The Instigator
Minddagger
Pro (for)
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The Contender
Maryam_mosawy
Con (against)
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Feminism Needs to die out

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/6/2018 Category: Politics
Updated: 1 week ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 234 times Debate No: 106455
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (3)
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Minddagger

Pro

Feminism is a waste of human air, it used to be there for a reason, now its just plain out useless, boys get raped too you know, they just cant open up due to the fact almost no one believes them.

And no, you CANT like boys and be a feminist, because you are trying to replace them,
if you are "friends" with a feminist, then that's a downright lie, all she cares about is herself, so your "friendship" with her is FAKE.

they also get offended by EVERYTHING, they just wont shut up! they hate male protagonists, they think saying hi is sexual abuse, they also claim to "hate racism" when in fact they are the ones sexualizing black men, making them uncomfortable.

And don't say that they are helping either, hate crimes against women have skyrocketed thanks to them, they also SEND DEATH THREATS to writers who don't give them what they want, they are like spoiled little children.

why are they spoiled? Because politics threat them like they are a religion, women have won a majority of custody battles (and no, men almost never agree with it), women are treated like they are the most oppressed minority, but they are not.

What did black people get stereotyped for? being dumb, being objects, being oversensitive.

What did women get stereotyped for? cooking, I rest my case
Maryam_mosawy

Con

I understand where you're coming from,
And yes I agree, unfortunately women are taking feminism way too far
But that doesn't mean rights for women should be taken away;
First we need to know the exact definition of feminism : It is the advocacy of women's rights on the ground of the equality of sexes. So women want to be as equal as men and I do not see a problem with that.
Back in the old days, and up until today; women have been buried alive, slaughtered, treated as slaves, being beaten up till death and the list just never ends. In India, there is a higher population of men than women, because there are still families there that just bury their new born daughter alive.. how cruel is that? Obviously women who are gonna here these sort of things are going to stand up for themselves and tell the world that they have a place in society.
I am not saying that women should go to a point where they think they are more superior to men; I mean that they should have the same equal rights as men have in society. A woman's role isn't just staying home, cleaning and cooking; women have a voice, they have a role in being outside the real world, they don't deserve to just be treated as housemaids.
And also, how many girls today are being treated badly by their boyfriends; they start dating and making out, next minute the girl falls pregnant and the guy just dumps her; it happens a lot these days.
A true feminist won't take it too far and act so superior against men
Debate Round No. 1
Minddagger

Pro

first off I would like to thank my opponent for accepting my challenge, and would like to apologise for the angry introduction in the first round, but I still think feminism is useless

my opponent has argued that women has heard of the treatment in India, and decided to stand up for themselves, don't you think that's selfish? while other women are being treated with real sexism we have selfish American women who have not stood against that, just their own. in over half the world, women just have been cleaning dishes and is In charge of the house, sure in 40% it was bad for them, but most feminism is happening in places where they weren't treated badly

I'm not saying that they shouldn't have rights, I'm saying they are taking it to far, girlfriends that their boyfriends badly as well, and while it is true that a guy dumps her for being pregnant, a girl will disrespect their boyfriends opinion and have an abortion (I'm pro choice though, but I think men should have a say too)

a women who doesn't take it too far isn't a feminist, she is an egalitarian
Maryam_mosawy

Con

The treatment of India is not the only reason why women are standing up for themselves; I only mentioned one just to give an idea/example of how women are being treated and a few others like physical and verbal violence, rape, buried alive; I mentioned them previously.
Pro tells me that most feminism is happening in places where they weren't treated badly, but you haven't given me the names of these type of places.
From what I know, most places like India, Yemen, Iraq, Nepal, Peru, Turkey, Afghanistan, Democratic Republic of Congo, Mali, Saudi Arabia, Jordan and America.
Seems like a lot of countries to me; twelve countries in total.
India : As I've mentioned before, new born daughters are buried alive or even aborted before birth; women have been treated with disgust by men, and reports show that thousands of women get raped
Yemen: Access to education for girls is very limited, and many of them are married before the age of eighteen,
Iraq: The Iraq War didn't improve the lives of women, and over the past thirty years, the number of women in the workforce has dropped down.
Nepal: Only 25% of women are enrolled in higher education institutions; Nepal is one of the only world's countries where women's lifespans are less than that of men whereas throughout the world, women typically have a larger lifespan than men( I'm not trying to degrade men, but this is a fact). Education is not even considered as a norm for a Nepalese women, but marriage is and their lives have been dictated by their husbands, fathers or sons.
Peru: 61% of women have been victims of physical abuse, and according to the World Health Organization, 52% of women have been slapped by their partner.
Turkey: Only 29% of Turkish women are employed whilst 70% of males are, majority of the women are doing unpaid work, such as housework or childcare.
Afghanistan: Probably one of the worst countries where women have been treated severely; Afghan women have been imprisoned due to running away from their abusive husbands, in 2013, violence grew against women in power, and there was an assassination attempt on a female member working in the parliament. Human Rights Watch report claims that things are getting worse for Afghan women.
Democratic Republic of Congo: Now this country isn't just a dangerous place for women but for all citizens. Rape and sexual assault are common for the soldiers' aims to intimidate and threaten people. Daily Beast's ranking of best countries for women gave this nation a very low score: 13.6 out of 100.
Mali: It is one of the world's poorest countries; where only a few females escape from genital mutiliation, one in ten of women in Mali die in pregnancy or childbirth, as many of them are into forced marriages when young.
Saudi Arabia: Some things have improved in Saudi Arabia, such as giving the right for women to vote and allowing them to finally drive. However segregation against women still occurs such as not being allowed to leave the house without a partner or not being allowed to enter the Jannatul Baqee cemetery.
Jordan: Women do not have an equal economic opportunity or participation and the unemployment of women is double the amount of men who are employed.
America: Both women and men face rape and sexual assault, however women face more; 90 of females face rape whilst men only face 10 percent. Researchers have even shown that every 2 minutes an American is faced with sexual assault.

So now you can see as to why feminism has shown a rapid growth among women?
Debate Round No. 2
Minddagger

Pro

yes I see why, and it is still useless, all feminism did was increase the crimes against them, and I can counter with each and everything of your list. (except India of course)

Yemen: access to education is limited to women? isn't that the same with men in America? many of them are married before the age of eighteen, what kind of problem is that? sure your with someone you don't want to be with but that isn't sexist against women, men are forced to marry underage too.

Iraq: iraq HAS improved women lives, they have a lot more rights now, and the only reason why the workforce of women is shrinking is because many women prefer to go do their own thing.

Nepal: wait, your upset by the fact that not all women are in charge of rulebooks, that is ridiculous, and 25% is a huge number statistic wise, not all women have a longer lifespan than men, how is that anyone's fault?

Peru: so women can get away with slapping their partner but men cant? its obvious that the women their are tougher than the average women so they can take a slap, and recent events in America lets me think that half of that "61%" is just liars who just want the house to themselves.

Turkey: again with the jobs? like I said before, women there like doing their own thing, your just grasping at straws at this list so far.

Afghanistan: how do you know that the women running away was because of abuse? it could be a million things, maybe she didn't want to pay the bills, in 2013 you say violence grew against women in power, yet the only thing you could list was an assassination attempt from one women, ONE. and it could have been for a million things, NOT because for her gender

Democratic republic of condo: you say that it is bad for ALL citizens, not just women, as such this does not count as women getting the short end of the stick, and the men would have given it low score to.

Mali: you say only a few witness, that is not enough to confirm suspicion of "genital mutilation" in Mali, and its not the country's fault they cant afford women surviving pregnancy, and once again, men get into forced marriages as well.

Saudi Arabia: you say things have improved for women, while also saying they cant leave the house alone, than how do you see them walking around the streets in the first place? and not allowed to see a cemetery? do you want me to bring in the face men are not allowed to go to a concert stadium?

Jordon: again, women want to do their own thing, plus women can do their own economic opportunities

America: possibly the most ridiculous thing on this list, all you have listed is an unproven theory, in fact, their are many men who cant open due to the fact that the government is always biased towards women.

Feminism is a waste of time, is unneeded I most countries, the only places that it is needed is India and Lydia, and guess what? no feminist stand for those women, because like I said, they are selfish, a true women who stands for equal rights is an egalitarian, as I said before.
Maryam_mosawy

Con

Yemen: access to education is limited to women? isn't that the same with men in America?
We're talking about Yemen here not America; do you wanna know why this is the case in America? Because many men in America are generally lazy, which is why an increase in women graduating and getting their PhDs is greater than men. 36% of women compared to 28% of men have graduated and that's not because men aren't given education, it's just that most of them can't be bothered.
Iraq: Unfortunately it hasn't; I'm an Iraqi myself and I know what it's like. Women I've known have been dropped out of school from early ages and forced into marriage, youngest is thirteen. Sure it may be part of their culture, but who even said that the women really wanted to get married at that age, what if she was forced? It's not like men; infact there are many men who get married quite late in their 40s. As there is a rise of terrorism there, the Iraqi women face much different struggles than men, including a systematic culture of rape and slavery within the terrorist organisations. The Iraqi's Constitution in 2005 did state that there should be equality between men and women, but there are still wide gender gaps; I know my own country better than you do.
Nepal: What are you on about rulebooks? When I said women's lives are dictated by their husbands and fathers, I was saying that they don't have the freedom to make their own decisions, does that seem fair to you? And no 25% is not a huge number; that's just the 75% remaining of women don't have education, so yes it seems pretty small.
Peru: How do you know the women there are tougher than average women? Even though they may be tougher, the husband shouldn't slap his wife, its cruel, a slap on the face doesn't just hurt the woman physically but mentally, that is if you've ever been slapped across the face and knows what it feels like. Men are supposed to be the custodians of women, they have the right to protect them.
Turkey: Well how do you know that for sure? What if they are women who want to have a job but can't because of the low employment? What if her husband doesn't let her work and just wants her to cook and clean? See you can't be sure that all women want to do their own thing by staying home. There has even been a significant increase of violence against women; and there has been a case where a man just killed his wife with a cooking pan just because THERE WASN'T ENOUGH SALT IN THE MEAL.
Afghanistan: I only gave one example, but I'll give you more. Now I'm pretty sure you know what happened to Malala, and why she got shot. IT WAS BECAUSE SHE WAS A FEMALE WHO WANTED TO HAVE EDUCATION. But up until now, women can't have education or even finish their education and forced into early marriages. Have you heard of the murder of Farkhunda? Who got killed for falsely being accused of burning the Holy Quran. And the person who falsely accused her was a mullah and why did he accuse her for? TO SAVE HIS JOB. And it wasn't even a big deal, they just had a debate infront of a mosque and she sorta overthrew him or something, and because of that he accused her. People just kept savagely beating her up, burning her alive, till she died. It was horrid. This was obviously something major, which has highlighted violence against the women's country. Surely, maybe some things have improved, but with no continuous effort.
Many women have died in pregnancy and birth, the life expectancy for a woman is 51. And don't tell me its nobody's fault, the country has pressurized women forcing them into marriages at the age of 12. So what do you expect? Her freedom as a young child has to be taken. It's not like men. In Kabul, it is very common for women to be taken to hospitals shortly after marriage, due to physical injuries such as tearing and excessive bleeding. Afghanistan is probably the worse second to India.
Democratic republic of condo: I'll have to agree with you on that.
Mali: Genital mutilation is considered as harm for a woman, and it doesn't just occur in Mali. And men barely get forced; not like women; and if they do get forced, most of them don't even get married young like women; and it's harder for the woman than the man because the woman is the one who takes most responsibility of the family, by having children and raising them, looking after the house, which is very difficult so she is facing more struggles.
Saudi Arabia: I've been there; women aren't allowed to enter even if she is with her husband. She can't even stand outside of it for a long time, they'll force her to leave and I know this because I've seen it myself.
Jordan: What I said before about Turkey.

Feminism is not a waste of time; and women can be selfish just like men are, you can't just say women, look at all these facts and incidents that has happened to women, so how would you expect feminism to simply die out? It's impossible; feminism is obviously gonna grow, the more violence and attacks there are on women the more it will grow. Physical violence against women is something major that occurs in many societies not just in these countries but almost all around the world.
And I also haven't mentioned the fact that there are two mental debators on this website who claim that women are chunks of meat for men and women aren't needed in the future because of the invention of sex bots, and post disgusting things about women.
Debate Round No. 3
Minddagger

Pro

Irag: First off, we can talk about america because it has a similar problem, Yemen could have generally lazy women, have you thought of that? oh wait, you were to busy sterotyping men.

Iragi: it could be the same here, its the women's fault they dropped out of school because they didnt pass any grades, and seriously? 13? i would have been concerned if it was 8 or 7, but 13? also, once again, the men are forced to marry to the women to,

plus how do you know that the men in their 40's arent forced to get married to, its not the women's or the men's fault they are having terrorist attcks, im sure if the terrorist attacks end in your country, im sure the gender gap could be much smaller. and if iraq's constitution states that there should be equality, than its the women's own fault.

Nepal: its still not the government's fault for them to not have an education, its not the governemnts fault that the women dont dump the boyfreind or call the police, women slap men all the time, and yet you say when men do it, its cruel? and at one point you say that men should not dictate their relitionships, and now you call them custodians? which is it?

Turkey: and how do you know otherwise? how you know her husband doesnt let her get a job? how do you know a man killed his wife with a cooking pan without evidence the story was not fabricated? you do not know the statistics of all countries, so you definitly dont know what the percentage of violence against women

afganistan: that story was a long time ago, karkhunda was just a victim of extremism, religon can be cruel, this is definitly not the first time, and im pretty sure their was women in that mob, once again its not the governments fault they cant afford child support, its no one fault that pregnant women died, and the reason why they are having forced mariges (which men get pressurized for too) bcause the population could be plummiting due to all the dying pregnant women, sure men and women dont like it, but it must be done.

Mali: you just explained that women are just going though in mali what some perfer to go though in america, im pretty sure the man helps as well, because he had noo choice either, its either find someone to be married, or get married to a 51 year old.

i know that men are just as stupid as women can be, im not saying that it is going to die out, im saying it should, because the more the feminism extremists acts grow, the incidents you have listed will be more and more servere, and the only way to end the cycle is to end feminism.

and yes, those 2 debaters are messed up in the head.
Maryam_mosawy

Con

The final round we should stop talking about countries.
Iraq: why wouldn't you be concerned about 13? It is still very young, and the girl is only in year 7 or 8, don't you think its too young for her to fall pregnant and go under child labor?
Nepal: When I said men are custodians of women, I meant they should protect them in a kind and loving way; not in a way where her freedom and education is taken away and her whole life is controlled by a man, NO! That's not protection, that's imprisonment.
Turkey: Well what you said here is true I can't deny, but it can happen and I'm not only talking about Turkey but other places too.
Afghanistan: That story only happened 2-3 years ago so its not that long ago. So women who marry very young and get beaten up by their husbands and face troubles and hardships, and depression, and you're telling me its no one's fault?
Mali: Your point here is good so can't refute.

Anyways, this world is corrupt and it gets worse and worse every year. Nothing is going to change even if you and other people say it should, it won't. As I've said before, feminism is the advocacy of women's rights on the ground of the equality of sexes, so women want to be as equal as men. Yes many women can be crazy and it has gone too far, but the main reason why feminism has increased a lot is because of the incidents that I've mentioned before and many more. Whether feminism should die out or not, it's not gonna change anything, and either way it seems most likely nothing will ever change. Physical violence and abuse against women is a common thing you can't deny that.
Debate Round No. 4
Minddagger

Pro

The fact that feminist's want equality died in 2016, now, selfish women who only want superiority call themselves feminists, the where are the women who do want equality you ask? They are called egalitarians, and its not just women, they have men too,

physical violence against men happens too you know, in fact, the women abuses children of 50-70%, don't believe me? Here's proof right here:

http://www.thelizlibrary.org...

I'm not showing this to make women look bad, I just showed this to let you know that women aren't perfect either sometimes women are victims, and sometimes men are victims, but what I see in all of these is sometimes humans are victims, and the gender wage gap is growing, why? Because of feminists

and I will say for one last time, a true women fighting for equality is an egalitarian.
Maryam_mosawy

Con

So far in this whole debate, you haven't given me any proof that men also get physically abused by women, yet I gave you a couple of incidents and examples about what happened to certain women and the difficulties they face. Yes I know that physical violence can happen to anyone regardless of gender, even children can face abuse from the woman and the man. And thankyou for that website, and yes I can't deny that since the proof is there.
So are you saying that men do not want superiority too? Do you think it was fair back then women were treated unequally. Now because of the rise of feminism, yes things have definitely improved, but there still is gender gaps worldwide and you can't refute.
Before feminism even arose, women were still being treated unequally and still are in some countries, so saying that feminism should be put to an end isn't really gonna make any difference whatsoever.
And egalitarian basically means a trend of thought that favors equality for all people. Feminism falls under egalitarianism , and it isn't just a trend of thought, it is a social movement. Women obviously are going to take action because they had enough being treated as housemaids and cooks, and facing violence;
And by the way, if women made a movement to stand up for themselves, why haven't men if you're saying that they also face hardships too? Why is it just the women? It's because they don't face hardships as much as women, so they don't complain as much.

Thanks for the debate.
Debate Round No. 5
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by Balance42 6 days ago
Balance42
feminism
G2;fɛm=8;n=8;z(ə)m/Submit
noun
the advocacy of women's rights on the ground of the equality of the sexes.

This is feminism, plain and simple. I can see others who call themselves feminists but really are not and push false ideals but this doesn't change what feminism is.
It is undeniable that women have long been undermined and therefore the emphasis should be placed on equalising women's rights (I'm a male by the way) as women should have equal rights and for some reason people interpret this as ignoring males rights (for example for men to be feminine) though many feminists may not want men to have the same rights as women (socially at least) that doesn't distract from the ideology of improving and equalising women's rights.
Posted by brian1603 1 week ago
brian1603
.......
What a debate..
Posted by Minddagger 1 week ago
Minddagger
thank you for accepting my debate challenge, and i would like to apologise for the angry introduction
No votes have been placed for this debate.