The Instigator
Siladheil
Pro (for)
Winning
10 Points
The Contender
Dilara
Con (against)
Losing
2 Points

God doesn't exist

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 4 votes the winner is...
Siladheil
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/3/2014 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 746 times Debate No: 55952
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (16)
Votes (4)

 

Siladheil

Pro

This debate will occur in three rounds.
Round One: Acceptance
Round Two: Pro's Initial Argument
Con's Inital Argument
Round Three: Pro's Rebuttal
Con's Rebuttal
Round Four: Pro's Closing Argument
Con's Closing Argument
Dilara

Con

Thank you for starting this debate.
I accept the challenge.
Debate Round No. 1
Siladheil

Pro

I will make my first argument covering the theory of evolution. The assumption that an omnipotent being with unlimited power and authority placed every creature on the planet to serve a cause for humans is absurd. If said omnipotent being placed every creature on the Earth to serve the purpose of man, then why would they change and adapt over millions of years to become what they are today? Why wouldn't they just stay the same and serve the humans the way they were created?
I will use an example of Charles Darwin's book, On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection. He observed the galapagos finches and how their bill structures were completely different due to the different need of their surrounding environment. Some finches had bills that were longer to grab bugs from deep in the trunks and limbs of trees, while other finches had shorter, stronger bills so they could crack the nuts and consume the seeds.
Throughout millions of years, animals have been adapting and changing to their environments and their evolution has taken much longer than what is possible according to what the bible gives credit for how old the Earth is.
Dilara

Con

I believe in micro evolution. People and animals evolved by adapting to their environment and natural selection but we were still created by God. He watched our development and created us. After our creation people began their journey through adaption and natural selection. If there is no God how did we come to be?. Are we all star dust or made up of what was star dust?. If there is no God how do we exain the supernatural occurrences (not all of them because to be honest some of those "super natural occurrences" are just hoaxes or coincidences). I once lost my stuffed animal pig and I dreamed that I would find her a week later on May 6 and I did find her on May 6 at CVS. I have also prayed and prayed for stuff to happen and all of those things came true. My mom got visited by her deceased aunt in a dream. There are many times when miracles happen and people wake up from a near death expirence and have seen a white light or believe (not true in all cases) their soul left their body and can tell people exactly where people were while they were dying. Is it possible for the earth to be however many years old and is to possible that animals and people evolved through natural selection but at the same time we were created?. The world is a huge place with so much going on and it seems to me that all that couldn't happen and be happening with out someone watching us. Maybe Christianity, Islam and Judaism don't tell the complete exaby truth. Maybe none of the religions are true but there is just one being watching over us. God is real. If he wasn't we couldn't be where we are today.
Thanks for the debate.
Debate Round No. 2
Siladheil

Pro

First, I will discuss where we did come from, then I will explain what those "miracles" are that you were talking about. After I talk about the "miracles" I will discuss how dinosaurs and humans could not have possibly lived in the same environment together.

1. We came from billions of years of circumstances that started with a singularity also known as the big bang theory. As heat, particulates, radiation, gas, and other matter was projected into the vast beyond known as the universe. Over millions of years, the matter began to pull together to form nebulas and other large solid masses. These then became the stars and planets. As gravity did what gravity does best, the matter began to condense more and more until, after more millions of years, our solar system fell into place. There are millions, perhaps billions of other solar systems that are extremely similiar to ours. In the earlier stages of the Earth, it is believed that a rather large asteroid slammed into the Earth causing a big piece of the Earth to break off. That large chuck then became our moon. Soon after (millions of years later) the Earth began solidifying and condensing. Somewhere during this solidification period, single celled organisims were introduced to the planet (whether from a rogue comet carrying frozen cells or from various other theories). After the introduction of single celled organisms, a long series of "survival of the fittest" took place and here we are, having a discussion on whether there was ever a creator.

2. The human mind is a fickle thing. It sees what it wants to see, believes what it wants to believe. I'm happy you found you stuffed animal at CVS, but the reason you dreamed about finding it was due to your subconscious mind thinking about your stuffed pig into your dreams. You subsonscious knew where it was and you really hoped that you would find it, therefore your brain was trying to show you the way to get back to your stuffed pig. The same situation with your monther dreaming of her deceased aunt. She most likely was thinking about her, either consciously or unconsciously throughout the day and when it became time for her to sleep, her brain relaxed and started showing her memories of her aunt to help calm her down for the next day. An example of another miracle that often misconstrued is someone having cancer and being told that they'll only have less than one percent chance of surving, but against all odds they beat cancer and live to see another day. This is not a miracle. Its due to a rather complicated series of events mixed with great skill of the doctors and modern medicine.

3. As stong as Noah was for building that Arc for one male and one female creature, I seriously doubt he was able to make it big enough to fit two brachiosaurus, along with thousands of other dinosaurs weighing at least 30 tons each. After the "great flood" what happend to all the dinosaurs? Why did every single dinosaur on the planet mysteriously vanish? Did Noah just forget to get the T-Rex?
Dilara

Con

How is it that we came to be with out a creator?. All that work, the years of evolution and development. I understand what could have happened of there was no creator (evolution, natural selection) but with all our history it seems someone must have been watching us the whole way through. I think God is real and that he didn't just create us out of thin air in 7 days but I believe he chose to create beings that would than take years to develop into what we are today. With everything that's in the world it just seems like it couldn't have happened with out someone guiding us through.
About my pig I had a dream I would find her on May 6 (2013) and on that day me and my dad walked over to CVS to get stuff and my piggy was in the card section waiting for me!. It was incredible. I didn't dream about where I would find her but when. I knew I would find her on May 6 and I did. I thought I would find her in a house though. A nother miracle I've experienced is when I got 1D tickets. It was only a couple hours before the show and I was so depressed and I thought I wasn't going but we called ticketmaster and they happened to have two tickets and my seat was really good!. I can't really imagine these being random. I think God has a special plan for everyone and is guiding everyone through their life. Also my parents had the same dream once. In their dream they were both in the same weird house and it wasn't a house they'd lived in together (maybe it was a house they'd been to together) and also both my parents knew they would have twin daughters even when they were kids and before we were born. Most people know their child's gender and how they will look before they are even born or conceived. I don't believe that the connection people feel to others is a biological thing for survival. I believe it's souls connecting. Every human has a soul. Sadly some souls aren't very good and those people become killers and rapists. A lot of souls are good (like mine and most peoples :) and those people choose to do good things. Even though it's not part of my religion i believe in reincarnation. Souls have nor beginning and no end and they come into a baby when they are inside their moms uterus and than after the person dies they go into a different baby and live another life. Eventually they go to Heaven. You know how people feel strongly about issues that don't effect them personally?. That's probably because in their passed life they were effected by those issues. It sounds crazy but it explains a lot.
All the dino's vanished because of the meteor. Even though it's not in any religious books it's been proven through science and no one can deny it. Evolution happened. It's not a matter of believing in evolution it's a matter of accepting evolution. Even though religion and God can not be proven it doesn't mean its not true or they don't exist. I respect every belief and they all have their place in the world (except satanism, weird cults and extreme fundamentalist religion) and they can all be tolerated and coexist, God or no God.
Thanks for the debate :)
Debate Round No. 3
Siladheil

Pro

According to round one, the con was supposed to write a rebuttal to my first argument, not my rebuttal.
In closing, god doesn't exist because there are too many gaps in the bible and that the Earth simply isn't as old as the bible claims it to be. There is no such thing as a miracle, only extremely bizarre coincidences that seem to work out in ones favor. There is no set "plan" by an omnipotent power that favors one group of people over another. If there really is an omnipotent power in control, why is there so much plague and disease running rampant all across Africa? There couldn't be a loving god that has all the power in the universe to let all of these children and infants die. Science is proving through many tested theories and formulas that at one point, there was a singularity that caused an super massive explosion. They've tested theories and formulas to create an idea exactly how life has formed. They don't just follow blind faith that, " If there is no God how did we come to be?. Are we all star dust or made up of what was star dust?. If there is no God how do we explain the supernatural occurrences (not all of them because to be honest some of those "super natural occurrences" are just hoaxes or coincidences). "

Thank you for the debate. I look forward to the next ones.
Dilara

Con

Sorry I messed up :( you did a better job than me so you deserve to win :)
That's a question I've always wanted answered. Why do people suffer if God is so loving? To be honest I have no idea. Miracles happen. People who have been missing for years who finally get reunited with their parents is a miracle. People surviving diseases they shouldn't have survived is a miracle. Science explains a lot but not everything. God is real. I know so because I can feel him with me, like many other people. Maybe the bible is wrong or maybe parts are right and other parts are wrong. Maybe not all of its true. No one will know for sure if a God exists until they die, and that's where they will begin their next journey.
Debate Round No. 4
16 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Sagey 2 years ago
Sagey
I'm no good at grammar and many words are spelled differently from what I was taught, so I don't judge grammar nor spelling in debates, only arguments and sources.
This debate lacked sources!
Posted by Dilara 2 years ago
Dilara
Yeah I got to be more acurate lol. Vote for me! :)
Posted by Siladheil 2 years ago
Siladheil
Good luck Dilara! I have a feeling you'll win the grammar and spelling portion of the voting hands down! Lol
Posted by Dilara 2 years ago
Dilara
Siladheil turner.
Ok! I'll debate with you in that turner:)
Posted by Siladheil 2 years ago
Siladheil
I believe what turner is trying to say, he's willing to debate you as to why god allows suffering, pain and despair.
Posted by Dilara 2 years ago
Dilara
Turnerjb04 what do you mean?
Posted by turnerjb04 2 years ago
turnerjb04
Dilara I heard you got problem God and existence of evil and suffering and can explain to you through message or debate as a fellow muslim myself if you like ?
Posted by turnerjb04 2 years ago
turnerjb04
Dilara I heard you got problem God and existence of evil and suffering and can explain to you through message or debate as a fellow muslim myself if you like ?
Posted by Siladheil 2 years ago
Siladheil
This was my first debate. . Ever lol ill work on citing my claims in the future
Posted by saxman 2 years ago
saxman
First of all, Darwin also thought that 1.White people were the most advanced of Homo sapiens. The cover on his book says "The preservation of the superior race". and 2.That if life were more complex than he originally thought, then his theories might not be possible. so using darwin as your source isn't always a good idea. According to the Bible history, beings reproduced with there own kinds, leaving room for adaptation, but not evolution. We don't see a significant enough connection between fossil records to see beings change from one to another. In fact, cells have their own "security" measures to make sure it doesn't evolve. The cell dies when it goes too far. There are other arguments discounting evolution, but I don't have the time. oh, and by the way pro, the burden of proof is on you in this debate.
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by Sagey 2 years ago
Sagey
SiladheilDilaraTied
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Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro posed a fairly weak argument and I though Con might come through, but, instead used an anecdotal ( Sample Of 1. Fallacy) concerning a stuffed pig, her mother's dream and mentioned out of body experiences which are all individual subjective experiences that collectively prove nothing: I myself have experienced many out of body experiences, but I know them all to be Hallucinations. As are all such experiences, since nobody has ever passed the litmus test of seeing the hidden patterns/pictures. Personal experiences never rank as evidence in a debate, it is much better to argue using evidence that can be backed by good, well researched sources in any debate.
Vote Placed by ChadIrvin 2 years ago
ChadIrvin
SiladheilDilaraTied
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Reasons for voting decision: In the final round con stated her opponent won the debate.
Vote Placed by Ajab 2 years ago
Ajab
SiladheilDilaraTied
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Total points awarded:31 
Reasons for voting decision: Really bad debate. Like seriously. No signposting, no structure and arguments from miracles! I should tell you that I am a theist. Firstly Sil did not show why evolution is correct, no sources, no journal entries. Then he did not show why evolution would made God utterly redundant. Insofar as this he failed to fulfill his BoP, however his arguments were better than Con's. Con argued from personal situations which are not relevant in debates, she did not refute his original pseudo-argument so that stands. She did however accept her mistake and that is why I have Pro the argument points and her points for conduct. In general there was a lack of solid argumentation.
Vote Placed by KatieKat99 2 years ago
KatieKat99
SiladheilDilaraTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Nice debate for both of you, just more sources and clearer voters and more orginazation