnain! (thou hast authority,) either to punish them, or to treat them with kindness." (18:86)"

he saw his photo and the photo of sun in watter
This is the first of the three episodes here mentioned, his expedition to the west. "Reaching the setting of the sun" does not mean the extreme west, for there is no such thing. West and East are relative terms.

It means a western expedition terminated by a "spring of murky water." This has puzzled Commentators, and they have understood this to mean the dark, tempestuous sea.

If Dhul al Qarnayn is Alexander the Great, the reference is easily understood to be to Lychnitis (now Ochrida), west of Macedonia. It is fed entirely by underground springs in a limestone region, where the water is never very clear.

check this maybit will help you to clean your washed brain
http://anti-brainwash.overblog.com...
DebateBehemoth

Con

DebateBehemoth forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by DebateBehemoth 4 years ago
DebateBehemoth
I knew he wasnt gonna be serious about it due to the research I gathered from his past debates so I started to wing it. :)
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by imabench 4 years ago
imabench
timouDebateBehemothTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:--Vote Checkmark3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:02 
Reasons for voting decision: Both sides had stupendously shitty arguments and horrible use of sources since scripture isnt actual evidence. If you argue a case, you use tangible facts, not lines from a holy book that can mean anything. That being said though pro had ridiculously bad spelling and his conduct was just as bad too, so I give conduct and spelling to the con. Terrible debate