The Instigator
twsurber
Pro (for)
Winning
20 Points
The Contender
ZKnecht
Con (against)
Losing
7 Points

FEB Pofo; Resolved: In the United States, organized political lobbying does more harm than good.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 4 votes the winner is...
twsurber
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/18/2010 Category: Politics
Updated: 7 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 4,318 times Debate No: 10868
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (11)
Votes (4)

 

twsurber

Pro

1st round set up. Neg may go first, or skip and I will post first in round 2.
ZKnecht

Con

I'll accept your challenge. I'm just starting to do research on this topic tonight and tomorrow, so it should be fun. Hopefully we give each other some good ideas, yeah? So, you'll start the debate then.
Debate Round No. 1
twsurber

Pro

1st AFF

I affirm the resolution as stated.

As the resolution appears to be unambiguous, no specific definitions are necessary.

C-1: Corruption & Selfishness
Per John Stuart Mill, The freedom of a few does not outweigh the freedom of the majority. Lobby groups and special lnterest groups push political candidates, elected officials, and people in positions of authority to support matters that are beneficial to achieving their ends. Members of the mafia used to use a phrase, "Make them an offer they can't refuse". The hidden message was that if the decision makers did not cooperate, then something bad would happen to them or their family. Such coercion is typical of special interest groups. Further, less violent yet still coercive methods such as blocking future legislation, finagling votes, and creating scandals are also used to achieve these ends. Oftentimes, if the lobby group is rich enough, or large enough, they can sway votes or an entire election. Threats can be made good. (Example, Several constituents have requested that a county commissioner support the sale of alcohol in a former dry county. By selling alcohol, it would attract better restaurants, increase revenue for the county in sales tax, and increase revenue due to crimes such as open container, drunk in public, and DUI. A lobby group of restaurant owners may say something to the effect, "If you vote against this particular bill, we will make sure that you do not get re-elected. If you do support this bill, we can make sure that you get re-elected". The restaurant owners would want the bill passed, while the more conservative folks would rather see it fail. Even if the politician opposes the bill personally, he knows that if he votes against it the special interest group will ensure that it is his last term in office. In short, he is coerced to do the wrong thing. It is reasonable to assume that this takes all over America, and at all levels of government to some extent.

Just because a certain special interest group wishes the freedom to do something, it does not mean that it is in the best interest of everyone. This is selfishness. They want something to happen that will benefit them, and they want it to be legal. Everyone else be darned. They manipulate the wording of the Constitution and laws to suit them. All of these things create dissension. It widens the gap between right and wrong.

C-2: Moral decay
Special interest groups/ lobby groups prey on and exacerbate the moral decay of our society. Things that used to be despicable are now socially acceptable, all thanks to the results of lobbying. While people may argue that this increases the freedoms of our citizens, it also places us downward on a slippery slope of sin. Every time another thing passes, it creates a legal precedence to approve the next thing.

C-3: Weakening of our core
Instead of preserving our nation, we are allowing so much that we are losing control of our own safety. Infiltrations aid internal enemies to threaten our nations safety. Our founding fathers would be disgusted if they could see what America has become. People have read into laws and rules, and have made this a den of thieves. We have the right to call it socially acceptable, or even progress, or whatever else that makes us feel good about doing the wrong thing. Deep down, everyone knows that it is garbage, and a pack of lies. Oh what tangled webs we weave!

Summary: In his farewell address, George Washington warned us of the many problems we would face if we were not cautious and vigilant. One of the very things he mentioned was special interest groups. Well look at us now! If George Washington could return to our country right now what would he think? The 1st Amendment guarantees us the right to free speech as well as the right to petition our government. Lobbying is a creative loophole under the guise of freedom of speech and freedom of peaceable assembly. While it may be legal, it distracts people from not only doing their jobs but also doing the right thing for everyone, not to mention it puts unnecessary pressures on leaders to revise and compromise standards. And all for whose benefit? Not everyone' s, just the folks responsible for the lobbying. Thanks
ZKnecht

Con

ZKnecht forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
twsurber

Pro

Argument stands undisputed. Opponent may post or not.
ZKnecht

Con

Unfortunately, I'm going to have to forfeit this debate. If my opponent is willing, however, I fully intend on challenging him to a rematch in the near future.
Debate Round No. 3
11 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Mermaid9 7 years ago
Mermaid9
I found the pro side to be particulary weak due to the fact that all points were never backed by any factual evidence
Posted by ZKnecht 7 years ago
ZKnecht
Gaahhh.... I think what happened was I clicked the "review changes" button but I didn't press the next button to actually submit it. [Insert gratuitous profanity here]
Posted by ZKnecht 7 years ago
ZKnecht
Shoot! I thought I posted my argument this morning but I guess I must've messed up. I'm really sorry about that. If you want to restart this debate so we can do it for real, I'd totally be cool with that. Sorry!!
Posted by twsurber 7 years ago
twsurber
Yeah, I run different strategies on here before our tourneys to see how others respond. It is helpful to see what works and what doesn't against usually good competition. Ironically, one of my debaters heard a VERY similar case at a tourney that I had used on here LOL. At least she was prepared for it.
Posted by jimmye 7 years ago
jimmye
Go PF! Thanks for giving me "some" ideas for next months topic.
Posted by twsurber 7 years ago
twsurber
There's a coin toss in real POFO, so since I initiated, I am giving my opponent the option to go first or defer. (If that's what you meant)

Or, this is the public forum topic for February, and I would to test some ideas before we actually compete.
Posted by Cherymenthol 7 years ago
Cherymenthol
Why do you all do stuff like this? Come on....
Posted by twsurber 7 years ago
twsurber
Interesting first round tehwimmenz! I'll take that into consideration. uh, denied, re-submit in 90 days for final disapproval. :o)
Posted by twsurber 7 years ago
twsurber
February. This is the NFL public forum topic.
Posted by wjmelements 7 years ago
wjmelements
What is FEB?
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by chattychic518 7 years ago
chattychic518
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Vote Placed by Pdiddy 7 years ago
Pdiddy
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Vote Placed by twsurber 7 years ago
twsurber
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Vote Placed by ZKnecht 7 years ago
ZKnecht
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