The Instigator
NerdiestNerder
Pro (for)
The Contender
PinkSheep123
Con (against)

Ethics Is More Important Than Science

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/26/2018 Category: Philosophy
Updated: 3 weeks ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 184 times Debate No: 113139
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (5)
Votes (0)

 

NerdiestNerder

Pro

Ethics versus science? Which is more important? Personally, I think that the ethic side is more important than scientific discoveries, as I personally have never heard of a productive civilization that does not have ethics. However, I would love to see someone who disagrees!

Rules: Please enter certain points you think to improve your point as a reply to this, then, in the beginning of round two, I will answer those and put two more points out on the table, where at the end of round two you will answer those two, and put two points for your side out, then, we'll go over some harder points to answer.
PinkSheep123

Con

Hello and I thank pro for instigating. I look forward to an interesting debate.

Format-In my arguments, I will be tackling a topic that many people see as unethical-Animal Testing. I may be tackling other topics in future arguments

Rebuttal:
Personally-Simply put, this is an opnion with no factual basis


I personally have never heard of a productive civilization that does not have ethics.-Every civilization has ethics, but said ethics can be different. It is impossible to thoughly describe ethics as a general premise.

Assertions:

The "Unethical" testing of animals has led to medical benefits





The California Biomedical Research Association states that nearly every medical breakthrough in the last 100 years has resulted directly from research using animals.



Chris Abee, Director of the University of Texas M.D. Anderson Cancer Center's animal research facility, states that "we wouldn't have a vaccine for hepatitis B without chimpanzees," and says that the use of chimps is "our best hope" for finding a vaccine for Hepatitis C, a disease that kills thousands of Americans annually.



Herceptin – a humanised mouse protein – has helped to increase the survival rate of those with breast cancer by 70% ; it could not have been attained without animal research in mice.



Thanks to research on animals leading to the development of Highly Active Anti-Retroviral Therapies (HAART), AIDS is no longer the death sentence it was 30 years ago.



Animal research is responsible for the development of asthma inhalers, these have saved 10,000 lives of asthma



Animal research has helped develop modern vaccines including those against Polio, TB, Meningitis and, recently, the human papillomavirus (HPV) which has been linked to cervical cancer.



The development of Tamoxifen in animals led to a 30% fall in death rates from breast cancer in the 1990s.



The 450,000 people in the UK suffering from Type I diabetes rely on Insulin – which was developed through experiments in rabbits and dogs.



Smallpox has been eradicated from Earth thanks to research in animals.



"Unethical" animal testing is for the greater good





Currently, there are 5 million animals being used in testing (peta.org, simr.org)



There are currently 7 billion people in the world, 95% of which have benefited from the earlier mentioned medical advances



Approximately 3 billion people’s lives have been saved due to advances of medicine brought on by animal testing (understandinganimalresearch.org.uk)



In comparison, in the 1,800 years since animal testing has been introduced, 1 million animals have died. (ncbi.gov)



98% of animals used in testing that died were going to die anyway due to a disease or aggression that meant they were going to get put down



Testing vaccines and cures to diseases on animals have actually saved 1 million animals lives directly. (The lives saved of the animals being tested) (medicaldaily.com)





I would like to point out that Pro has not put out any sources, only personal experience. Therefore, we cannot take his/her arguments into account.






Debate Round No. 1
NerdiestNerder

Pro

Thanks for accepting.

"Personally-Simply put, this is an opnion with no factual basis" Personally, I wouldn't say we are without factual basis, as these ethics have been tested for thousands of years.

"Every civilization has ethics, but said ethics can be different. It is impossible to thoroughly describe ethics as a general premise." Thanks for bringing this up, as I should probably clarify my argument. You see, while ethics in different religions/cultures ARE different, many of the ideas overlap. For example, if you went to England and started killing people, then went to Brazil and did the same thing, they would both regard you as unethical, by legal law(1). So, "ethics" refers to these overlapping ethics. And, for countries that are in war, like the Middle East, don't count those, because they are in a time of crisis. For reference, you can use the Universal Declaration of Human RIghts.

"Chris Abee, Director of the University of Texas M.D. Anderson Cancer Center's animal research facility, states that "we wouldn't have a vaccine for hepatitis B without chimpanzees," and says that the use of chimps is "our best hope" for finding a vaccine for Hepatitis C, a disease that kills thousands of Americans annually"-Very true. However, we must look at what fuels this passion to cure Hepatitis C. Well, let's take this step by step:

-Dying from disease is bad.
-The world ETHICS says that we must stop death. Death and fear of death is bad. (2)
-We find chimpanzees, and, we decide that dying ethics for humans outweights chimpazee ethics.
-To balance the studying of the animals, organizations like "Save the Champs" help to protect them.

You can see that ethics fuel most of the science in todays world! Let's use an analogy:

A car (science) is more expensive, big in size, more features, however, without the gas (ethics), it has no fuel. Now, understand that their ARE other fuels to science, but the most helpful to humanity is ethics.

"Thanks to research on animals leading to the development of Highly Active Anti-Retroviral Therapies (HAART), AIDS is no longer the death sentence it was 30 years ago.
Animal research is responsible for the development of asthma inhalers, these have saved 10,000 lives of asthma
Animal research has helped develop modern vaccines including those against Polio, TB, Meningitis and, recently, the human papillomavirus (HPV) which has been linked to cervical cancer.
The development of Tamoxifen in animals led to a 30% fall in death rates from breast cancer in the 1990s.
The 450,000 people in the UK suffering from Type I diabetes rely on Insulin " which was developed through experiments in rabbits and dogs.
Smallpox has been eradicated from Earth thanks to research in animals.
"Unethical" animal testing is for the greater good" -Again, the other examples, and the repeat of the thesis creates an equation, that ethics provides:

Ethics for humanity > ethics for animals. You see, ethics protects humanity, animals are a second priority. And, as I said earlier, other research and efforts are into the ethics of animals. Plus, a lot more factors, like death rates, are important.

"Approximately 3 billion people"s lives have been saved due to advances of medicine brought on by animal testing (understandinganimalresearch.org.uk)
In comparison, in the 1,800 years since animal testing has been introduced, 1 million animals have died. (ncbi.gov)
98% of animals used in testing that died were going to die anyway due to a disease or aggression that meant they were going to get put down"- Thanks for this, I guess, because it proves that animal ethics were kept in mind. As you stated yourself, for every 3,000,000,000 people that have been saved, only 1,000,000 animals have died. That is for every 3000 people saved, only 1 animal died! You have given me the evidence I needed to prove that animal ethics were kept in mind also. Also, 98% of the animals tested were going to die, proving even furthur that ethics were fueled and kept the science of this research in check with ethics! Also, another question, why did you put this in? It didn't furthur your point, it just verified mine?

"I would like to point out that Pro has not put out any sources, only personal experience. Therefore, we cannot take his/her arguments into account."- Well, keep in mind, Con, that the first round was only opening what this debate was about, not exactly to prove a point. And this round, I didn't need much evidence, as you provided it all too me!

Reference
1. "Murder is an offence under the common law of England and Wales. It is considered the most serious form of homicide, in which one person kills another with the intention to unlawfully cause either death or serious injury" "In Brazil, homicide is punished under article 121 of the Penal Code." -Wiki
2. "The Universal Declaration promises to all the economic, social, political, cultural and civic rights that underpin a life free from want and fear" -UDoHR
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Debate Round No. 2
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Debate Round No. 3
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Debate Round No. 4
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by NerdiestNerder 3 weeks ago
NerdiestNerder
@canis 4
While the two may not be exactly alike, they still both control one thing: society.
Posted by canis 3 weeks ago
canis
"Ethics Is More Important Than Science"... Nice shoes are more important than grey clouds..
Posted by NerdiestNerder 3 weeks ago
NerdiestNerder
Chimps have ethics too...
Posted by NerdiestNerder 3 weeks ago
NerdiestNerder
Ethics were here before science when religion was the only one here. And ethics fuel philosophy, which fuels science and politics.
Posted by vi_spex 3 weeks ago
vi_spex
From science comes ethics, without science we would be like chimps or like religious people back in the day
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