The Instigator
Mockery
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
gabbsmcswaggin
Con (against)
Winning
10 Points

Feminism Does Not Equal Hate for Me

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
gabbsmcswaggin
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/22/2013 Category: Philosophy
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 953 times Debate No: 41082
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (10)
Votes (2)

 

Mockery

Pro

I'm here to defend that feminism doesn't teach hate towards men and that it is also a good thing for men too.

First arguments start in round 2.
gabbsmcswaggin

Con

I agree that originally feminism was a great thing and still could be, but it has developed into something much worse. Many feminist use there cause to hate men and transgender people. Here are some actual quotes from modern feminists:
Warning contains graphic language
"To have your cock cut off and then plead special privileges as women " above natural-born women, who don"t know the meaning of suffering, apparently"" - Julie Burchill

"[Moore] and I are part of the minority of women of working-class origin to make it in what used to be called Fleet Street and I think this partly contributes to the stand off with the tranni"We know that everything we have, we got for ourselves. We have no family money, no safety net. And we are damned if we are going to be accused of being privileged by a bunch of bed-wetters in bad wigs." - Julie Burchill

The accusation of upper-class privilege is at odds with the reality that transgender people experience unemployment at twice the rate of the general population. Burchill"s false assumption is that transgender people don"t know the suffering of biologically born women ignores the fact that transpeople are especially vulnerable to violence including sexual violence.

Transphobia in the feminist community isn"t new and continues to be promoted by feminists such as Sheila Jeffreys, Germaine Greer, and Julie Bindel who pathologize transgenderism for a variety of reasons. They characterize being transgender in various ways: as an extremely kinky sexual practice or a mental illness such as body dysmorphic disorder. Sometimes the criticism is paternalistic in claiming that transgender people are merely exploited victims of the medical industry"s drive to make money with various surgical and hormonal procedures. The 1994 book Transexual Empire: The Making of the She-Male by Janice Raymond describes being transsexual as a medical invention manufactured to create profit. Another criticism is that transgender people reinforce gender roles or expression. For example, Germaine Greer once referred to transwomen as "ghastly parodies of women" with "too much eye-shadow." Sometimes the attacks on transgender people reach conspiracy levels by those who see the phenomenon as an effort by men to turn themselves into women in order to infiltrate "women"-only spaces.

Feminists Lierre Keith and Derrick Jensen blend transphobia with "anti-civilization" environmentalism in Deep Green Resistance (DGR). Julie Labrouste, a contact of Radical Women, was repudiated by DGR, which had been urging her to join until she mentioned she was trans-female. She shared the following email message that she received from the group:

There has been a great deal of controversy around DGR"s stance on gender " we are a feminist organization and as such the women in our group have requested that their women"s spaces be women-only (women born women/female persons). Additionally, we believe that in general, trans*, transgenderism, and queer theory have been detrimental to the movement for women"s liberation. This is fundamental to the DGR movement and informs our work against patriarchy and civilization. This is not something we are interested in debating or changing, so DGR is likely not the best fit for you.

Julie Bindel, another prominent feminist, promotes misconceptions by stating that "transsexualism, by its nature, promotes the idea that it is "natural" for boys to play with guns and girls to play with Barbie dolls"the idea that gender roles are biologically determined rather than socially constructed is the antithesis of feminism." She blames transgender people for promoting sexual stereotypes because male-to-female transgenders are supposedly driven to achieve an ultra-feminine ideal. She overlooks the fact that being transgender is about self-identification and that what someone actually does to transition is up to them and doesn"t necessarily include hormones or surgery.

When some of the most prominent feminists and famous women make openly hateful anti-male statements, and the mainstream feminist organizations say and do nothing to distance themselves from such public statements, then it"s clear that the hatred of men has an accepted place in mainstream feminism.

Does this seem like a harsh assessment of feminism? Perhaps.

Is it true? Absolutely.

One of the main problems with "feminism" is that it exploits the legitimate claims of equal rights as a cloak to usher in its divisive, hateful and neurotic interests. Interests that are plainly anti-male and not at all about equal rights.

For example, here are some quotes from famous feminists.

"I feel that "man-hating" is an honourable and viable political act, that the oppressed have a right to class-hatred against the class that is oppressing them." " Robin Morgan, Ms. Magazine Editor
"To call a man an animal is to flatter him; he"s a machine, a walking dildo." -" Valerie Solanas
"I want to see a man beaten to a bloody pulp with a high-heel shoved in his mouth, like an apple in the mouth of a pig." " Andrea Dworkin
"Rape is nothing more or less than a conscious process of intimidation by which all men keep all women in a state of fear" " Susan Brownmiller
"The more famous and powerful I get the more power I have to hurt men." " Sharon Stone
"In a patriarchal society, all heterosexual intercourse is rape because women, as a group, are not strong enough to give meaningful consent." " Catherine MacKinnon
"The proportion of men must be reduced to and maintained at approximately 10% of the human race." " Sally Miller Gearhart
"Men who are unjustly accused of rape can sometimes gain from the experience." " Catherine Comins
"All men are rapists and that"s all they are" " Marilyn French
"Probably the only place where a man can feel really secure is in a maximum security prison, except for the imminent threat of release." " Germaine Greer.
The quotations above are from Kelly Mac"s blog. Kelly is "a woman against feminism" because of its anti-male agenda.

https://www.google.com...
http://awomanagainstfeminism.blogspot.com...
Debate Round No. 1
Mockery

Pro

Mockery forfeited this round.
gabbsmcswaggin

Con

gabbsmcswaggin forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
Mockery

Pro

Sorry about the forefit. Didn't have a computer.

Now the thing is each feminist is different. There are also a lot of male feminist. To be a feminist means you are open to the idea of destroying the idea of the patriarchy. In doing this, you are freeing both men and women from the restraints put of them. There are many gender roles that still exist into today's society and a real feminist fights to remove all of them.

Not to mention hating men doesn't help the feminist agenda. It merely makes feminists look insane. There are some feminist that think men are evil and of course, this isn't true. Yes, there are male killers and rapists but that doesn't mean every single man is evil. In order to be a feminist, you have to realize that mean suffer under the gender roles and the patriarchy as much as women do.

The core of feminism is and should always be to try to abolish hurtful gender roles and pave a new path for the future.
gabbsmcswaggin

Con

Of course not all feminist are hateful, but as I have shown in my arguments its very common.
Debate Round No. 3
Mockery

Pro

You say it's common but I have to disagree. I have seen mostly positive and opened minded feminists. We can't just jumble then all together. That's not fair. Besides, saying that man hate is common makes it seem like feminism hasn't done any good. Without feminism, the world would be a very ugly, unfriendly place. Feminism has helped women and men. It has shown people that you don't have the follow the gender roles society tries to hand out. Just because some people are men haters and feminists should not reflect what feminism stands for.
gabbsmcswaggin

Con

As I said previously feminism has helped the world but it's evolved into a hateful thing. My opponent has failed to show any proof at all for her arguments, and has failed to counter my points, this is why you should vote pro.
Debate Round No. 4
10 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by DudeStop 3 years ago
DudeStop
I think that because conconceded that not all feminists are hateful, we can conclude that feminism does not equal hate. Ff?

Also: 'you should vote pro." as con said in her last arguments...
Posted by DudeStop 3 years ago
DudeStop
Who forces you to play with "Barbie" dolls?
Posted by Mockery 3 years ago
Mockery
I'm so sorry I missed the first round! If you still want to debate gabbs, I'm up for it
Posted by anonymousidiot 3 years ago
anonymousidiot
I may be a female, but I play with Nerf guns all the time with my friends (which are mainly boys). Forcing girls to play with barbie dolls is just plane wrong, unless they actually want to play with them.
Posted by AlexThunder 3 years ago
AlexThunder
It's just the fact that when men make jokes about women, the feminists take on arms and go on a full scale attack (which is kind of idiotic.) But when a woman makes a joke about a man everything is okay. Double standards is the problem. Feminists, take a chill pill.
Posted by EndarkenedRationalist 3 years ago
EndarkenedRationalist
That's true, Mockery, but that's mainly because of radical feminists. The ones who ignore men's issues and denounce most men as patriarchal pigs. In the 1970s definition of feminism - equality between the genders - I'm a feminist. But the way a radical minority of feminists have warped it...it's sad.
Posted by Mockery 3 years ago
Mockery
You'd be surprised. There a lot of people who think feminism is nothing but a promotion of man hate.
Posted by Disquisition 3 years ago
Disquisition
Uhhh yea sure, but good luck finding anyone to think that core feminism equals hatred because that's extremely absurd. You really set con up as a straw-men.
Posted by Mockery 3 years ago
Mockery
I'm more of talking about the core of feminism. What's it's really suppose to be about. Does that help?
Posted by Disquisition 3 years ago
Disquisition
You do realize that there are numerous types of feminism ideologies that range from radical to liberal. Could you specify what form of feminism is being debated here.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by yay842 3 years ago
yay842
MockerygabbsmcswagginTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro's argument based entirely on opinion and failed to counter opponent's argument that had sources.
Vote Placed by MrVan 3 years ago
MrVan
MockerygabbsmcswagginTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: Con started her arguments prematurely, but because of Pro forfeiting the second round anyways they are both tied for conduct. Con was the only one who provided any sources for her arguments, which Pro failed to efficiently respond to.