The Instigator
Con (against)
6 Points
The Contender
Pro (for)
0 Points

Fascism Is Good

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/28/2011 Category: Politics
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 14,377 times Debate No: 16748
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (5)
Votes (3)




Pro must argue that fascism is a good system of government and that we should be fascist.


I accept this debate and I would like to thank my opponent for giving me a chance to debate him on this topic.

First I would like to define some terms

Fascism - Fascism is the pursuit of a transcendent and cleansing nation-statism through paramilitarism.

Transcendence: Belief that the state can transcend social conflict and blend all social classes into a harmonious whole. Belief in the power of political ideology to transcend human nature and produce a better world.

Cleansing (ethnic): Favoring one or more ethnic or racial groups over others, either by granting special privileges or imposing disabilities; deportation of ethnic minorities, or worse.

Cleansing (political): Silencing the political opposition so that the transcendent aims of fascism can be realized. Restricting the freedom of speech, outlawing opposition parties, imprisoning political opponents (or worse) and indoctrinating youth in fascist principles.

Statism: Promoting a high degree of state intervention in personal, social, or economic matters. Belief that the state can accomplish anything.

Nationalism: Belief in the inherent unity of a population with distinct linguistic, physical, or cultural characteristics and its identification with a nation-state. Belief that the nation possesses special attributes that make it superior to other nations in some or all ways.

Paramilitarism: "Grass roots", populist squadrism aimed at coercing opponents and obtaining popular approbation by acting as a supplementary police force.

We - I assume the U.S.A.

My opening argument

I will be arguing that fascism is good enough, and better then the U.S. government's current system. My next contentions will give good reasons for the establishment of a fascist state, where the U.S.A. currently is. Let the record show that I am Con, but I want to see if I can debate on the side of Pro.

Contention 1: Fascism would be good because it would secure our national identity. Where as in the current system our government is crossing other cultures with our own, which is bad because without a distinct culture our country will have a down fall in patriotism and loyalty to the country. A good example would be the DREAM Act that is being decided on as we speak. The government wants to allow on documented illegal immigrants to stay here and even pay for them, and the fact that most immigrants still hold loyalties to the country that they just left. This destroys our national identity, and our cultural values.

Contention 2: Fascism establishes stricter laws that will decrease crimes such as murder, because it will increase the punishment for each crime.

Contention 3: Fascism will unite the country under one banner, one culture, and one people. This is good because it increase national pride and national strength.

Contention 4: Fascism will destroy devisions in the country by geting rid of certain traitors, politically incorrect people, and those that are a threat to the cuntry and its people.

In conclusion, Fascism is good enough for the U.S. and we should switch to it rather then keep capitalism.

vote pro!

Debate Round No. 1


Problems With Fascism:Fascism as an ideological system was tried in Italy, Germany, and Spain. Each of these nations suffered disastrous results.

The militaristic stance that fascism promotes lead Germany and Italy into World War II, which both lost. Adopting fascism could send our own nation on a similar trajectory. Considering the United States is militaristic enough as a democracy it is easy to see how a fascist USA might lead to another world war and our defeat or worse a nuclear world war that could potentially wipe out humanity as we know it.

Worse than the possibility of another world war is fascism's promotion of prejudice and discrimination. The ultranationalistic attitudes are paired together with scapegoating of minorities. In Nazi Germany this culminated in the Holocaust where 6 million Jews and about 5 million Gypsies, Roma, homosexuals, and political dissidents were murdered in concentration camps.

Even worse child, even babies were not spared from these massacres. This shows the sort of absolute insanity that fascism promotes, the idea that innocent children could possibly be enemies of the state.

Furthermore fascism does not even deliver the "Transcendence" of class that it promises. Far from merging all classes into a harmonious whole fascism accentuated class differences. Both the Italian and German governments were rather chummy with corporate bigwigs, particularly American ones.

So not only is fascism likely to increase class differences it's likely to enrich the foreign rich on the back of its own poor.


Rebuttal 1:

The United States is a nation of immigrants. Throughout our history our culture has been shaped by the blending of cultures. On the Statue of Liberty it is inscribed "Give me your tired, your poor/Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free." Our national identity is itself wrapped up in the "melting pot" of different cultures over time. People are patriotic and loyal to the United States, because our nation stands for liberty. Fascism would betray our entire nation's founding purpose and its history.

Rebuttal 2:

Our country already has some of the strictest sentences for crimes. Nevertheless, we have the worst crime rate in the world.

Another country, Finland has a prison policy that would get any American politician thrown out of office by angry voters for "coddling" criminals.

Finnish prisons are almost like college dormitories, and sentences are short. Nevertheless, Finland has a low crime rate, and the Finnish hold their prison system in high esteem.

Another big difference between Finland and the United States is that Finland has less class inequality. This shows that socioeconomic factors are a better predictor of crime than is "tough on crime" measures. Since fascism exacerbates class inequalities crime will likely get worse.

Furthermore, a fascist society without the protections affoarded in a democracy is more likely to punish innocent people. EVen if these measures reduced crime the harm the government would do to people would outweigh the harm being prevented from being done to people by criminals.

Rebuttal 3: Our national identity rests on liberty. Far from strengthening national pride and strength fascism in claiming to strengthen national identity by going against our own founding principles could create a "national identity crisis", leading to civil war.

Rebuttal 4: Germany tried the same thing. One of the people it got rid of(in this case he fled due to the changing conditions), Einstein was a brilliant scientist who instead of further contributing his technological expertise to Germany had to go to the United States to do it. He had a key role in the Manhattan Project, which ironically defeated Germany's ally, Japan with an atomic bomb. Einstein was Jewish so he didn't have the option of converting to nazism/fascism and staying and helping Germany. Similarly, a fascist USA might lose some brilliant minds due to intolerance.


Deathbeforedishonour forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2


MasturDbtor forfeited this round.


The militaristic stance that fascism promotes drove Ancient Rome into conquoring the West and part of the East. It has influenced the intire world and its language is thhe building block of all of the western languages. It made Rome the wealthiest nation that ever was. Fascism was based off of the polocies of Ancient Rome, and we can see how great Rome was from our history books. America has the best military in the world and are surrounded by week nations such as Mexico which are ripe for the picking.

Germany was not fascist, it was nazi. There is a difference. Nazism says that the different people should be killed because they are not even people, but fascism says that the different people are still people and should not be killed as long as they submit to the rule of their new masters.

Furthermore fascism does not even deliver the "Transcendence" of class that it promises. Far from merging all classes into a harmonious whole fascism accentuated class differences.

This is where fascism failed in Italy. If true fascism were to be established and the classes were ebalished then it would work and the country would be strong. They were not 'chummy' with Americans because they were at war with America.

R1: This is true to some extent. We are a nation of immigrants, but the people who have influenced this country the most is white people. We fought the wars, we ran the traide, we fought the indians for the land. Its ours. Our culture is that of western European nations not mexican nor asian culture. We should pretect our heretage before it dies.

R2: We are referring to America not Finland. People in Finland have different ways of looking at things then people in America. America has a high crime rate, so in order to decrease crime we should increase the punishment so the people wont thing its worth it to break the law. Fascism guarantees this.

R3: When fascism gets in power the people will trust their leaders. There will be no civil war.

R4: Germany was Nazi, NOT FASCIST. Even though we lose brilliant minds we will still have brilliant minds and also we will have a better educational system wich is another thing fascism promotes.

In Conclusion, FAscism is good enough for the USA.


Debate Round No. 3


Argument 1:

Pro makes Ancient Rome sound glorious, and links this with fascism yet what ever glories might have been delivered to Ancient Rome are outweighed by the harms.

Ancient Rome was not a nice place to live if you were not nobility, especially if you were a slave.

"Potestas" referred to a master's power over his slave and also a man's power over wife and kids. If you had "Potestas" over a person you could do what ever you wanted to them, including murder and no charges could be brought against you.

Civilization has come a long way and slavery has thankfully been relegated to the past. Fascism would risk taking us back to that terrible past. Let's leave fascism and slavery in the past where they belong.

What ever wealth the nation had did not benefit the slaves who had nothing. Furthermore, each war that expanded its borders would inevitably lead to a loss of life and destruction of goods and services. Even if it would enrich the economy of Rome it would do so at the expense of the global economy. It is better for a nation to seek greater wealth through its trade relations than by costly wars.

Argument 2:

Pro says that Ancient Rome's language, Latin is the building block of all western languages. This is blatantly false. It is the building block of the Romance languages only. Many western languages, including the one we are using to conduct this debate are not derived from Latin. English, German, and Dutch are Romance languages.

Argument 3:

Germany may not have called itself "fascist" but Italy was undeniably fascist and did have discriminatory policies against Jews.

Argument 4:

Pro says if true fascism was established all classes would be abolished.

That isn't even what fascism does.

"Fascism affirms the irremediable, fruitful and beneficent inequality of men."-Benito Mussolini

Fascism is not about eliminating class hierarchies, but about preserving them. The concept of "class collaboration" in fascism was a reaction against communism's concept of "class struggle" and communism's goal of abolishing social classes.

Argument 5:

Pro's first rebuttal is an argument from force. He is basically saying white people took the land from the Indians by force therefore it is ours. That's analogous to a schoolyard bully claiming he has a moral right to all the lunch money he took because after all he put in the effort and fought for it.

Pro says our culture is that of western European nations and not other cultures. America's culture has many influences that make it what it is today. Most popular genres of music today have African influences. Science, entertainment, technology all have diverse influences. But the main point of American culture, the common ground is that our nation was founded in a struggle for liberty. Far from being beholden to the old ways of western Europe American revolutionaries decided that our nation would be different back during a time when western Europe was characterized by monarchies, nobility, and serfdom. If anything by contrast to that time America has had more influence on Western Europe than Western Europe has had on America given that they have all either abandoned monarchy or reduced theirs to figureheads. Pro says we should protect our heritage before it dies. I agree, but to protect our heritage we must focus on liberty since it is the central characteristic of America. Fascism whose purpose is to preserve national identity would be a contradiction if tried in America. To even start fascism it would require us to distort our own nation's origins and characteristics, essentially destroying what it means to be American in favor of a falsehood.

Argument 6:

Pro is missing the point. America has some of the most severe punishments in the developed world, but still has one of the highest crime rates compared to Finland which has one of the lowest and less severe punishments. Pro claims that fascism guarantees that people think it is worth it to break the law because of the increased punishments. Considering that we already have worse punishments but still have a high crime rate the claim that increasing punishments will make people think breaking the law isn't worth it is dubious at best. People commit crimes when they think they will get away with it, and when people think they can get away with it they won't care even if the penalty is execution because they don't expect to get caught. Furthermore, criminals in prisons harden with their exposure to other criminals or from bitterness at the harshness of their sentence which can lead to reoffending. It may be that the reason Finland's crime rate is so low is because it is lenient in punishment and focuses on actually rehabilitating offenders.

Argument 7:

Pro claims when fascism is in power the people will trust their leaders. But you can't guarantee that. People might lose trust for their leaders. A lot of people did not trust Francisco Franco in Spain, and Spain had a Civil War.

Argument 8:

Fascism is likely to censor any information in the educational system that looks unflattering to those in power. Let's say the dictator decides evolutionary theory offends Christianity and so all kids get taught the Creation story and not evolution. Our nation's scientific progress would be destroyed.

"In Conclusion"

No conclusions yet, we still have 2 rounds to go.


Deathbeforedishonour forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4


As Pro has not responded I extend all arguments.

I have more than adequately refuted Pro's position.



I concede to my opponent's arguments vote Con :)
Debate Round No. 5
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by kohai 5 years ago
Go communism! Sadly pro conceded, he had a fairly good case.
Posted by Deathbeforedishonour 5 years ago
i8JoMomma lol weed is awsome :P
Posted by i8JoMomma 5 years ago
so is weed
Posted by Merda 5 years ago
I might take this just because Con hasn't defined the terms of the resolution.
Posted by Cody_Franklin 5 years ago
DAMNIT. If only I were still a fascist.
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by FREEDO 5 years ago
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Vote Placed by F-16_Fighting_Falcon 5 years ago
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Reasons for voting decision: Concession, Forfiet, can it get any worse?
Vote Placed by kohai 5 years ago
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Reasons for voting decision: Concession