The Instigator
Swag_Overlord
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
AbnerGrimm
Con (against)
Winning
17 Points

Formal Education does not equal success in later life.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 4 votes the winner is...
AbnerGrimm
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/10/2013 Category: Education
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 6,078 times Debate No: 33556
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (2)
Votes (4)

 

Swag_Overlord

Pro

Hi All,
I have to write an essay in favour of this debate motion, and would appreciate it if a respectful and well-informed member of this website would take part in this debate (and probably destroy my arguments). The first round will be used just for acceptance.
AbnerGrimm

Con

I'd like to say thank you to Swag_Overlord for starting this debate. I accept and would be delighted in arguing for formal education. I will sick back and wait for my opponent to present his argument. I send it back to Pro.

Debate Round No. 1
Swag_Overlord

Pro

Although there is no doubt that formal education provides a "groundwork" for students (time management, business models), it does not encourage the things that lead to success: "out of the box" thinking and following one's passions.
Some of the most successful people in the world today such as Mark Zuckerberg and Bill Gates did not complete formal education (School and an Undergraduate degree), but instead pursued their own personal ideas. Formal Education teaches you to permanently work under the influence of a "teacher", presuming this will prepare you for working for a boss in later life. This is a huge issue with formal education, as obviously not everyone is suited to working under a boss in an organisation, and this system would indeed cause many people to have an unhappy career, but formal education naturally pushes everybody who completes it in the direction of working within a corporation under a boss because of the learning structure within classrooms.
AbnerGrimm

Con

Thank you for your opening argument Pro. I have to say Pro is right on some of his stances. A person will not necessarily become successful in life just because they have a formal education. Some people do have ambitions that push them to become successful regardless if they have a formal education or not. I think we can find this fact in just about every type of genre you choose. Some people succeed and some people don't. We must weigh in laziness and motivation. I do not think this argument is the one I need to address to show that formal education does lead to success. I will offer two contentions of my own while also remarking on Pros argument.


Advantages of education


Formal education is central to the development of a nation. It is only through a formal system of learning that any country can develop a knowledgeable society and achieve societal goals. Governments have become involved in efforts to formalize a system that would equip citizens with basic functional skills to become capable members of society. http://www.moneyinstructor.com...


Most who have a degree are people that are successful. Almost all professions today require some sort of formal education. You need a degree to be granted in most work forces and it has become harder to find work and receive full time work because lack of education. So speaking in terms of chances for success a formal education would be essential. My opponent mentioned that a few people have went out and found success without formal educations but that is rare as we can see.


We have the need for education to keep up in our own field of work. Technology today is rapidly increasing and as so we must learn more. It is so much harder to get a oppurtunity for a job without a education now. Having a degree can improve your chances of getting employed. Though a degree cannot guarantee success, it improves chances of getting hired.


Economic growth


High rates of education are essential for countries to be able to achieve high levels of economic growth, says Eric A. Hanushek in his 2005 book (Economic outcomes and school quality), for the International Institute for Educational Planning.


Empirical analyses support the prediction that poor countries should grow faster than rich countries because they can adopt cutting edge technologies already tried and tested by rich countries. This requires managers and engineers who are able to operate machines or production practices from a teacher in order to learn. Therefore, a country's ability to learn from the leader is a function of its stock in capital. http://economics.mit.edu...


Recent study of the determinants of aggregate economic growth have stressed the importance of fundamental economic institutions and the role of cognitive skills. Earnings are related to schooling and other human capital of the individual. http://en.wikipedia.org...


I think I have shown that even though a rare few find success without formal education it should not be formal practice. The majority of people who have formal education find the best jobs and top pay. They also are quicker to find work and usually have job opportunities right out of college. The few people who are not successful with formal education are because of some fault of their own. Formal education does not hurt and since we are discussing a whole body of people instead specific ones we must agree that formal education leads to success as much as any other reason.


I send it back to Pro.

Debate Round No. 2
Swag_Overlord

Pro

Thank you to the Con for his well-researched and thought provoking points. However, the Pro cannot help feeling that the Con sees the debate motion in a very different manner to the Pro. It appears that the Con's arguments revolve mainly around the fact that Formal Education is necessary for economic stability and employment. Without wanting to offend the Con, this seems to tell the Pro that my opponent is a part of the society we live in which convinces us that "success" is a steady job and teaches us to learn to work in a hierarchical system.

In the Pro's opinion, Formal Education does not cater to a high percentage of human beings. Seeing that the average IQ is between 90 and 110 points (brainmetrix.com), which is undoubtedly not a high level of intelligence, it goes to show that the majority of students are pushed towards jobs in an economic sector that makes it impossible to rise higher because of their intelligence.

Seeing that the majority of people with lower intelligence quotients do not shine in Formal Education systems, all the Pro is arguing is the Formal Education does not lead to success. It may be necessary for Economical and Social reasons, but Formal Education is geared towards those with higher IQ's and does not cater to the needs of a person of more average intelligence.

Thank you once again to the Con for his arguments and I send it back to him.

Sources used:
http://www.studymode.com...

http://www.wordexplorer.com...
AbnerGrimm

Con

Thank Pro for your last round.


Economic growth


Pro assesses that I am presenting Formal Education as necessary for economic stability and employment. Pro is right and this can lead everyone to success, no matter what job or function they perform. Pro has basically conceded most of this argument.


Advantages of education


Pro is incorrect in assuming I am limiting education to just college or school. People can read and learn on their own but a formal education gives you the greatest chance of success. A steady job or pay is always considered a success. This gives one the ability to further themselves and also their family.


Improvements in IQ are remarkably consistent across the whole spectrum. This effect of an apparent increase in IQ has also been observed in various other parts of the world, though the rates of increase vary. http://eyeonsociety.co.uk... IQ tests are scored with respect to those standardization samples. The only way to compare the difficulty of two versions of a test is to conduct a study in which the same subjects take both versions. Doing so confirms IQ gains over time. The average rate of increase seems to be about three IQ points per decade in the U.S. on tests such as the WISC. http://en.wikipedia.org...


My opponents tests do not mention the previous levels of IQ. Therefore, his test leaves out that peoples IQ were lower previously to the results of the test he gave us. He also asserts that it is impossible to rise higher in IQ or intelligence. Pro does not even show us the importance of IQ. We have schools and classes for those with less intelligence or slower learning.


I have shown the majority of people who have formal education have a increase in IQ. Pro drops my economic argument and concedes points to the advantages of Formal Education. The only point Pro makes is the one about students who cannot keep up in school, which is addressed with certain schools or classes especially for these students. This point fails by the lack of evidence. I think I have provided most of the evidence in this debate and Pro has the burden of proof.


I send it back to Pro.

Debate Round No. 3
Swag_Overlord

Pro

Swag_Overlord forfeited this round.
AbnerGrimm

Con

Pro forfeits. I have shown that a person will not necessarily be successful just because they have a education. Because people can have ambitions that push them to success. Only through a formal system of learning can a country can develop a society and achieve goals. It is so harder to get a oppurtunity for a job without a formal education. Economic growth are the importance of fundamental cognitive skills. I have shown the majority of people who have formal education have a increase in IQ. I thank the readers and Pro. Please vote Con.

Debate Round No. 4
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by Swag_Overlord 4 years ago
Swag_Overlord
Lexi_Novak I am aware of this. I simply must write an essay arguing this motion is the case and having researched thouroughly, it actually becomes apparent that formal education does not equal sucess necessarily.
Posted by LexiNovak 4 years ago
LexiNovak
Yes it does. It's a fact that more students go pass high school and collage earn more money and you get farther in life.
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by Fruitytree 4 years ago
Fruitytree
Swag_OverlordAbnerGrimmTied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: The Arguments Con made seem to be more convincing given how our society functions nowadays.
Vote Placed by CriticalThinkingMachine 4 years ago
CriticalThinkingMachine
Swag_OverlordAbnerGrimmTied
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Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: This debate wasn't really formulated properly. Was the resolution that formal education does not necessarily equal success in life? If so, then Con's arguments did not address the resolution, since he argued about generalities. The issue of whether the successes are intrinsically tied to formal education or only contingently tied to it was not brought up by either side, and each side seemed to talking about a different subject. But because Pro forfeited, I must give arguments to Con. And Con used several sources as well, so sources to him too. And forfeiting without providing a reason is rude, so Con gets conduct points as well.
Vote Placed by 1Devilsadvocate 4 years ago
1Devilsadvocate
Swag_OverlordAbnerGrimmTied
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Reasons for voting decision: F.F.
Vote Placed by TheHitchslap 4 years ago
TheHitchslap
Swag_OverlordAbnerGrimmTied
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Reasons for voting decision: conduct and arguments due to Pro's forfeit