The Instigator
leojm
Con (against)
Winning
8 Points
The Contender
LotusNG
Pro (for)
Losing
5 Points

Gun control

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 3 votes the winner is...
leojm
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/1/2013 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,659 times Debate No: 33144
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (5)
Votes (3)

 

leojm

Con

Gun control isn't about guns its about control!!
LotusNG

Pro

I accept this debate.

Good luck, have fun!

Debate Round No. 1
leojm

Con

It says in the constitution in the second amendment that we have the right to own guns. Gun control does not protect the citizens from being shot, the government wont step in to help. You don't have a gun to protect your self you won't live long. Look at Washington D.C, they banned guns. The crime rate is really high. But this is only one of the cities. Why United States right now has less crime rate than other communist countries is because we can defend ourselves. You can't really fight a criminal with your fist, you won't win against a gun. The government wants to be in control, it wants people to rely on them for everything, protection and other stuff. The guns are also not the problem. It's the person who pulls the trigger. The government is storing lots of ammunition so that people cant get to it. An example is that every time every store gets 22 rifle/pistol ammunition it is all gone in about an hour of arrival. There has been many protests, the government is starting to get scared so they decided if they take away the ammunition nobody will be able to threaten them. The government can care less about the people. The way the founding fathers wanted this country to run is that the states should have the power and the government is there just to make sure nothing gets out of control. But right now it's totally opposite. the states depend on the government, and they feel if the government goes down they will be in despair and wouldn't know what to do. Every year the government take more power than what it was intended to have. This government we have now should back down and give the states control.
LotusNG

Pro

Okay, for those confused, here is the 2nd amendment:

"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed."

For those who don't know, here are a few definitions:




Regulate:
a
: to govern or direct according to rule
b (1) : to bring under the control of law or constituted authority (2) : to make regulations for or concerning <regulate the industries of a country>

2: to bring order, method, or uniformity to <regulate one's habits>
3: to fix or adjust the time, amount, degree, or rate of <regulate the pressure of a tire>


(http://www.merriam-webster.com...)

Militia:

1a: a part of the organized armed forces of a country liable to call only in emergency
b
: a body of citizens organized for military service

2: the whole body of able-bodied male citizens declared by law as being subject to call to military service


Infringe:


1: to encroach upon in a way that violates law or the rights of another <infringe a patent>
2: obsolete : defeat, frustrate

(Every definition is from Merriam-webster.com)




Basically the 2nd amendment protects that state's rights to hold a personal militia, and it holds personal right to own a gun. Well, it's all debated, in reality few actually know the true meaning, we can only guess.

Anyway, back to the debate!

"It says in the constitution in the second amendment that we have the right to own guns. Gun control does not protect the citizens from being shot, the government wont step in to help. You don't have a gun to protect your self you won't live long."

1. I don't own a gun, and don't intend to. I'm alive. My mother is alive, she owns no firearms. The same situation applies with my father and both of his parents. All of us are alive.
2. Definition of gun control: efforts to regulate or control sales of guns. (http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu...)

So gun control doesn't stop gun sales, it only regulates (that word looks familiar) the sales of them.

"Look at Washington D.C, they banned guns. The crime rate is really high. But this is only one of the cities. Why United States right now has less crime rate than other communist countries is because we can defend ourselves."

1. http://www.neighborhoodscout.com...
How many of those cities banned guns? D.C. is number 46, so I'm going to need you to prove that those 45 other cities have strict gun control.

2. Please give names and statistics from at least 2010 showing that the majority of Communist countries have a higher crime rate than the U.S.

"You can't really fight a criminal with your fist, you won't win against a gun. The government wants to be in control, it wants people to rely on them for everything, protection and other stuff. The guns are also not the problem. It's the person who pulls the trigger. The government is storing lots of ammunition so that people cant get to it. An example is that every time every store gets 22 rifle/pistol ammunition it is all gone in about an hour of arrival."

1. http://www.mrconservative.com...

From the article: "A Florida high school student and his friends discovered the truth of the cynical adage that “no good deed goes unpunished” when he was suspended for disarming a fellow student on the school bus. The teens, all students at Cypress Lake High School in Fort Myers, Florida, were on a school bus when two students got into a heated argument. One of them then pulled a loaded .22 caliber revolver on the other, and aimed it at his head."

2. I'm going to need evidence for your statement about the government wanting people to need them for everything.

3. Yes, the person who pulls the trigger is the problem. It's why we want better background checks. We need to know how psychologically sound a would-be gun owner is.

4. And again, I need evidence for your statement about government officials buying all 22 rifle/pistol ammunition in every store every time they restock the ammunition.

"There has been many protests, the government is starting to get scared so they decided if they take away the ammunition nobody will be able to threaten them. The government can care less about the people. The way the founding fathers wanted this country to run is that the states should have the power and the government is there just to make sure nothing gets out of control."

1. Few can threaten the government anyway. I don't know many people that own fully automatic weapons to begin with (I personally know 2), and I certainly don't know anyone that owns tanks, fighter planes, or even a grenade. How are they, the Average Joes, that much of a threat?

2. If the government didn't care about the people, welfare, minimum wage, and goverment given medical aid wouldn't exist.

"But right now it's totally opposite. the states depend on the government, and they feel if the government goes down they will be in despair and wouldn't know what to do. Every year the government take more power than what it was intended to have. This government we have now should back down and give the states control."

1. This debate is about gun control, not government power vs. state power. They can go hand in hand, but you have yet to truly make the two connected.
Debate Round No. 2
leojm

Con

Well to answer the question of proof that every store that gets .22 ammunition is sold within an hour, is that i have experience, i have went on every box store and little owned gun stores and gun shows and rarely do you find .22 ammunition. people walk out of store wit thousands of rounds and if you are not the first 10 people at the door before opening your in bad luck. Here are some more of my back ups. I also own a gun so does my whole family, sorry to say but you cant expect to live for a while one day you will get robbed and shot. You have a less chance surviving without a gun than with. Criminals are not normal in their head that's why they are criminals. I had a best friend once that said she will never get shot and she didn't own a gun, well about a week later i found out that her whole family including her was shot by a criminal, and the police couldn't get there in time. Generally speaking, gun control is recognized as the effort to restrict or limit the production, shipment and ownership of certain guns. Over time, the issue of gun ownership has become a staple of controversy and one of the most hotly contested social issues facing Americans. More often than not, where one falls on gun control depends largely on their political affiliation, their moral standards and their past experiences with firearms. According to some estimates, approximately 80 million homes in the U.S. own 223 million guns. As is the case with most issues, gun control comes with a list of pros and cons. The people who staunchly support gun control believe their argument would protect society and save lives, while those opposing gun control believe the opposite. Potential for more crime " It"s long been suggested that having a gun allows would-be victims to protect themselves against crimes. Proponents of gun control often point to crime statistics as a sign that gun control would be a positive for society. However, people against gun control firmly believe that by having a gun, people could prevent many of those crimes from happening in the first place. Second amendment " The second amendment from The Bill of Rights grants private citizens the right to bear arms. Thus, people who stand firmly against gun control insist that no legislation, technically, should have the right to take away a citizen's guns without first repealing the amendment in question. Bad history " History appears to support the pro-gun crowd. Throughout various political regimes, the one constant of a tyrannical government has been the disarming of citizens. Thomas Jefferson once famously said: "No man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against the tyranny in government." The government has no right taking our rights away. My evidence of other countries with gun bans, I'm from Russia, i have experienced it, i have seen so many innocent people being killed and they can;t do anything about it.
LotusNG

Pro

"Generally speaking, gun control is recognized as the effort to restrict or limit the production, shipment and ownership of certain guns. Over time, the issue of gun ownership has become a staple of controversy and one of the most hotly contested social issues facing Americans. More often than not, where one falls on gun control depends largely on their political affiliation, their moral standards and their past experiences with firearms. According to some estimates, approximately 80 million homes in the U.S. own 223 million guns. As is the case with most issues, gun control comes with a list of pros and cons. The people who staunchly support gun control believe their argument would protect society and save lives, while those opposing gun control believe the opposite. Potential for more crime " It"s long been suggested that having a gun allows would-be victims to protect themselves against crimes. Proponents of gun control often point to crime statistics as a sign that gun control would be a positive for society. However, people against gun control firmly believe that by having a gun, people could prevent many of those crimes from happening in the first place. Second amendment " The second amendment from The Bill of Rights grants private citizens the right to bear arms. Thus, people who stand firmly against gun control insist that no legislation, technically, should have the right to take away a citizen's guns without first repealing the amendment in question. Bad history " History appears to support the pro-gun crowd. Throughout various political regimes, the one constant of a tyrannical government has been the disarming of citizens. Thomas Jefferson once famously said: "No man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against the tyranny in government." The government has no right taking our rights away. My evidence of other countries with gun bans, I'm from Russia, i have experienced it, i have seen so many innocent people being killed and they can;t do anything about it."


http://www.opposingviews.com...

You see that text? It was copied and pasted from the link below. No mention of it whatsoever. Complete plagiarism.

Because of this, every single detail of that is no longer valid. Though I will still respond to the first part of your argument.


"[1]Well to answer the question of proof that every store that gets .22 ammunition is sold within an hour, is that i have experience, i have went on every box store and little owned gun stores and gun shows and rarely do you find .22 ammunition. people walk out of store wit thousands of rounds and if you are not the first 10 people at the door before opening your in bad luck. Here are some more of my back ups. [2] I also own a gun so does my whole family, sorry to say but you cant expect to live for a while one day you will get robbed and shot. You have a less chance surviving without a gun than with. Criminals are not normal in their head that's why they are criminals. [3] I had a best friend once that said she will never get shot and she didn't own a gun, well about a week later i found out that her whole family including her was shot by a criminal, and the police couldn't get there in time."

1. It is physically impossible for you to have been inside every single gun store in the U.S. within one hour of them restocking .22 ammunition.

2. Again, I have living family members who have never touched a gun in their lives, and are still here. There is no way that 100% of people without guns would be killed, otherwise the NRA would have no competition.

3. That's terrible! Can you please give me a link to the news article that mentions this (in the comments, of course)?
Debate Round No. 3
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by leojm 3 years ago
leojm
gee i'm sorry for forgetting to put quotations marks. i was in a hurry.
Posted by LotusNG 3 years ago
LotusNG
I'm losing a debate to someone who plagiarized.

How do you lose a debate to someone who plagiarizes? Shouldn't her 2nd argument be voided almost completely?
Posted by Phronesis 3 years ago
Phronesis
Our*
Posted by Phronesis 3 years ago
Phronesis
Understand this. Right now it's just Guns. Next thing you know it could be our Internet access and then are rights. You must understand rights are rights
Posted by leojm 3 years ago
leojm
Looking forward to it :D
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by Walrus101 3 years ago
Walrus101
leojmLotusNGTied
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Total points awarded:40 
Reasons for voting decision: Even though I support gun control, pro had better arguments.
Vote Placed by imabench 3 years ago
imabench
leojmLotusNGTied
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Total points awarded:02 
Reasons for voting decision: countering daniel
Vote Placed by danielawesome12 3 years ago
danielawesome12
leojmLotusNGTied
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Total points awarded:43 
Reasons for voting decision: Go Con