Gaming should be taken more seriously and be considered a real sport.
Debate Rounds (3)
For a short time, I decided to try and learn to play the piano. Within a month or so, I could play Fur Elise. I wasn't amazing and I made mistakes, but the point is that I managed to learn how to play the piano and got better overtime. That's because I spent the time and dedication that was required in order to get better at it. Gaming is the same. Sure, you can learn to play a game pretty easily, but you need to practice and spend time on it to get better. I can still know how to play the piano now, but that doesn't mean I'm good at it. Quite frankly, I'm terrible, but not because I play games, simply because I just didn't have the passion to become a pianist. It wasn't something I ever really got into and thus I just stopped.
What I'm trying to say is that you can learn how to do something, or play something, but that doesn't automatically make you good at it. I do want to refrain from insults here, but to be honest, you have to be quite stupid to believe that just because you can easily learn to play some games, that there is no skill in playing them. I may as well say the same thing for a lot of sports. Take discuss for example. All you have to do is throw a disk. Yes, there's a technique behind it, but the general concept is very basic: Throw a disk as far as you can. However, any athlete who does discuss will easily beat you by far because they practice, fine tune their skills and get better.
Before you bring up the point of there being no physical skill needed, read this. Whilst this may be true, that does not mean you don't have to be fit. You need to have a healthy body if you want to play professionally, or well at all to be honest, because if you are overweight, you are going to get hot and tired faster than someone who is fit and has a healthy body. This slows your reaction times and leads to bad decision making, which is very detrimental to your performance in a game, especially at a professional level. E-Sports players cannot afford slower reaction times than their opponents, or bad decision making, as even a micro-second can make the difference, and a bad decision can lead to a significant loss. If you have a healthy body, you are going to be much more able to stay awake and alert and thus make better choices and have the fastest reaction times possible.
Firstly I will address my opponents comments on piano compared with video games. My opponent says that just because a pianist can play a video game does not mean that it takes no skill. Then my opponent brings up the fact that he/she learned the piece Fur Elise in a month to prove that gaming takes as much skill as piano. To that I say "I'm highly doubtful." How did you know where the keys were? Did you actually have the grade seven book in front of you? Do you even know what a staccato is? Did you use the pedal? Because unless you have a pitch perfect ear you probably were practicing piano for many years before that. Or you were doing the annoying thing that most non piano players do when they play one note at a time and play the same phrase over and over and over again. Either way learning Fur Elise had to come with years of practise or you were doing it with the one note beginner style. Anyways, most voters will not be impressed that you can supposedly play that song. We all know how annoying it is when beginners plink on a piano and play the exact same melody over again.
So when my opponent says put a pianist in front of a video game like Dark Souls and watch him fail, that's not exactly a fair comparison. How about, put a pianist who's played all the other Dark Soul games in front of the new one. Then we'll see if he's failed or not. I too could say that I am a very good player at Star Wars Battlefront. In under a month I got to rank sixty and I usually get around forty to fifty kills every round. I learned that in under a month and am usually the best in every round. Being a top pianist takes a lot more than just a month. I'd like to see a gamer try and perform for thousands on a piano.
So what my opponent is claiming is that piano and gaming takes the same skill. This is obviously very far fetched and wrong. Here's why, like I said before, I am usually one of the best in every round of Battle Front and that was under a month. Now lets see how long it takes to be the best at piano. Unless your a musical prodigy it should take you about seven or eight years to get to grade eight piano unless your rushing, six years from grade eight to ten unless your rushing and then another two or more years to pass your ARCT. Then you actually have to compete to stick out from all the other pianists. So far compared to a month that's 15 years and up to become the best at at piano. And why is that? Because it takes actual skill to become the best. In every real sport it takes skill to become the best let alone good at it. I said in my other debate, video games are the lazy version of sports. They make everything ridiculously easy.
Then my opponent goes on to say that professional gamers have lighting fast reaction skills. So how is clicking a mouse or flicking a joystick a lighting fast reaction? I'm always a bit confused when gamers claim they had "lighting fast reactions" or that they have "mad skills" when they play video games. Here's why, to return an 120 mph serve from a tennis pro you have to lunge you body across the court in less than half a second. You also in less than half a second have to angle your racket so that the ball will go where you want it to go. You also actually have to hit the ball too. All those have to happen in under half a second. Now for video game tennis, you have to press the a button to serve then you flick your joystick left or right to return the serve. All the while, all you're doing is sitting on a chair or couch. So do these professional gamers have "lighting fast reactions"? Because compared to a real sport, gamers reactions are absolutely laughable.
Skill is lost in gaming. Do you actually memorize all the plays in Madden 16? Or do you just let the coach pick. Do you even do any playmaking in any of the sports games? Probably not. For first person shooter (FPS) games do you use aim assist? Do you use the little dot in the middle of your screen to aim because if you do, that's not skill. How is mashing buttons as fast as you can to beat up your opponent the same as being a master in karate or judo? Most gamers pride themselves as being amazingly skillful at their game when in reality, they don't have any skill. Gaming is a cheat on sports. It takes sports and drags them down to the skill level of gaming. And what is that skill level? Zero.
Anyways, how do you apply button mashing as a skill? Do you put it on your resume? I doubt it, and why is that? Because video games skills do not help you in real life. You can put down that you play sports on a resume, you can put down that you play piano on your resume but putting down that you play video games is actually quite laughable. The fact that literally nobody in real life would count video gaming as a skill should be enough to prove that video games takes little to no skill.
I already know that learning to play something does not make you the best at it. I play sports and musical instruments. But gamers have this misconception that just because they play a video game really well that they are at the same level as a real sports player. Also training to be fit does not mean that gaming actually has physical exertion in it. Just because I run everyday does not mean that I am sports pianist. I am a sports person because I play a sport that actually requires physical exertion.
I too could tell my opponent from personal experience that video gaming takes no skill. Out of piano, sports and video gaming, video gaming is the only one that I find extremely easy. Video games a based on luck as many people know. Sports are not and nor is piano. "Just make a pianist play Dark Souls, and they will fail miserably." Just make a gamer play Star Wars Fantasy Suite by Jarrod Radnich.
The music is at Musicnotes.com , I doubt any gamer with no prior knowledge of piano would get past the first page in under a month. They would certainly "fail miserably".
You imply that button mashing is all it takes to play video games, and I ask you, how many competitive matches of CS:GO have you played? That is just one example of a game where button mashing will get you no where. You need to react fast in order to stay alive and win. When someone comes round a corner unexpectedly and neither party expects the other to be there, the one who reacts to the situation first with accurate shooting (which requires skill to control the recoil and spray pattern which I will get onto in a second) is going to win that fire fight. If I pit you against some of the worlds best players in CS:GO, you would be defeated very quickly, because they are much more skilled at it than you. They can react faster meaning that if they are using an AWP (sniper rifle) for example, and you pass a narrow gap, they posses the reflexes to aim at you and kill you before you can cross that gap. If we put you in the exact same situation, you would not poses the reflexes nor the skill to accurately kill the other person before they manage to pass the gap. Players can move quite fast in CS:GO, meaning you have to react/respond quickly to take them out in situations like that.
As a side note, when I say I had learnt Fur Elise in a month, I meant that I had learnt what keys to press and when. I didn't get into grand master pianist levels, I just learnt how to press keys. I wasn't very good at it was fairly basic. I was not trying to say that it takes the same level of skill to play video games as it does playing the piano, as they are two very different things and the level of skill required cannot really be compared because being good at playing the piano and being good at playing video games are two very different things. I was merely stating that simply because you can learn how to do something without a lot of difficulty, that does not automatically mean there is no skill.
You may notice that I am using CS:GO as an example a lot here. That is because CS:GO is a "hardcore" kind of game. What are hardcore games? Well, there are two kinds of games. You have casual games such as Star Wars Battlefront is an example of a casual game that is fun to play when you have nothing else to do. Casual games are quite easy and don't require much level of skill to play due to the low difficulty. They tend to offer very noob friendly mechanics and don't punish the user for mistakes too harshly. Hardcore games on the other hand such as Dark Souls, or CS:GO offer a more challenging game play experience and punish the player for making mistakes. CS:GO is a game where you need to have more than a few brain cells to do well. It requires the user to have good knowledge of it's maps, at least some knowledge of weapon spray patterns so that 3/4 of your shots don't just hit the wall behind the other person, and even tactics to an extent, such as knowing when and how to use grenades to gain an advantage, or knowing where to flank.
Is it not true that to Snooker, at it's most basic, which I'll remind you is considered a sport, you just hit a ball into some other balls? Is it not true that there is no physical exertion in Snooker, unless you count walking around a little bit physical exertion? Could I not then say that Snooker requires no skill and should not be considered a sport? No, I could not say that because there is much more to Snooker than hitting a ball into other balls. You need to be able to predict ball movement, know how certain spin will affect the movement and, to an extent, even have good knowledge of angles and basic addition. See, I only looked at Snooker at it's most basic form, just as how you are looking at video games in it's most basic form. There is much more to gaming than merely pressing a few buttons. There is a lot more than that goes on in some players heads, especially professional players. I myself find myself thinking about tactics when playing Battlefield. I think about potential flanks, I think about how best to deal with the armada of snipers camping on the other side of the map, I think about many things when I start to get serious with it. Even going as far as to spend quite a bit of time finding out what the best attachments are for my gun to make it perform at peak performance and picking the right camos for the map, even though it doesn't really matter. When playing CS:GO, you have to think about a lot of these, and more. There's a lot more to these games than you realise because you are just looking at the surface and using a casual game as an example of games requiring no skill because casual games rarely require much, if any skill.
Much like there is a massive difference between a professional Snooker player like Ronnie O'Sullivan and that fat bloke who's always playing pool down at the pub, there is a massive difference between casual games and hardcore games, including their respective playerbases.
You need to look beyond the surface, see through the stereotypes and misconceptions about gaming and gamers, and realise that there really is a lot more to it than simple button mashing. Take Megaman for example. It's a very old game, but it does require a decent level of skill to play. There is an easter egg where you can use the Hadouken. However, it requires you to complete the entire game without getting hit once. Whilst you can take a pianist, give them Megaman and they can probably complete it after a while, I highly doubt that they will ever unlock the Hadouken in under a year. Very few people have managed to unlock it because this is challenge is very hard and requires a very high level of skill, much like how playing much like how it is very hard to play Traced Overhead on the piano. Don't take it the wrong way - I am not saying that video games require the same skill as playing the piano here, it is merely an example to try and get you to understand that gaming can be very challenging and can require a lot of skill.
My opponent then asks me a question. "You imply that button mashing is all it takes to play video games, and I ask you, how many competitive matches of CS:GO have you played?" Well isn't button mashing exactly what it takes to play a video game? Or do you not press the buttons on your mouse or controller? You probably see my logic now. Button mashing is all it takes to play a video game otherwise your game wouldn't work.
Now I will pose a question to my opponent. How many games of competitive rugby have you played? If you have played rugby then you must realize that button mashing is a whole lot more easier than actual real rugby. In rugby you need to react fast or else you will be shoved into the dirt every time you get the ball. And by react, I mean actually reacting with your whole body. Not just by pulling a trigger that's been conveniently placed on your controller. If I pit you against a team of professional rugby players, you would be killed literally. (Unless your 6.5 tall and 350 pound, not in fat but in muscle)
The skill that professional CSGO players have is quite laughable. Let see them do it in real life where they actually have to hold a gun, they actually have to hit a moving target, they actually have to reload their gun all the while trying not to get killed in real life. Now lets see the professional rugby players sitting down to a game of rugby on video games. They could easily learn how to play in under a minute. See the difference between real sports and video games. Like I said before video games bring the skill level of sports down.
As a side note, try not to exaggerate something that you didn't actually do. It's not fair in debates like these.
Then my opponent goes on to explain how CSGO has strategy. I laugh at that. Do you really study your opponent to know what move he'll make? Do you use three pronged attacks to take down an enemy unit? Do you set up ambushes that the enemy will walk into? War related video games take out the strategy in war. Do you really examine the game as being like a chess board? Do you make moves thinking five steps ahead? I thought that like my opponent said before that video games were suppose to be fun. My opponent explains why CSGO has strategy but the examples are very vague.
Then my opponent says that snooker is a sport. To that I say, yes so what? Then my opponent claims that I am not looking deep enough into video games and that they are more than just mashing buttons. Then he goes off to explain all the features of CSGO. Yes I too could say that I go to lengths to get the perfect golf driver. I too could say that I've had them all tailored to my size. I have studied golf balls and aero dynamics and have perfected how many grooves a golf ball should have. I too could say that I study the golf course to know which way to hit the ball. I too could say that I study wind patterns everyday when I train to know how they effect my swing. I practice my swing everyday until it is perfected, etc. I know how deep I have to look. And I know that some video games are very amazing with such detailed story lines but FPS are not exactly deep. The truth is does my opponent now how deep to look in sports? It is not sports that are trying to qualify as sports, its video games.
The problem with stereotypes is that for the majority, its true. Otherwise they wouldn't exist. Just like the stereotype, Asians are good at math. I understand that games can be challenging. I play them myself. What I don't understand is how pressing buttons can be considered skillful. A piano is technically pressing buttons but your using all your fingers and playing piano required musical knowledge and actual skill. The buttons on a controller are placed conveniently for the users hand and usually you aren't pressing ten buttons all at the same time over and over in different positions like you are in piano. Not are you pressing them as fast as you would on a piano. I appreciate gaming and all but I don't think that it should be considered a sport.
The reason I have such disdain is because gaming is the lazy version of sports. Imagine your in a class with the same lazy person for your whole life. You work your butt off to stand out and do well while the lazy person does nothing. You both end up with the same job because suddenly the curriculum changed and now grades and doing well doesn't matter anymore. How would you feel towards that person? This is the exact same as I feel towards video games being a sport. There is nothing physical about sitting on a couch or chair pressing buttons while your eyes are glued to a screen. It's insulting to say that, that's the same as waking up early in the morning to go on a mile long run and then to practice your butt off until you feel dead with exhaustion to be a pro at your sport. Video games just cheat the whole system of a sport.
Button mashing isn't all it takes to play a video game. I do see your logic and your reasoning, but it is very flawed. Button mashing would be just that - mashing all the buttons with no thought or clear purpose. Maybe there's a quick time event that requires you to mash a certain button, but if you went into a competitive match of CS:GO and simply mashed all the buttons when you saw someone, you would die very quickly. As I stated previously, the definition of skill is being good at something, and the kind skill required to play CS:GO and to play Golf are quite different. In CS:GO, you need to react faster than your opponent and have the skill to be accurate enough to land most of your shots on their body and kill them before they can kill you. You need to know how grenades will bounce of off surfaces so you know the best angles at which the throw them. You need to know how to counter each weapon in the game so as to minimise the chances of getting killed by them. In Golf, you need to know wind patterns, you need to know the right pitch at which to hit the ball, and many other things that again, I do not know. My point here is that pressing the right things at the right time is very different to button mashing which will get you nowhere.
I have never played rugby before as, again, it is not something I particularly enjoy, be it real life or video game. However, I do understand that playing rugby in real life is a lot harder than playing rugby on a video game, however every rugby game out there is a casual game meant for fun, so it is not going to be very hard. If a rugby game was made targeting the hardcore gamers, it would include mechanics to suit that and button mashing would be out of the equation. It would be hard and it would need skill. You would have to know what buttons to press and when, and it would punish you for making a mistake, just like real rugby would.
You go on to say that the skill CS:GO players is laughable. Well, let me ask you a question: How many competitive matches of CS:GO have you played? Just like how you said that if you were to pit me against professional rugby players, I wouldn't stand a chance, the same is true for you. You simply would not stand a chance because yes, you can learn how to play quickly (the whole point of tutorials), but that doesn't mean you can compete against Fnatic or other professional teams. These are people that know the ins and outs of the game and know just what to do, when to do it, and how to do it to near perfection. Yes, you could sit down some rugby players and they'll learn how to play in a minute (again, the whole point of tutorials), but if you gave CS:GO players and a gun and told them to shoot a target, they would learn pretty quickly how to control the gun and hit the target because they are much smarter than you give them credit for.
I used the example of Snooker to try and tell you that you need to look beyond the surface because Snooker is something I know and love and so I can talk about confidently and know about I'm talking about, and it's a real life example of a sport that if you look at it just on the surface (like what you're doing with video games) it's very basic and technically shouldn't be a sport, but when you look at all the different aspects and requirements, you can see that Snooker is actually quite complex and requires a high level of skill.
You say that you laught at the fact that I say there is strategy in CS:GO, and once again I ask you, how many times have you played CS:GO competitively, or even watch players play on YouTube? If you were to watch the right people, you would see that good players communicate and form plans. For example, you may throw a smoke and then have one person flank and wait behind enemy lines, and then either give a distraction for the person behind the smoke to rush, or wait for one or more of the enemy to go into the smoke to see what's behind there. Sometimes 3 or 4 people can be behind that smoke to ambush the people they they know are going to come through eventually. Sometimes, it could be a mere distraction so that they are focused on the smoke, thinking some people are going to rush through, only to come behind them and attack where they aren't looking. I have had cases where good communication has led to a pincer movement and won us the game because the enemies attention is split between two attacking groups.
I understand your reasoning for your disdain towards gaming, but it's simply not fair to judge gaming the way you do. You can't really compare games to real life and say there's no skill in doing x because doing y does this and that, because they are two very different things each with their own kind of skill. To compare them is to compare Star Trek to Star Wars and say which one is better. They both go about the sci-fi theme very differently. One likes to be more scientific about it, the other likes to be more fun and action filled.
If you want video gaming to be a sport then you've got to include all video games. That includes Battlefront. And as my opponent stated, Battlefront takes little to no skill. As do many video games and what is required of a sport? Skill. Therefore if video gaming as a whole cannot be a sport, then video gaming won't be sport.
Now onto button mashing. My opponent finally stops being vague about what it takes to get a video game to work. He says its pressing buttons at a specific time. So pressing buttons at a specific time qualifies to be a sport does it? Well then so does piano, and drums, and writing and texting, etc. How does pressing a button make something a sport? Because that's practically what the "sports player" is doing. There's nothing physically exerting to tapping on buttons, there's nothing in particularly skillful about tapping buttons. At least with piano and all my other examples, you get something accomplished like playing a piece, or writing a novel or sending a text. With video games, its all forgotten when you turn off the screen. In fact piano has more of a qualification than video games to become a sport. Piano is more skillful and more physically exerting than video games and we can debate that topic if you dare. Just send me a challenge and I'll tell you a million reasons why piano is more qualified than video games to be a sport.
My opponent keeps talking about video gamers getting punished if they press the wrong button. But what's their punishment? Getting killed on the screen, because that's not exactly a big deal. Making a single mistake in rugby could result with you eating the dirt literally. Making a single mistake in a long distance run could be the difference from winning the race to losing it. Making a single mistake in a figure skating competition could mean going to the hospital. Making a single mistake as a goalie could cost your team the championship. Video gamer, unless they also play a sport, do not understand what true punishment is in a real sport. To them, punishment means going back to the re-spawn point and starting again. To a real sports player, it the difference between returning that serve or losing the match. The so called punishment that video gamers get is minuscule to the punishment of not landing that spin on the ice.
Do I really have to pound in the fact that video gamers skills are laughable compared to real sports? Fine, I'll repeat what I said before. To return a 120mph tennis serve you have to lunge across the court in less than half a second. Angle your racket so that the ball doesn't go flying, balance yourself so you don't tip yourself over after you've returned it, measure how hard you'll hit it, and actually have the hand eye coordination to hit it. All that in less than half a second. A video gamer sees an opponent, pulls right trigger because most likely they have aim-assist on. A 800m sprinter has to pace himself. Notice that I said "sprint". That's right, the 800m race is actually a sprint. Running too fast at the beginning will make him lose, running to slow at the beginning will make him lose, having a terrible start will make him lose, starting too early will disqualify him. He will feel the burn in his lungs as his legs ache from exertion. A gamer will feel absolutely nothing when they get shot in the head. A gamer has absolutely no idea what pacing themselves mean. Winning can be the difference between forcing your body to the extremes or not. Winning a video game can be the difference between who can mash the A button the fastest. Being the best at a sport means training till your muscles are aching and you're dead tired. It means time and dedication spent to pushing your body to the extreme. It means time and dedication to practice flicking a puck in the upper left corner of the net from dawn till dusk until you finally perfect it. It means sacrifice and pain sometimes to be the best. Video gaming takes, sitting in a dark room with energy drinks piled around you, while you stare at a screen like a zombie 24/7. You see how easy that is? Video gaming takes relatively zero skill compared to real sports.
All because I've never played CSGO before does not mean I can't compete with Fnatic. I could easily compete against Fnatic. Now all because you've never played rugby will mean that you definitely cannot play against a professional rugby team. You would be killed literally. You see the difference? Video gaming requires no sacrifice. It requires no physical exertion. For a sport, physical exertion is required and with it comes the sacrifice of knowing you could get hurt. Like I said before, video gamers don't understand what it's like to sacrifice that net of safety to play a sport you love.
My opponent then claims that I'm not looking deep enough. The true problem is that he's not looking deep enough into sports. Sports not only involve the physical aspect, but also the mental aspect. The physical aspect includes wether or not I'm feeling my best today because that could be the difference between winning and losing it all. It includes how far should I push myself to run because training could be the difference between you and your opponent on those final 100meters. Physical aspect includes the whether, is it sunny, rainy, snowing, cold, knowing how to push through is a valuable skill. It includes analyzing my opponent, are they bigger than us and if so, how will that effect out plays. It includes being ready, always being on your toes is the difference between an ace for your opponent or a return.
The mental aspect includes whether I think I can beat them of not, the mental game is important. It includes memorizing all the plays in the playbook to counter my opponent. It includes the science behind all sports, how many grooves on a golf ball is too much. It involves intimidating the other team, the Irish rugby cheer is something my opponent should watch.
I could go on but I'd run out of room. Do video games really involve all of this? Because I doubt it. I doubt that everyone in Battlefront is playing like this yet even in casual soccer games, kids have to know if their pushing themselves too far. Video games lack the physical aspect and therefore are not even half as deep as sports are. The science behind some sports are actually somewhat astonishing. Maybe it's my opponent who isn't looking deep enough?
Then my opponent goes on to explain the "strategy" in video games. It's actually quite funny how he literally states that the so called "strategies" are actually just a bunch of random ways to kill a person by saying the word "sometimes" within his explanation. Oh, sometimes (american) football players do slants, but sometimes they also do a Hail Mary. It just depends on whether they're there or not. If football were actually like that, then yes, video games could be considered a sport. But football games aren't like that. Football games actually do have strategy and actual planned out plans. Which my opponent just so kindly provided that video games do not.
It's really not fair to compare video games to real sports is it? Then why are video games want to be real sports when they can't even compare? Yes I can judge that doing x has little skill because y does this. Each does have their own skill as my opponent has conceded. Sports having a lot and video games having very little. The fact that we are arguing whether video games should be considered a sport is why I'm not taking video gaming seriously. Like I said before, it'll be a sad day when reclining on your chair staring at a screen becomes a sport.
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