The Instigator
ArthurBlair
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Cliff.Stamp
Con (against)
Winning
18 Points

Had Babe Ruth played in the modern era of baseball, he would not have been the same player.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/20/2011 Category: Sports
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 1,281 times Debate No: 15506
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (4)
Votes (3)

 

ArthurBlair

Pro

Babe Ruth once held the home run record, holds the Yankee record for both career and single season average, set and held the single season home run record for decades, and revolutionized the game of baseball and turned it into the popular attraction it is today. However, I believe that, as I stated as my topic, had Babe Ruth played in the modern era of baseball, he would not have been the same player.
Cliff.Stamp

Con

To start, lets clarify the exact meaning of the resolution. Now it is obvious that "same player" does not mean same in the sense of being identical as people are not identical even from one day to the next. Babe Ruth started out a a very dominant left handed pitcher :

"During three seasons in Boston, Ruth was primarily a pitcher. In his first World Series, he pitched 29 2/3rds scoreless innings, breaking Christy Mathewson's record and setting a mark that would stand for 43 years" [1]

but the skill that he is mainly remembered for is of course his ability to bat :

"His lifetime slugging average of .690 has never been approached." [2]

Now would these numbers be the exact same if he played now, of course not, they would not be exactly the same if he started to play one year later, or if any of the teams he played against had any of the players changed. This is a trivial definition and not worth discussing. The only meaningful definition of same would be :

"unchanged in character" [3]

What really made the largest difference in regards to the influence that Ruth had in baseball - it was his character, his personality and simply his ability to sell and promote Baseball.

"He was also always telling everyone about the greatness of the game. "Baseball was, is and always will be to me the best game in the world," Ruth said. The joy that the Babe experienced every time he stepped onto the diamond was a refreshing reminder that gamblers and conspirators did not overrun baseball."

"His combined love of baseball and children produced one of the great salesmen the game has ever known. Ruth and the Yankees barnstormed across America and played in exhibition games against local teams. Whenever a child would ask him for an autograph, he happily obliged. He urged children to play ball on a sunny day in commercials. "I won't be happy until we have every boy in America between the ages of six and sixteen wearing a glove and swinging a bat," Ruth said. "

"Ruth's influence on youngsters extended far beyond his playing days. According to journalist Tom Meany, the majority of the letters Ruth received while fighting a losing battle against cancer were from children who were born soon before the Babe hung up his cap and glove for the last time. ... Ruth's influence on youth baseball can still be seen today in the many Babe Ruth leagues around the country. By actively selling the game to youngsters, Ruth ensured that baseball would enjoy continued success long after his career was over. " [4]

So let us consider success on the metric of one who made it is lifetime to study it, Napolean Hill

"Hill considered the turning point in his life to have occurred in the year 1908 with his assignment, as part of a series of articles about famous and successful men, to interview the industrialist Andrew Carnegie. At the time, Carnegie was one of the most powerful men in the world. Hill discovered that Carnegie believed that the process of success could be outlined in a simple formula that anyone would be able to understand and achieve. Impressed with Hill, Carnegie asked him if he was up to the task of putting together this information, to interview or analyze over 500 successful men and women, many of them millionaires, in order to discover and publish this formula for success.

As part of his research, Hill interviewed many of the most famous people of the time, including Thomas Edison, Alexander Graham Bell, George Eastman, Henry Ford, Elmer Gates, John D. Rockefeller, Sr., Charles M. Schwab, F.W. Woolworth, William Wrigley Jr., John Wanamaker, William Jennings Bryan, Theodore Roosevelt, William H. Taft and Jennings Randolph. Hill was also an advisor to two presidents of the United States of America, Woodrow Wilson and Franklin Delano Roosevelt." [5]

And what was the result of this lifetime of work - his comprehensive set of volumes on the laws of success[6]. Even a quick glance through Hill's work and the most brief reflection on Ruth would show that Ruth had, by his very nature, the character of success. Would his records be exactly the same numerically, obviously not, would he be successful - obviously yes, would he be so loved and respected - obviously yes. People respect passion and love of the sport as much or even more now than they did then.

[1], [2] http://www.u-s-history.com...

[3] http://dictionary.reference.com...

[4] http://xroads.virginia.edu...

[5] http://en.wikipedia.org...

[6] http://en.wikipedia.org...
Debate Round No. 1
ArthurBlair

Pro

ArthurBlair forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
ArthurBlair

Pro

ArthurBlair forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
ArthurBlair

Pro

ArthurBlair forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
ArthurBlair

Pro

ArthurBlair forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by Ore_Ele 5 years ago
Ore_Ele
Of course he wouldn't be the same. How are you debating that he would have been different? Do you believe he would have been better? Worse? Just an average power hitting geting 35 homeruns a season or something?
Posted by 1stLordofTheVenerability 5 years ago
1stLordofTheVenerability
I don't think it's necessary. For my part, I've never heard of Daniel Tosh. You'll just have to be sure to keep from plagiarazing whatever it is he stated...
Posted by ArthurBlair 5 years ago
ArthurBlair
i was unaware, should my debate be voided?
Posted by Ryanconqueso 5 years ago
Ryanconqueso
The main arguments made are coming from a Daniel Tosh stand-up
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by Zarroette 2 years ago
Zarroette
ArthurBlairCliff.StampTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: ff
Vote Placed by quarterexchange 5 years ago
quarterexchange
ArthurBlairCliff.StampTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: No contest
Vote Placed by BillBonJovi 5 years ago
BillBonJovi
ArthurBlairCliff.StampTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: full points to Con because Pro forfeited every other round he had