The Instigator
Amphia
Con (against)
The Contender
stephannoi
Pro (for)

Feminism is harmful to society

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Debate Round Forfeited
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/12/2018 Category: Politics
Updated: 1 week ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 187 times Debate No: 107982
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (3)
Votes (0)

 

Amphia

Con

Round 1 is acceptance only--no arguments.
FIGHT ME.
stephannoi

Pro

Hi thanks for challenging me to a debate. Anyway I want to argue that i disagree with most of feminism ideologies. Feminism is very harmful to society because they hate men. Men do not benefit from feminism.
Debate Round No. 1
Amphia

Con

Thank you for accepting this debate. Also, I said no arguments made in R1 but that's okay. You didn't get too into detail so it's fine.

I highlight the following arguments:
1. Feminism is still relevant in today's society
2. Feminism is good for women AND men

I would appreciate if my opponent also highlighted their arguments in a similar fashion to make rebutting easier (for the both of us).

1. Feminism is still relevant
Often, people say that while feminism was a great movement in the past, it is no longer relevant as we have achieved equality or the nearest to it possible. However, this common misconception is highly worrying as the work of feminists is not done! Yes, women can vote. Yes, women can run companies. Yes, women can wear pants. But that doesn't mean we have total equality. Third wave feminism's goal is to also being attacking the smaller, less obvious aspects of patriarchy in society.

For example, gender roles and male domination. These two go hand in hand. Have you noticed that there are far more male politicians and executives than women? You might say this is simply because women choose not to enter these jobs but it's important to understand why. Gender roles have a much larger influence on society than people want to believe. On birthdays, we give our girls babies to take care of and dolls to dress up while we give boys dinosaurs and action figures. We teach girls that they are nurturers and boys that they are action-takers. Not to say playing with dolls or action figures is inherently bad but the problem is when we reinforce stereotypes with small things like that. It fuels the machine that is patriarchy.

It is important to also note that patriarchy is a reinforcement of other types of oppression. It contributes to contributes to racism, sizeism,, and homophobia. Imagine a poor black woman. She already has to deal with economic-based oppression, racism and now patriarchy is weighing on her too? Don't let the name fool you. Feminism may have started out as a way to allow white women their rights (it originally did not include black women and obviously not the LGBTQ community) but it has grown to fight for a much larger group of people than that.

Also, while, in the US, our patriarchy is more subtle in certain aspects, think about other countries where they haven't made nearly as much progress. Think of Saudi Arabia where women not too long ago got the right to drive legally. Think about a basic think like driving! And even then, they still are under the guardianship system. Or imagine places like Nigeria where the terrorist group, Boko Haram, runs around raping young girls and women because "You rape the women and you kill the men.". Or how about India where every year 250-300 acid attacks occur. Sometimes on women who simply rejected a man's advances. You can't tell me patriarchy is over.
https://www.usatoday.com...

2. Feminism is good for women AND men
As I said before, patriarchy affects women greatly. And feminism is fighting this. However, the Pro mentioned the following earlier which ties in great with my second argument: "Feminism is very harmful to society because they hate men. Men do not benefit from feminism." For one, feminists do not hate men. It is only radicals who have twisted the true essence of feminism to fit their own incorrect beliefs. Do not generalize, that is like me saying all white people are racist because the KKK is racist. That's absurd and untrue. And second, feminism benefits men as well as women. Listen, I think you'll agree:

This is an excerpt from an article (link below).

"Expression
"Man up." "Quit being a b*tch." "Why don't you grow a pair?"
Our society has set up a standard of what masculinity should be...Men face pressure daily to act and speak in a certain "manly" way, in order to avoid being teased for not being man enough...a lot of us find ourselves in a situation where we feel need to hide the way we feel in order to maintain any respect as men...But feminists have been on our side, advocating for our society that everybody is entitled to express how they're feeling, including men.

Custody Hearings
Custody hearings are infamous for sexism towards men. Many times, the courtroom will buy into the nurturing mother stereotype without paying attention to who would actually be fit to have custody of the child. This is bad not just for us, but for the children who might end up in a bad home. Feminists have and will continue to stand up for fair treatment in the courtroom for both genders.

Domestic Abuse
...we also need to be reminded that domestic abuse against men also exists and it's more common than people think. One in seven men in the United States will suffer from some form of domestic abuse in their lifetimes. But sometimes they're afraid to speak out because they fear that they'll be viewed as weak.

Sexual Assault
It took until 2012 for the FBI to acknowledge that men can also be raped. Until then, they couldn't call it that... Some women can overpower their male victim, others could spike their drinks, and many male victims' assaults can involve another male offender...The new acknowledgement was a step in the right direction for gender equality.

Self Image
Catalogs, magazines, movies and fashion shows, many people are aware of the unrealistic expectations that countless industries set for girls...Fitness industry profits have reached record levels. A big reason for this is because expectations that are being shoved in women's faces, are also being shoved in our faces. Calvin Klein, Hollister and countless other companies surround their stores with portraits of these great looking guys surrounded with women just gazing at their bodies, which forces some guys to become self conscious about the way they look. Fitness and supplement companies use huge athletes and models, many of them on performance enhancing drugs, to portray an unrealistic expectation of what the product does.

Career Pursuits
My philosophy is that if you love something, you should pursue it. It doesn't matter what the salary is, and it definitely doesn't matter what your gender is. Men deserve to have the opportunities to pursue whatever career they desire without being judged for it, even the ones that have been stereotyped as feminine such as modeling and nursing. The workplace as a whole will operate better if we judge everyone based on performance, not gender. And that's what feminism is aiming for.

Feminism isn't just for women... It isn't about bringing one gender down to reach equality...It's about lifting one another up, when there's any form of oppression or unfair treatment. Unfortunately, feminism has gotten a bad reputation due to its message being at times, misinterpreted as anti male."
https://www.theodysseyonline.com...

I would argue that feminism has grown to benefit more people than it did when it was originally started. Suffragettes were white women who were trying to guarantee their own vote. Not to hate on them, I am just saying they were not thinking of civil rights or LGBTQ rights during their protests. And men's rights certainly were not one of their priorities. But now, feminism has grown to encompass all of those people. Feminists are fighting for equality for women, men, the LGBTQ community, people of color, etc.

Here is a point I will close out on:

"...one other important point to remember is, as described on the Daily Kos, "patriarchy is generally not an explicit ongoing effort by men to dominate women. It is a long-standing system that we are born into and participate in, mostly unconsciously.""

https://organizingchange.org...

Feminists do not hate men, and they understand that we are attacking the system (patriarchy) not the people (men and even women who sometimes buy into patriarchy). We just want equality.
stephannoi

Pro

Yes because I want to tell you that men are much more likely to face discrimination than women

1. They represent most of homeless population
2. They are more likely to commit suicide
3. They have fight and die for war
4.they are over represented in dangerous work occupations
5. They had little to no protection against domestic violence
6. They get longer prison sentence

And what did feminism do ? Nothing. MEN Do Not Benefit anything from them.
Debate Round No. 2
Amphia

Con

"Yes because I want to tell you that men are much more likely to face discrimination than women"
This statement is completely untrue. Men do face discrimination but certainly not more than women!

"1. They represent most of homeless population"
How does this connect to feminism being harmful to society or not?? Please explain further.

2. They are more likely to commit suicide
This is true but I don't see how this connects to feminism not helping men. While we all advocate for suicide prevention, I researched into this fact and there was no link to feminism...

3. They have fight and die for war
Women also have fight (and sometimes do die) in war. If you are talking about the draft, I agree that forcing only men to be conscripted is unfair. It comes from an old-fashioned view that war is only for men as women are "weak". However, as I said earlier, feminism is fighting to erase these absurd mentalities and create equality.

4.they are over represented in dangerous work occupations
This comes from the belief that men are supposed to do the hard work. While men are generally 15-20 percent larger than women (https://abcnews.go.com...) this doesn't mean women can't do hard (sometimes dangerous) work. I talked about how these stereotypes are unfair and as always, feminism is working to stop this thinking.

5. They had little to no protection against domestic violence
I already addressed this in Round 2.

6. They get longer prison sentence"
Again, I know. Read above.

"And what did feminism do ? Nothing. MEN Do Not Benefit anything from them."
I have already proven how feminism benefits men.

Please read my arguments next time so you can rebut them more effectively.
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Debate Round No. 3
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Debate Round No. 4
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by Amphia 1 week ago
Amphia
@MrMaw

Interesting point about suicide.
Also, I understand that men deal with gender roles. I said that numerous times. I also said that this is unfair. We need to stop putting people in boxes. Men can be stay-at-home dads and women can be the providers of the house.

You said you have never seen women fighting for men.Feminists argue for the erasing of stereotypes that oppress people. Including men. At many feminist marches, people can be seen carrying signs in support of men doing what they want to do. Just watch one. Have you also seen the huge push in the media (social included) that we need to stop telling boys things like "man up"? I wish I could show a picture of an example. The work of feminism is leading to a more progressive society that accepts boys can cry and be nurses if they like.

I know men have self-image problems...I addressed that. I said this is unfair.
Posted by MrMaw 1 week ago
MrMaw
The following non-aggressive argument is meant to counter your round 2 argument

Gender roles aren't only a woman's issue. I feel like people ignore this. Men are supposed to sacrifice be the providers. They are expected to work all day and provide for themselves, the wife and the kids. Woman give birth which makes them more important than men. At least that's what we think is true. This forces us to put pressure on our self to become providers which doesn't turn out great, because we start thinking we are worthless and can't provide. Which leads to the high suicide rates.

While feminists claim to be fighting for men, they aren't. They say they are but actions speak louder than words. I have never seen feminists rallying or marching for anything concerning men.

Going to your self image, men have that too you know? We are expected to be rich with a good car and 6 pack abs and a full set of hair and be six foot tall. Also our life is seen as disposable and in movies men are seen sacrificing their lives and saving everyone.
Posted by JacksonJ 1 week ago
JacksonJ
Generalizations are dangerous. The pro needs to understand that not all feminists are radical.
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