The Instigator
johnnyboy54
Pro (for)
Winning
7 Points
The Contender
owen99999
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

God Exists

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
johnnyboy54
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/18/2012 Category: Religion
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 891 times Debate No: 20468
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (3)
Votes (2)

 

johnnyboy54

Pro

First round is for acceptance only. Debate begins in the second round.
owen99999

Con

I accept your argument and wish you good luck.
Debate Round No. 1
johnnyboy54

Pro

I thank my opponent for accepting this debate.

It should be noted that, for the purposes of the debate, that I am not arguing in favor of any one religion or type of god. This argument simply covers the plausibility of the existence of a god. In this debate, god is defined as a being or beings, who is outside the universe and able to create the laws of the universe and matter. God also has will and the ability to make decisions. I consider this to be a minimalist definition.

The Kalam Cosmology Argument

P1. Everything that begins to exist must have a cause.

P2. The universe began to exist

C1. The universe must have a cause

This is a perfectly valid argument. The conclusion flows logically from the premises. The only way this argument can be wrong is if P1 or P2 is false.

Defending P1

Premise one I believe is fairly uncontroversial. Something cannot come from nothing. I cannot make a pizza with nothing. If I could we would it would lead to logical absurdities.

Defending P2

This is more controversial and where I expect my opponent to spend most of his time refuting. However The Big Bang Theory, which is the currently accepted model for the creation of the universe, states that the universe is expanding and had a specific point of creation. Also, this model shows the universe is expanding, which means the universe must have a point of origin.

Hilbert's Hotel

The only other option to the universe not having a specific point of creation is for it to exist eternally. However, such a universe is a logical absurdity. To illustrate this, I bring you the example of Hilbert's Hotel. A hotel with infinitely many rooms is fully occupied with infinitely many guests. However one person comes in and asks for a room. So we move the occupant of room one to room two. The occupant moves from room two to room three for all the guests. However the hotel was already full. How can this be? This clearly shows an actual infinite cannot exist. This means several things. First the universe cannot be eternal. Nor can the universe be the result of an infinite regress of events, as it is an actual infinite and thus impossible.

Something did not come from nothing and current evidence proves the universe had a specific point in time. The universe could not have created itself or existed eternally. Any naturalistic account for the creation of the universe is logically impossible, as it would either have to have to be an actual infinite or have something come from nothing. The nature of the universe and the laws that govern it mean that the cause must be uncaused and immaterial. Only the minimalist definition of god can fit that description. Thus god exists.
owen99999

Con

owen99999 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
johnnyboy54

Pro

My opponent has stated in the comments that he is unable to carry on this debate due to personal reasons. While I am disappointed that we couldn't continue this debate, I completely understand and wish him the best. Since he failed to make an argument, I urge a Pro vote.
owen99999

Con

owen99999 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by owen99999 4 years ago
owen99999
Ah jeez this is quite annoying I'm gunna have this on my record on debate.org now...
Posted by johnnyboy54 4 years ago
johnnyboy54
I'm sorry about your relative. I hope he or she gets well soon. I'll try but school really picks up next week so I may not be able to redo this debate in the near future.
Posted by owen99999 4 years ago
owen99999
Please could you re do this debate in a week? Unfortunately a relative has fallen ill and I don't have time to be on this site for more than 2 minutes cheers
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by ConservativePolitico 4 years ago
ConservativePolitico
johnnyboy54owen99999Tied
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Total points awarded:40 
Reasons for voting decision: FF
Vote Placed by 16kadams 4 years ago
16kadams
johnnyboy54owen99999Tied
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Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: FF