The Instigator
Berend
Con (against)
Winning
7 Points
The Contender
maddiezieglerfan
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points

God is Good

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
Berend
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/10/2014 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 891 times Debate No: 58795
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (17)
Votes (2)

 

Berend

Con

First round is for accepting. This About is about whether God is good or not.
maddiezieglerfan

Pro

I accept the challenge, and I strongly believe that God is good.
Debate Round No. 1
Berend

Con

OK, so, as you know, I am on the side of con. Meaning I am on the side that says God is not good. When I say he, she or it, whatever be the name, I mean that god is in no way a moral authority, good person, ideal thing to look up too and sure as hell not one for us to say he is good based on the morals of what we as humans follow in major civilization laws, a hypocrite, not a true savior, lies, and contradicts himself. Before I continue, I ask everyone here to hear my out with an open mind, look at the being known as 'god' as nothing more then a human. Before you say you can't, you can. Picture God as a man named Bob. If we put Bob, or God on trial, we will throw at him everything presented, both good and bad, with that it is up too you to see if he is truly good.


Now I do not consider someone good if they continue to do bad things or have done big bad things. I would not consider Hitler a good person based on his past objectives. I will present a few argument in my following statement. And note, this is the God of Abraham. So be this Islam, Christian or even Jew, the Torah, Bible and Qur'an all come into play. If my opponent is Jew, it will be the Torah, if Christian, Bible and Torah (OT) or Muslim, Qur'an with all the past stories intermixed.

The Genocide Argument: [1]

In the literal story of Noah, the world has become fairly populated. The world is filled with evil and sin, the 'Good' Lord, God Almighty makes one man, Noah, build a boat and board up his family and kids with all the animals God wants too keep alive, in the boat.

This part not only explains possibly, to some, why there are not Dino's, but in general, it is God cleansing the earth. While that sounds good, look at what the problem really is. Because a few people, rather a lot more then a few people, do not follow his way, or possibly do not believe he is real, in all, they do not follow what God wants, he kills them. God dislikes who they are and how they are, so he kills them so his 'perfect' creation would be cleaned of the ones of his perfect creation gone wrong.

So God committees genocide on the world. While the saying the rainbow means no more, it does not change the fact he killed a lot of people. This would be similar to Hitler making a d of celebration of his change and saying he will never do that again. Wont matter as he already committed the act.


Original Sin: [2] [1] [3]

Now this one is interesting and is fairly weak as it can go in many ways. However, if you look at the first book, God makes the world,he does this and that. He puts [b]trees[/b] and plants on the earth and brings man into this. Now, this sounds like a good creation story. God mans the world with everything ready for his creation. I loved it, but there is more. For those who know this story, god tells his creation he rules over the earth and that he can eat anything but one tree. God is, as many theist claim, eternal. He does not need food, water, or any of that to live. So when there is a talking snake, who is not the devil, and Adam and Eve ate the fruit, because they seem to not have knowledge before hand, they are punished, banished from the land and women made to feel horrible pain at birth. Why is this? Because they ate a fruit that god put there. It did not need to be made.

Some will say he was testing us, wanting to see our action. However he is an all powerful and all knowing being, why would he need to test on something stupid like this? Because he seems to want us to suffer for his fun. Then later on Jesus comes and 'died' for our 'sins' that God wanted to happen, just like the genocide. So either God is not all knowing or he enjoys what he does. There is no reason for that action. For those that say he is not all knowing in the sense of what will happen, but in other ways, then he is not all powerful and not all knowing.


God is in favor of Child Sacrifice: [1] [3]

This argument brings in God of the Bible and the Torah. In both cases he shows favor of it. In the Torah, he orders Abraham to kill his son. And Abraham does not really question it, he did not even decline it.

Later with his supposed son, Jesus, many people claim he had died for their sins. Some people point to parts of the bible like this.

"But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more shall we be saved from God"s wrath through him! For if, while we were God"s enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life! Not only is this so, but we also boast in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation. (NIV Romans 5:8-11)"

If a God was truly all powerful and all knowing and all good, why would his only option for his screw ups, The tree and original sin, and sin is what goes against what God likes, have his son die and be punished just so he could forgive? Would not a good, intelligent God know your thoughts and talk to you, answer you, or even request you apologize through prayer instead of having a man killed? I would think so. There is no justification for Jesus dying.

So either God has lied in his books by claiming to be all mighty, end and beginning, all powerful and all knowing, or he is false. In the end, he is not a good being.

This is really only a small portion. I will let my opponent make his statement.


God Favors Evil over Good?:


This argument is slightly different, picking more apart reality then the holy books. This is also more of a question to Pro. I find it odd that God not once has intervened since 'Jesus' or 'Muhammad'. Where was he to save his children during WWII? I say that when a women is being rapped by a man in an ally, god not doing anything does not help and is actually siding with evil. Why you ask? Because you has to options, help the victims or let the one causing trouble continue his evil and not help.


Where was he to defend his people and help us when we need him? Why is there cancer? Does he not wish to help those in need? If not, he is not all good. I have already covered in a past debate on the 'miracle' claims people make, still applies here. I will get into that later if needed.



Sources:

1) Book of Genesis (Creation to Abraham)


2) Book of Genesis (Noah Story)


3) The New Testament
maddiezieglerfan

Pro

The thing with God, is that he is 100% percent everything good. He is 100% kindness, loving, compassion, etc. You see, when God inputs His wrath, it is a holy wrath. God does everything he does good, even if it is harsh, he does it 100% perfect, and you might as well forfeit now.
Debate Round No. 2
Berend

Con

Thank you for the post. Not much of an opening statement, but that is not important. So, as you know a few arguments were placed out by my opponents.

Mr. Maddiezieglerfan, you state that God is 100% all good, but by pure definition, he is not. My points still stand and with this I will give a quote of a very famous atheist. A man who lives on in spirit of his deeds.

"...not scorning the three delightful children who are everything to me and who are my only chance of even a glimpes of a second life, let alone an immortal one, and I'll tell you something: if I was told to sacrifice them to prove my devotion to God, if I was told to do what all monotheist are told to do and admire the man who said "Yes, I'LL GUT MY OWN KID to show my love of god"

I'd say, no, f*** you." Christopher Hitchens

Religion in itself is not believing there is a God, rather God is the one who tells you what to do. And i this case, if you think God is good and everything he says is righteous, then why don't you go down to the nearest gay bay and murder every single one of them. Because your Bible is the word of your God and Your God is all good and he commands you to do this. Jesus even says himself that the laws of the old remain.

Because, not only do you accept what the laws are by God, you are also saying that his deeds like killing people is fine. Thus you should have no issue killing a homosexual.

The issue here is rather sad as I find it despicable that a being, a divine creator, could raise his finger up and demand we kill in his name. That he would want some people killed because he dislikes them. Not only is God all knowing and all powerful, him killing because people 'sinned' shows that he made us imperfect and not perfect creations and that his only way to deal with it was to murder us.

Well I will tell you now, if you consider this being of divine Holiness to be a good being with everything he does as good, well, consider me to side on the side of Lucifer, because that man has done nothing bad yet.

Let us take a common bad thing Satan has done, in the book of jobs he tortures him, and why? Because God wanted to prove what already knows knowing Lucifer knew this as well, yet he either was tricked, meaning he is not all knowing and all powerful, or he simply is an evil child with a magnify glass, allowing Lucifer to do his deeds just to prove something that is obvious.

I will say this, form my personal heart. If there was a God, and I died and he told me how he was sad I did not accept him, I would flip him off and tell him to go shove Lucifer you know what up the hole that he has. Because I do not wish to be in the presence of a being who can not take himself ever ding wrong, making people suffer, having his son killed so he could forgive, and so one. I find this to be a childish and absolute evidence, the bible that is, of the God of Abraham being nothing more then an angry child.

Religion is nothing but a hoax... "To terrify children with the image of Hell, to consider women an inferior creation - is that good for the world?" as Hitchens also mentions.


So, unless someone here, namely my opponent, can explain how God is excusable in his deeds of killing people and having people turned into pillars of salt is good with out a simple "Because he is God" I think we really are done here. I sure hope my opponent can bring more to the table because I was expecting more from him.

Let us not forget Moses killing 3000 people and making a new set of laws.





He is 100% kindness, loving, compassion, etc.


Now my opponent claims that this god is all kindness and loving and compassionate. Tell me, do you people honestly think you can sit there and with a open, rational and moral mind say that what I have displayed before and what the bible says to be kindness? Loving? Or even Compassion? I say no. Any god who claims to be all loving would end suffering and come down to us and not continue the ultimate game of hide and go seek.

I am not a parent yet, but, other then to complete my goal to be a Physicist and work in the field of science, my main goal before death is to settle down. Get married and have kids, be it with a guy or a girl. I will not stand to hear that this being will be thought as good when if God was judged as a human, he would be deemed evil and thrown in jail for more then 4 life sentences. He would have been executed. Yet, simply because he is claimed to be God because he is also claimed to have powers we do not have, rather did at that time, he is excused?

If Superman killed 50 people in a day, simply because of his powers, does this excuse him? No, because if he had claimed to be God he would then be excused.

In the anime and manga (Japanese comic) called Death Note, a young College Student named Light Yagami, gained a particular book called a Death Note. The name who's written in the notebook shall die. Light in the story used this to kill of criminals. He was then deemed the name 'Kira' meaning Killer, even though that is not the right translation However, he was deemed the God, Kira.

A detective, the worlds greatest mind you, took on the case with the ICPO and the Japanese task force. The detective is a private detective named L. People began to judge L for trying to bring their God down as crime rate in the world became an all time low, dropping 70% because of Kira in the first year. Wars stopped.

Why was this seen as OK? Because no one knew that Kira was just a teenage boy with a book of a God of Death (Shinigami in Japanese) who found the book and used for his own agenda, even going so far as kill those who apposed him.

This when judged as a human is him still being branded a killer. Murder is murder, no exceptions. However, since no one knew of Kira's (Light's) powers and how eh did it, by killing people by just having a name and face, he made it seem as if it was a God doing it. Hence the reason he was the "God of the New World". Because he was deemed by many to be their God, he was excused from his heinous acts of murder, but as a human, he is clearly nothing more then a killer killing criminals. Even going far to kill people, like L, who tried to stop him and investigate and show that it was Light who was Kira.

This anime/manga is a hell of a perfect example how just being deemed a God, you are automatically excused of all crimes, just as you can get away with almost anything, in say America, because something is your religion. Even smoking pot in the 80's-90's.


No, I refuse to accept the act to which this god did in the stories is anything good. Hell, he 'hates' homosexuality, yet he put the male G-Spot in the arse.



I will end my rant of a rebuttal there. Thank you.



Sources:


1) Christiphor Hitchens - Theist vs Atheist debate

2) Death Note, Manga & Anime

3) Book of Jobs

4) Book of Leviticus, 20:13
maddiezieglerfan

Pro

First of all, i would like to say that you are speaking to a girl, not a man. Now i will start my rant of rampage on you! You say that God murders people all of the time without even caring. Are you kidding! Have you not seen the ten commandments? The 6th commandment is "Thou shalt not kill". God was the one who created those commandments! So do you want to know why God destroys people sometimes? Let us take Noah"s flood for example, destroying most of the people on the earth. This is what is in scriptures, "And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually." (Genesis 6:5). Also, "The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence. And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth. And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth." (Genesis 6:11-13) God saw that the earth was so evil, he could barely look at it. God is perfect, and he destroyed the earth with the flood because it was so wicked and horrible he had no other choice! God gave them their chance to repent for their sins, but every though was evil continually! Let us also use Sodom and Gamorrah for an example: this is scriptures: Genesis 19 King James Version (KJV)

19 And there came two angels to Sodom at even; and Lot sat in the gate of Sodom: and Lot seeing them rose up to meet them; and he bowed himself with his face toward the ground;

2 And he said, Behold now, my lords, turn in, I pray you, into your servant's house, and tarry all night, and wash your feet, and ye shall rise up early, and go on your ways. And they said, Nay; but we will abide in the street all night.

3 And he pressed upon them greatly; and they turned in unto him, and entered into his house; and he made them a feast, and did bake unleavened bread, and they did eat.

4 But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:

5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.

6 And Lot went out at the door unto them, and shut the door after him,

7 And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly.

8 Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof.

9 And they said, Stand back. And they said again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and came near to break the door.

10 But the men put forth their hand, and pulled Lot into the house to them, and shut to the door.

11 And they smote the men that were at the door of the house with blindness, both small and great: so that they wearied themselves to find the door.

12 And the men said unto Lot, Hast thou here any besides? son in law, and thy sons, and thy daughters, and whatsoever thou hast in the city, bring them out of this place:

13 For we will destroy this place, because the cry of them is waxen great before the face of the Lord; and the Lord hath sent us to destroy it.

14 And Lot went out, and spake unto his sons in law, which married his daughters, and said, Up, get you out of this place; for the Lord will destroy this city. But he seemed as one that mocked unto his sons in law.

15 And when the morning arose, then the angels hastened Lot, saying, Arise, take thy wife, and thy two daughters, which are here; lest thou be consumed in the iniquity of the city.

16 And while he lingered, the men laid hold upon his hand, and upon the hand of his wife, and upon the hand of his two daughters; the Lord being merciful unto him: and they brought him forth, and set him without the city.

17 And it came to pass, when they had brought them forth abroad, that he said, Escape for thy life; look not behind thee, neither stay thou in all the plain; escape to the mountain, lest thou be consumed.

18 And Lot said unto them, Oh, not so, my Lord:

19 Behold now, thy servant hath found grace in thy sight, and thou hast magnified thy mercy, which thou hast shewed unto me in saving my life; and I cannot escape to the mountain, lest some evil take me, and I die:

20 Behold now, this city is near to flee unto, and it is a little one: Oh, let me escape thither, (is it not a little one?) and my soul shall live.

21 And he said unto him, See, I have accepted thee concerning this thing also, that I will not overthrow this city, for the which thou hast spoken.

22 Haste thee, escape thither; for I cannot do anything till thou be come thither. Therefore the name of the city was called Zoar.

23 The sun was risen upon the earth when Lot entered into Zoar.

24 Then the Lord rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the Lord out of heaven;

25 And he overthrew those cities, and all the plain, and all the inhabitants of the cities, and that which grew upon the ground.

26 But his wife looked back from behind him, and she became a pillar of salt.

27 And Abraham gat up early in the morning to the place where he stood before the Lord:

28 And he looked toward Sodom and Gomorrah, and toward all the land of the plain, and beheld, and, lo, the smoke of the country went up as the smoke of a furnace.

29 And it came to pass, when God destroyed the cities of the plain, that God remembered Abraham, and sent Lot out of the midst of the overthrow, when he overthrew the cities in the which Lot dwelt." God could not stand the wickedness these cities had developed! These people were out of control. They were worshipping false gods, mocking the one true God, and doing many other horrible things. You see opponent, when God has wrath, it is a holy wrath! He does all things holy, so he is 100% holy. I should call you a fool opponent. I shall call you a fool because you fail to recognize the holiness of the one true God. And you also say that you would rather be on Lucifer"s side? Lucifer is the devil! I feel for you, because you are such a fool in your ways and thoughts. You need to repent NOW. Or else, you will regret it someday. TRUST ME!
Debate Round No. 3
Berend

Con

OK, thanks. Now that I can finally directly respond to everyone here and my opponent I can say, dear Pro, I am in no way able to logically know your gender. You have had like one or so debates total and your profile has no gender. So, while I assumed, it was only logical based on all the information I had. So if I offended you, I apologies.

OK, so I enjoyed your points you made, very well done to a point. Now, people, I will directly respond to every single point and address what is right and wrong while asserting my own points to them. This way you can also grasp what I actually think on those matters.



The Law, Evil deeds, Killing of 3000

Now, I have actually seen the commandments, and it is not 10. There was actually 19-20. As you might remember, Moses came down the with 'originals' and broke them on the cliff out of rage. This happened because the people worshiped a baby cow and broke the commandments. But as you might know, they had no logical way of knowing the commandments they so happen to break. So they were out of the loop as Moses went up to the mountain for 40 days and nights alone. So it was only Moses who knew of the command and what did he do? He commanded the Levi to kill three thousand people. Yes, 3000 people had died that day because of a law they had no idea about when the all powerful and all knowing God chose to take 40 days and 40 nights to make 10 rules. Which are plagiarized from the Book of the Dead, the Egyptian poll theism religion that Moses was brought in since he was a prince. [1] [2] [3]



The Plague

So, the only man who actually knew of the law had broken it to have people who did not know it killed. So you can state that verse all you want pro, Moses broke it first and it was allowed and nothing is going to change that fact. God did not have him punished. Now, what happened after Moses had them killed? He told the Lord and the Lord plagued the rest of the people. This was because of the golden cow they worshiped, yet Moses had people killed and was unharmed. [4]



The Stone of the 10 Laws by Moses & The Egyptian Book of the Dead

So, yes God, rather Moses mad the laws, of not to kill, but that does not mean he did not. I even placed the sources down. So thank you pro, but please read all I say next time. Thank you. Also no, Moses created the commandments. He even had new ones made. The first were copies of the Book of the Dead. Which, oddly enough, came from a religion of which was common in the land of his and worshiped by the norms of that land, which he was raised as one. So I find it odd how god made the laws when Moses lived in a house and a religion that had actually had the laws first.



The Flood

God had a choice for the flood, he is an all powerful and all knowing god. I mean, just because the people did not follow what that God said does not mean he needs to kill them. Are you really going to say all those animals needed to die? That all those babies needed to die? Sorry, if God is perfect, then he should make his creation with out flaws so that wouldn't happen. But since he failed on making us -- which shows he is not perfect, all powerful and all knowing -- he had to kill what he failed at.




Sodom and Gomorrah

Ah, Sodom and Gomorrah, God dislikes how they were and chose to kill them all. And when a women looked back, even though she was told not too, God still chose to kill her when he knew what she was thinking. That very concept of looking and having her turn into salt was very childish on his part. [5]



Abraham Keeps Asking and Going Lower

Here is a good part, in that area, Abraham ask God if there is X amount in there that is good, if they might be saved. God said yes. He then keeps this questioning up for a bit till he gets a good answer to save many lives. If God was all knowing he would have simply told Abraham before being questioned and told him exactly who is and who isn't and how will be good without having to do that game he did. [6]



Lucifer is Bad?

As for Lucifer, can point to the very basic fact that Lucifer, his real name, has done FAR more harm then anything God has done himself?






Points of God doing Evil in the Bible [7]

- Even when knowing all and being the powerful being, he allows Lucifer to cause hell to Jobs to prove what eh already knows.

- Committees genocide because he failed to make his creation with out not following his will.

- Allows people to be killed and suffer in pain in order to forgive people. [8]

- Is against incest but has Noah and his family commit it.

- Turns a women into a pile of salt for seeing the city destroyed.

- Places the tree of knowledge in the garden and did nothing to stop the snake.

- Placed the tree in the garden knowing it was not needed and he did not need to test anyone, he wanted Adam and Eve to eat from it.

- Causes painful childbirth for eating a fruit.

- Scrambles language and puts us around the world for coming together and building a tower to heaven. God feared us and said we can do anything together and chose to scatter us, making us practically useless. A childish act.


None of these are acts of holy and still very little of what I can use.




Laws and Commands of Evil and Moronic Acts From or By God [9]


- Commands homosexuals to be killed.

- Commanded people who use 'magic' to be killed.

- Commands people who curse their parents to be killed. (I would be in this area, I would have to be killed)

- Commands anyone who cheats to be killed.

- Commands if you lie/sleep with your step mom or mother to have you both put to death.

- Commands if you have sex with your daughter-in-law, both of you will be killed.

- Commands if you give any Jew or anyone in the 'holy land' to Molech, you will be killed for that act.

- If you marry a women AND her mother, you do not get killed, you just get burned alive on a stick. Both the man and the two women.

- If a man has sexual relations with a animal (we are animals) then that man and the animal must be killed.

- If a women mates with an animal, they both will be killed.

- man will be cut from sight in front of all if he has any form of sight of nakedness of family members. So better hope you do not walk in on your mother by accident.

- If a man mates with a women who is sick ,they will be both cut from their peoples sight.

- If a man and a women are mediums, or they have familiar spirits, they will be killed.

- You shall not mix threads.


As you all see, including my opponent, what makes any of this holy? Simply because he is claimed to be a god that it is deemed holy? I wish to direct my point regarding the holy aspect to the Kira case or Light Yagami from Death Note once more as how invalid that point is. Simply being a God or a higher power does not make it OK. If you were to see Bob, or God, as a human ordering this, it would look insane. He would be trialled and institutionalized.

I do not think much more needs to be said, my opponents points stand on their own and almost try to deflect what I point too, but they fail to actually disprove the point I am trying to make across this board.



Sources:

1) The Book of the Dead and the '10 commandments': The plagiarism of the laws. http://www.religioustolerance.org...


2) The killing of 3000 people by the Levi, commanded by Moses for breaking a Law they knew nothing about. Exodus chapter 32:25-28.


3) Moses makes New Stone Commandant. Exodus, Chapter 34:1-28. The second making, or rather, the New Commandments.


4) Exodus chapter 32:35. God curses the people with a plague for the calf.


5) Genesis, chapter 19:26. Lot's wife turned to salt for seeing the city destroyed.


6) Abraham Intercedes for Sodom, Genesis, Chapter 18:16-33.


7) Book of Genesis, Noah, Eden. Books of the New Test, Lot's life - Genesis 19:26. Book of Jobs


8) Darkmatter2525 YouTube -




9) Book of Leviticus, Chapter 20 - 22 (all verses must be read). The law god says and explains while also giving repercussions if defied.






Now, for a few I did not give complete detail, like source 7, and included multiple books regarding the source and just the books for many because of the lack of space and time I have. They should not be hard to find or the entire book itself needs to be read and not just a verse to completely understand the situation of the premise given out.
maddiezieglerfan

Pro

Look, I get that all of these things look like God is a cruel person. I am probably going to get torn to shreds and lose the whole debate for saying this, but YOU ARE WRONG! I can"t say anything right now, but someday you will see how wrong you were, and you shall pay eternally for that. Read the Bible, that is the only real proof. What you are doing is you are taking small parts and not seeing the rest. The rest of the Bible has all of the reasons! The ENTIRE Bible SHOWS YOU how good an holy God is. That is all, thank you. I will no longer be posting.
Debate Round No. 4
Berend

Con

Well, I see this has come to a close and since my opponent wont make another comment he says, I wish to thank him or her for this discussion. I enjoyed it. As for the topic, for anyone here who is a theist and supports Pro all the way, I wish to ask you a favor to follow. Read the bible, read it from front to back, both new and old. Then compare the Torah to the OT. Look at it with an open, not Christian mind and tell me if you think the actions were justified. Because I find what the whole betting on Jobs life's not holy. All to prove something he already knew. So, I want you to think hard, is a god who can do anything and knows everything do what he does and still be good?

As you may see, I was told I basically cherry pick, but I don't. I am pulling out of the bible, what most ignore or dismiss, that they cherry pick. I am throwing in your face what you ignore. Many atheist have become atheist after reading the bible. So please, read your bible and do it with no help and read all of it. Make the choice yourself, ask yourself and question and challenge your own beliefs. I will end my closing statement here and let Pro do what she needs.

Thank you.
maddiezieglerfan

Pro

maddiezieglerfan forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
17 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Sagey 2 years ago
Sagey
So neither Hell nor Heaven dwellers will think God is Good, except for maybe a few Nutjobs.
Posted by Sagey 2 years ago
Sagey
Those in Heaven probably don't either as they would be very lonely, since 98% of their friends and likely all their family will be in Hell. Many people say they would see their loved ones in Heaven, but a study of the constraints for getting a place in Heaven, means very few people will ever get there.

While the only people they will meet in Heaven are the Idiots that nobody wanted to know during their mortal life.
Spending an eternity with such nutjobs would be unbearable, I'd be opting to go to Hell to be with family and friends.
Posted by pivot 2 years ago
pivot
Probably those who are in hell don't think God is good.
Posted by Sagey 2 years ago
Sagey
Morality is Evolved, not a divine requirement, it came as a requirement for group survival and Behavioral Biology is a subject where this is clearly demonstrated. Many creatures have evolved moral frameworks that are applicable to their environments and position in the food chain. Humans and other primates are no different. We evolved the moral/ethical rules that allowed us the best survival advantage and at the same time attract sexual partners, though in many species, attracting sexual partners can be detrimental to survival.
Example is in bird species where females prefer males with bright plumage, but this bright plumage may get them a partner to mate with, but it also makes them easily seen by predators. So sexual selection does not mean survival, it only means fussy females.
Same with apes, in tournament species, females prefer big bulky muscular males for strong genetics, but, being big and highly testosterone producing, reduces their life expectancy.
So we arrived with a Morality that balances Survival and Sexual Selection pressures.
Posted by Siladheil 2 years ago
Siladheil
http://www.debate.org...

This is a religous debate I'm having about atheists being immoral or evil. Please read it so far and tell me what you think! Thank you in advance!
Posted by Irrelevance 2 years ago
Irrelevance
Perfection and morality are different... You can be perfect at incurring pain and wrath, yet you can be pure evil. God uses fear to earn respect, making a guy think he is murdering his son to please god. God is worse than hitler, because Hitler didn't create the Jews to make them feel pain.
Posted by Sagey 2 years ago
Sagey
Here is one of the series "My Name Is Nobody", couldn't stop laughing at this SW.
Sort of a spoof of serious westerns.
Posted by Sagey 2 years ago
Sagey
Hmm, Trinity. Great Movie, stars Terence Hill and Bud Spencer, best series of Spaghetti Westerns I've ever seen.
"Trinity", "Trinity Is My Name", etc. very athletic bloke Terence Hill and the bright blue eyes sucked my gf in, she was a fan of his too, but not for his athleticism.
:-D~
Posted by Sagey 2 years ago
Sagey
Actually if you have a stutter God can be Go,o.d. , close enuff!
Posted by Berend 2 years ago
Berend
Its the Trinity Religion. Jew/Christian/Islam god. Yahweh. I said that in my post already.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by dsjpk5 2 years ago
dsjpk5
BerendmaddiezieglerfanTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Ff
Vote Placed by Sagey 2 years ago
Sagey
BerendmaddiezieglerfanTied
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Total points awarded:60 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro forfeited, though Pro's arguments were extremely weak also. Con's source was also rater funny!