The Instigator
Autumnella
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
Carthage
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Gay people should have the same rights as straight people

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Post Voting Period
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/17/2014 Category: People
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 955 times Debate No: 52784
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (1)
Votes (0)

 

Autumnella

Pro

Gay people do not have the same rights as straight people. The Catholic Church does not support gay people. What the difference? Their preference. Who are you to say they cannot love someone of the same gender no one
Carthage

Con

Homosexuality is a sin. God has the right to say you cannot love another of the same gender (I will NOT debate this point. I just wanted it to be clear where I stand). However, the Catholic Church DOES believe this. They do have the right to exclude membership to anyone openly contradicting their beliefs. Should Muslims have the same rights (to membership) as Catholics in the Catholic Church? No, of course not. Now, politically, people shouldn't be discriminated upon. A big problem, however, is that if anyone openly says they disagree with gay tolerance, the gay lobby is intolerant, and do not treat those people the same. In conclusion, no, they shouldn't have the same rights religiously, especially when "tolerance" activists are hypercritically intolerant. I look forward to the rest of your points. Thank you.
Debate Round No. 1
Autumnella

Pro

The catholic chruch is a sick and twisted headless thing if they want to exclude a human being. Were all human. We all the same. They do not stand for this. The church is not my only argument. Have you ever thought about how they felt. 34% of suicides are because people are getting bullied! some of which for being gay or lesbian. People who are gay go home every night and cry because the world does not want to take them for they are
Carthage

Con


"The catholic church is a sick and twisted headless thing if they want to exclude a human being."-Pro. You just insulted 1.1 BILLION human beings. Far more are Catholic than gay or lesbian. At least they sugarcoated their thoughts on gays and lesbians. "if they want to exclude a human being". Do they not have a right to exclude a Muslim? Or a Buddhist? Or a mass murderer? Or a rapist? Of course they do. Put it this way- Do gay and lesbian activist groups have the right to exclude a Catholic priest? Of course they do, as he is in openly contradicting their basic ideas. That works both ways. On to the suicides.


"34% of suicides are because people are getting bullied! Some of which for being gay or lesbian"-Pro. Yes, some go home and commit suicide because of being bullied for being gay or lesbian (I'll bet this is an extremely limited number), but some are bullied for doing good. Some are bullied for being Catholics or Muslims or Buddhists. None of these people should be bullied, of course. In conclusion, don't be hypocritical by judging an entire group for their opinion on gay/lesbian rights, and suicides for bullying due to to sexual orientation are very limited. Also, "We all the same"-Pro. However, 1.1 billion of us are "a sick and twisted headless thing". Doesn't that make all of us, including lesbians and gays, sick, twisted, and headless? I request for the next round for you to use proper grammar and spelling. Thanks!


Debate Round No. 2
Autumnella

Pro

I didn't insult people, I am catholic myself. I am getting confirmed next week for your information. Over the past few years, same-sex marriage has emerged as a controversial topic for many people. I believe that every person, man or woman, should be able to marry the person of his or her choice. A homosexual is just as much a human being as is a heterosexual. The only difference is sexual orientation. It is not a crime to be different, so there is no just reason to deny homosexuals basic human rights. Gay couples have every right to marry the person of their choice, just as straight couples do. "Same-sex couples deserve this dignity and respect". The President addressed a group of homosexuals at a dinner in Washington over the weekend, spawning a conservative backlash. The White House responded by pointing out that the President also spoke at the Italian-American Foundation dinner, so this was not to be viewed as anything special.
Carthage

Con

Two quotes. "The Catholic Church does not support gay people."-Pro. "I am a Catholic myself"-Pro. Logically, it would follow that you do not support gay people. However, you clearly do. You contradict yourself.
Debate Round No. 3
Autumnella

Pro

I believe in the Catholic Church, creator or heaven and earth. I may not believe in everything they want but who said I wasn't allowed to. Gay people have every right
Carthage

Con

Again, two quotes. "Gay people do not have the same rights as straight people."-Pro. "Gay people have every right."-Pro. Again, self contradiction.
Debate Round No. 4
Autumnella

Pro

Equality for the gay and lesbian communities is best done through giving them the same legal rights as heterosexual individuals, however states are often reluctant to do so. Bringing in an EU law which would enforce rights for the gay and lesbian communities would be a huge stepping stone to overcoming prejudice and discrimination as would no longer have lesser legal rights. "The freedom to marry has long been recognized as one of the vital personal rights essential to the orderly pursuit of happiness by free men." [[Cf. Loving v. Virginia: In Sullivan 90]].

People have the right to pursue happiness in a wide variety of forms, subject to this right's compatibility with like liberty for others and marriage is a central institution by which people pursue happiness.Marriage is an oppressive social institution which damages those within it and harms the children whose parents are married. Marriage, however, is also an institution which is continually changing with society's changes.
If homosexuals were able to marry, their marriages would be more akin to gay and lesbian relationships in their current form than an oppressive traditional marriage. By allowing more homosexuals (who are naturally more liberal) to marry, they might be able to change social attitudes and practices towards, and within the institution, strengthening it and making it healthier both for society and those who are married.
For this reason, we should grant homosexuals as well as heterosexuals the right to marry in order to change society for the better.However, I think there are important things to consider about marriage:

1. Marriage should be a private matter anyway. It is nobody's business but my own whether I am married or to whom (and I would definitely never tell my employer my marital status, unlike many idiotic women who expect to be employed under their husbands' names). Private lives should be kept private;
2. The main traditional reasons for getting married are not appropriate arguments for gay couples. Marriage is traditionally seen as a means of retaining or transferring property between families and as a means of securing the birth of heirs to family fortunes. This is not an argument against gay marriage but it is a reason to consider the meaning of marriage in the first place. If gay marriage brings about change to the way in which men treat their wives as their property and fail to ensure that they pay their way (resulting in women being effectively useless to the economy if divorced), then it will be a good thing. We must, however, ensure that what remains of the legal concept of "spousal privilege" and regarding a spouse as "next of kin" are abolished (your next of kin should be your nearest relative on your mother's side) and that married women are banned from using their husbands' names as is the law in Italy and Quebec. We also need to ensure that both partners have a legal requirement to support themselves financially until they reach State retirement age and that all benefits, taxes and pensions are disagregated.
Carthage

Con

First-You contradicted yourself for a third time. You want gays and lesbians to have the same rights to marriage as straight people, but, you say, and I quote-"Marriage is an oppressive social institution which damages those within it and harms the children whose parents are married."That's a self contradiction. And are you serious? You think it would be better for a kid to grow up with unmarried parents? You think marriage is bad for the kid? That's terrible! And you think marriage as is instituted now is "oppressive traditional marriage." You challenge traditional marriage and insult it by stereotyping that it is only for security in property transactions and that husbands just treat their wives like property. As my closing statement- You contradicted yourself three times without sufficient explanation, you insulted both the Catholic Church and traditional marriage, and you've stereotyped traditional marriage as a mean to gain material value. Now, here's my last question. If we allow two men to get married or two women to get married, what is next? Polygamy? Three people getting married to each other? A complete desensitization of the meaning of marriage? Things worse than even these? Thank you. I had fun with this debate.
Debate Round No. 5
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by Teemo 3 years ago
Teemo
Pro plagiarised. I hope voters remove her conduct points when voting.Here is the source: http://debatewise.org...
No votes have been placed for this debate.