The Instigator
sque132
Pro (for)
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0 Points
The Contender
Arcanas
Con (against)
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0 Points

Gay Marriage

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/28/2015 Category: Society
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 650 times Debate No: 72488
Debate Rounds (5)
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sque132

Pro

Gay Marriage: For or Against
As an out gay man myself I find it saddening when people are against me and people in my position being able to marry like any other person.
I invite you to to debate why you believe that I should not be able to marry the man I love.

In short here are my views surrounding the debate:
1) I believe just because that your religion dictates that it is wrong, that shouldn't mean that you should be imposing those religious beliefs and therefore actions upon those who do not conform to your religion.

2) Unless you're gay it has frankly nothing to do with you. Two men or women getting married does not affect anybody in the slightest so why are you so against it.

3) My view on marriage is that it is simply an expression of love and commitment, that you will spend the rest of your life loving this person, looking after them when needed and a way of telling the world this. Why else would there be a ring but to show this to people. Children on the other hand have nothing to do with marriage. Two infertile or elderly people would be allowed to get married, so why not two gay? Vows have no mention whatsoever about children, but simply about the two people involved.

Here are some of my views, I'd love to hear some of your views also.

Thank You
Arcanas

Con

I accept, I'll let Pro make his case and I'll make my arguments in the next round.

Thank you and good luck!
Debate Round No. 1
sque132

Pro

Hi thanks for accepting (just to let you know it is my first debate on here)

Purpose of marriage in my opinion:
- an expression of consented commitment between two people to the world
- a form of protection in terms of finance, visitation rights and care
- all of course stemming from love they have to one another

I guess it comes down to what you see the purpose of marriage to be. As stated I do not regard marriage to be for the upbringing of children. If infertile and people too old to be able to create children are still allowed to marry then surely the purpose of marriage then isn't for the creation and upbringing of children. If it was they would not be allowed to marry.

Vows in marriage ceremonies never mention children so therefore children cannot be the reason for the ceremony.

Adoption, IVF, surrogacy of course exist so if you do value marriage as the purpose of child raising then it is still possible for gay couples to do this through these practices. Whether you believe children doing better with straight parents or gay is a matter of opinion. all families are uniquely different and there is no proof that two gay parents would neglect children that those of straight. If anything a gay couple would be MORE committed to the children as they have had to fight to have that child. No child of a gay couple would have been conceived by accident or forgetting/failure to make use of contraception. They would have gone to great extents and maybe even highly expensive actions of adoption or IVF.

These are my views on purpose of marriage. I would be thrilled to hear yours.
Arcanas

Con

Arcanas forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
sque132

Pro

sque132 forfeited this round.
Arcanas

Con

Arcanas forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
sque132

Pro

sque132 forfeited this round.
Arcanas

Con

Arcanas forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
sque132

Pro

sque132 forfeited this round.
Arcanas

Con

1. Children hunger for their biological parents.

Homosexual couples using in vitro fertilization (IVF) or surrogate mothers deliberately create a class of children who will live apart from their mother or father. Yale Child Study Center psychiatrist Kyle Pruett reports that children of IVF often ask their single or lesbian mothers about their fathers, asking their mothers questions like the following:"Mommy, what did you do with my daddy?" "Can I write him a letter?" "Has he ever seen me?" "Didn't you like him? Didn't he like me?" Elizabeth Marquardt reports that children of divorce often report similar feelings about their non-custodial parent, usually the father.

Kyle Pruett, Fatherneed (Broadway Books, 2001) 204.

Elizabeth Marquardt, The Moral and Spiritual Lives of Children of Divorce. Forthcoming.

2. Children need fathers.

If same-sex civil marriage becomes common, most same-sex couples with children would be lesbian couples. This would mean that we would have yet more children being raised apart from fathers. Among other things, we know that fathers excel in reducing antisocial behavior and delinquency in boys and sexual activity in girls.

What is fascinating is that fathers exercise a unique social and biological influence on their children. For instance, a recent study of father absence on girls found that girls who grew up apart from their biological father were much more likely to experience early puberty and a teen pregnancy than girls who spent their entire childhood in an intact family. This study, along with David Popenoe's work, suggests that a father's pheromones influence the biological development of his daughter, that a strong marriage provides a model for girls of what to look for in a man, and gives them the confidence to resist the sexual entreaties of their boyfriends.

* Ellis, Bruce J., et al., "Does Father Absence Place Daughters at Special Risk for Early Sexual Activity and Teenage Pregnancy?" Child Development, 74:801-821.

* David Popenoe, Life Without Father (Boston: Harvard University Press, 1999).

3. Children need mothers.

Although homosexual men are less likely to have children than lesbians, homosexual men are and will be raising children. There will be even more if homosexual civil marriage is legalized. These households deny children a mother. Among other things, mothers excel in providing children with emotional security and in reading the physical and emotional cues of infants. Obviously, they also give their daughters unique counsel as they confront the physical, emotional, and social challenges associated with puberty and adolescence. Stanford psychologist Eleanor MacCoby summarizes much of this literature in her book, The Two Sexes. See also Steven Rhoads' book, Taking Sex Differences Seriously.

Eleanor MacCoby, The Two Sexes: Growing Up Apart, Coming Together (Boston: Harvard, 1998).

Steven Rhoads, Taking Sex Differences Seriously (Encounter Books, 2004).

4. Evidence on parenting by same-sex couples is inadequate.

A number of leading professional associations have asserted that there are "no differences" between children raised by homosexuals and those raised by heterosexuals. But the research in this area is quite preliminary; most of the studies are done by advocates and most suffer from serious methodological problems. Sociologist Steven Nock of the University of Virginia, who is agnostic on the issue of same-sex civil marriage, offered this review of the literature on gay parenting as an expert witness for a Canadian court considering legalization of same-sex civil marriage:

Through this analysis I draw my conclusions that 1) all of the articles I reviewed contained at least one fatal flaw of design or execution; and 2) not a single one of those studies was conducted according to general accepted standards of scientific research.
This is not exactly the kind of social scientific evidence you would want to launch a major family experiment.

Steven Nock, affidavit to the Ontario Superior Court of Justice regarding Hedy Halpern et al. University of Virginia Sociology Department (2001).

5. Evidence suggests children raised by homosexuals are more likely to experience gender and sexual disorders.

Although the evidence on child outcomes is sketchy, it does suggest that children raised by lesbians or homosexual men are more likely to experience gender and sexual disorders. Judith Stacey-- a sociologist and an advocate for same-sex civil marriage--reviewed the literature on child outcomes and found the following: "lesbian parenting may free daughters and sons from a broad but uneven range of traditional gender prescriptions." Her conclusion here is based on studies that show that sons of lesbians are less masculine and that daughters of lesbians are more masculine.

She also found that a "significantly greater proportion of young adult children raised by lesbian mothers than those raised by heterosexual mothers ... reported having a homoerotic relationship." Stacey also observes that children of lesbians are more likely to report homoerotic attractions.

Her review must be viewed judiciously, given the methodological flaws detailed by Professor Nock in the literature as a whole. Nevertheless, theses studies give some credence to conservative concerns about the effects of homosexual parenting.

Judith Stacey and Timothy Biblarz, "(How) Does the Sexual Orientation of Parents Matter?" American Sociological Review 66: 159-183. See especially 168-171.

[1] http://www.frc.org...
Debate Round No. 5
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