The Instigator
backwardseden
Pro (for)
Losing
2 Points
The Contender
ChurnedCreamery
Con (against)
Winning
3 Points

Here"s why god of the bible cannot possibly exist unless he is pure hate and evil

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
ChurnedCreamery
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/22/2017 Category: Religion
Updated: 12 months ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 597 times Debate No: 103276
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (7)
Votes (1)

 

backwardseden

Pro

Inside Edition: “Man Will Spend Life in Prison for Killing 5-Year-Old Stepdaughter After She Asked For Food”
“A Michigan man who stabbed his 5-year-old stepdaughter to death and then burned her body will spend the rest of his life in prison, a judge ruled Friday.”
That was a headline from what happened to a little girl for all she asked for was for some food because she was hungry. There’s absolutely no possible way that god according to the bible can possibly exist if he knowingly creates everybody if he is supposed to be kind, caring and loving.

Incidences like these happen far too often, well like on a daily basis or even more often than that here in this country. And if god is god and is omnipotent, he knows all too well that incidences like these are going to happen quadrillions of years in advance, long before they will happen. To knowingly create children to suffer is as evil and as hateful as it gets. You cannot get more evil and hate more than that if you wanted to.

ChurnedCreamery

Con

Your text presupposes the existence of an objective evil or hatred, I will explain why this can not be.
Morality is simply what you regard as "right" or "wrong", there can never be a set number of ideas or principles that a collective group agrees upon. Everyone feels differently about certain things, it is simply a matter of human perception.
I will support such a statement with factual evidence, it's simple really.
Take the laws of physics, set laws that everything in the known Universe must follow
Take morality,
A set of bound principles to differentiate what we perceive as good or wrong
Now that we've established that morality is subjective/relative, we can move onto my arguments.
1. Perception
It is very well likely, that we simply do not understand the principles that an omnipresent God possesses, this, of course, would have to accept the idea of an objective good or evil. If we do not know how an omnipotent God works, then we would not know the set good or bad. This, in turn, would lead us to be inconclusive, as the set good and bad are not known, thus we can not conclude that God is pure hatred.
2. The argument of free will
This will no doubt be the shortest of my arguments, it'll follow a premise conclusion argument rather than one consistent of words.
Negative choices will just suggest what causes harm upon others.
Positive choices: Choices we can make that do not cause harm to others
Premise: We are able to make choices
Premise: We have free will
Premise: If we were unable to make negative choices then we wouldn't have free will
Conclusion: We are able to make negative choices due to our actions being able to uphold positive or negative choices
Debate Round No. 1
backwardseden

Pro

OK If you can explain first god’s existence, then you would be the only person on this planet that can and or has ---ever--- been able to. Regardless let’s not be cynical and or abusive to you if you can present an intelligent and an educated argument in which only a handful of people have been able to.

“Morality is simply what you regard as "right" or "wrong",” Absolutely 100% false.
Do you believe that…
Murdering is wrong Y_____? N_____?
Rape is wrong Y_____? N_____?
Genocide/ deliberate genocide is wrong Y____? N_____?
Slavery is wrong Y_____ N_____?
Evil is wrong Y_____? N_____?
Suffering is wrong Y_____? N_____?

Of course if you have any common sense and integrity, that answer is a “no”. However in the bible and under god’s laws, rules and regulations, those answers are a “yes”, thus proving him to be morally bankrupt and corrupt. It also proves that this so-called “god” is truly incapable of handing out his business cards and running his office at the highest level. So this racist pig god should be kicked out on his horseth a$$eth with no questions asked at any time.

So if you have any trouble in agreeing with any of the answers from the above questions and saying for whatever reasons as a “yes”, then this conversation is over and i will no longer be speaking to you and you automatically lose this debate. Period.

And no its not a matter of perception at all.

Here’s a few examples of god’s deliberate genocides, which includes his deliberate murders, which includes his sufferings, which includes his slavery, etc etc etc,
Indeed god is far far far worse than Hitler, Mao, Pol Pot, Stalin, Hong Xiuquan combined. 3,000 EX 32:27-28, 14,700 NU 16:49, 24,002 NU 25: 1-11, 12,000 JOS 8: 1-25, 10,000 JG 1:4, 120,000 JG 8:7-10, 42,000 JG 12:3-6, 1,000 JD 15:14-15, 3,000 JD 16:27-30, 25,101 JD 16:27-30, 1 SAM 4 34,002, 1 SAM 6:19 50,070, 2 SAM 8 65,850, 1 KI 20: 28-29 100,000, 1 KI 20: 30 27,000, KI 19 35 -37 185,000, 2 CHR 13 17-18 500,000!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, 2 CHR 28:6 120,000, Esther 9:5-18 75,813 etc etc etc
Yeah god is really so moral huh? There’s no such a thing as “love” within any genocide.


1.Oh I understand god’s perception just fine. Until you can prove that god exists, he does not exist. I’m not going to sit around with gullibility with nothing tangible and expect to believe in thin= air. After all no one, not one single person has been able to prove god.
Ah yes, that good and evil love song. Strange isn’t it that your god survives on good and evil. Isn’t it interesting on how others don’t in comparison by any sense of the word “evil” because after all it isn’t taught nor practiced? Examples would be Buddhists, Hindu’s, quite a few native American Indian tribes until the greasy white fat pig christian brethren nearly wiped them out, the Inca, the aborigines, Gaia Mother Earth etc etc etc they all lived at peace in comparison to christians who made war with those who didn’t believe because it exactly what their god told them to do. Indeed christians are and were EVIL and their christians god freely admitted it several times in his “good” book. Wow what a true hypocritical contradiction. One of thousands in the ridiculous bible.
2. Well if you believe in god then you have no Free Will. None. I on the other hand choose to not believe in god therefore I have Free Will. This comes in several different points.
* Now you show me or anyone where in the bible, anywhere that god says something to the effect of "I the LORD thy god grants man free will." The fact of the matter is, is that it doesn't exist. Not anywhere. So in fact god does NOT grant you Free Will of any kind. Period.
* Another example in fact god shuts you down with Free Will all over his bible. A perfect example of that is one of the 10 commandments... Threatening people with death is taking Free Will away. Yet its violated every second of every day and people are NOT put to death. Hmm strange. So either this law and many others like it are so stone cold ridiculous and cannot possibly be followed and are not followed, or god does not exist to make sure that they are put into play.
remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy - violates the freedom of religion/choice/expression (um nope, god wouldn’t care)
Exodus 31:13-15 “Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you. 14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. 15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death."
Now how many violate that law, rule and regulation and many others like them and are NOT put to death? Regardless, a bit harsh, horrifying and truly silly don't you think? And there's no way that it can possibly be put into place, especially into today's modern society. I mean how shocking do you have to be?
* Heaven - When she dies does she get to go to heaven? If she gets to go to heaven will she be happy? And she’ll probably say “yes”. And you say “Will you be able to choose and do anything you want while you are in heaven?” And she’ll say “yes.” And so you are basically saying “you’ll have free will in heaven?” So you have free will in heaven and no one is being hurt, raped, so you can do anything you want and no one gets hurt. If god has that power in heaven, he must have that power on earth. So he’s chose not to set that condition/ toggle switch which means he’s a dick. Phil Ferguson
* god himself does NOT have free will IF he knows his future. After all, how can he if he is omnipotent because he will have already known his choices that have been chosen? That is NOT Free Will. So if YOUR god does not have Free Will and the ability to choose, most definitely man does NOT have Free Will and the ability to choose. Got it? And you can try and snake and dance your way around the issues, as 100% of all christians do, around the issues all you want. It will only lead you---right---back---here---this---moment------in---time.
* This god guy can easily take the evil and hate out of Free Will such as the brutal rape, beating and torturing of a 6 year old girl as an example. But no, he doesn't. He leaves it in. Thus that absolutely proves that this god IS EVIL(and he freely admits it several times is HIS bible. Would you like the verses?) AND IS BASED ON HATE as he truly hates children and knowingly creates children to suffer. WHAT? What kind of supreme deity does this? (would you like the verses?) And its the children that suffer and its daddy that doesn't get punished when he sticks his you know what inside of his daughter while punching her in the face sometimes twice per week for 17 years. Sick. But god creates Free Will huh? Um no. Um not a chance. Once again, if god is god loving kind and caring, in which he is clearly not, he can take the evil and hate out of free will. But no. He leaves evil in Free Will. What a joke. So this god of yours loves suffering, pain, hate, evil and wow does he prove it. And that’s entirely what you believe in IF you believe in god.
So god gives daddy the Free Will to commit his atrocities and gives him more value.
And god gives the kids no Free Will to escape from daddy's arms, to SCREAM at the top of their lungs as he treats them like trash. god truly hates children in his bible with neglect as they are also ignored, the worst form of child abuse.
Tracie Harris: "Your question was regarding free will as an argument for allowing suffering. That's when you get into the problem of evil. Now the problem of evil as we all know is not an argument that demonstrates that no god exists or that god exists. What it demonstrates is that god is your god is an a$$eth. What she's telling you is she believes in a god, and I assume she worships this god? Its like is she 'happy' about her god?" Caller: "Oh oh yeah everything except for the old testament." Tracie "In other words what she is saying is 'I love this god who believes that the free will of the rapist is more important than the free will of the child being raped. That I think that its worth it to have a child be raped because I really really put a high value on a rapist's free will.’"
* Yeah right, like he’s really going to take the chance at someone who is not on track to go ahead a go off the grid and ruin his supposed almighty “plan”? What’s the point in being god if there isn’t that control? What’s the point if that plan is disrupted by some fool who has Free Will and goes ahead with his Free Will and ruins god’s plan because he has Free Will?
* What about the Free Will of Hitler, Mao, Pol Pot, Hong Xiuquan, Stalin, serial killers, torturers, rapists, sodomizers, pedophiles, etc etc etc. But they are all created in god's image.
* Do you really think that if god can create the universe in 6 days, that he is NOT going to control your Free Will? Are you insane? Of course he is.

Summary
Indeed if you believe in god, the only way he can possibly exist is if he is nothing more than pure hate and evil
ChurnedCreamery

Con

My opponent may deem that I must attack his premises and disprove them, unfortunately, I do not as all his premises take the existence of God as given.
"Indeed if you believe in God, the only way he can possibly exist is if he is nothing more than pure hate and evil"
These words, in themselves,
"Here"s why god of the bible cannot possibly exist unless he is pure hate and evil"
We can not, and will not, argue the existence of a God in a debate arguing the morality of a God. This can not be done as you can not find one without presupposing the other, hence in this debate, we will take the existence of God as a given. Therefore, my argument of objective good and evil is not disproven as he may have hoped.
This is also to stop the argument from becoming a straw man (About the existence of God where we would have to diverge into quantum fluctuations & such).
"So if you have any trouble in agreeing with any of the answers from the above questions and saying for whatever reasons as a "yes", then this conversation is over and I will no longer be speaking to you and you automatically lose this debate. Period. "
No, I don't, this was not set in the rules beforehand when I agreed so I have full power to win this debate no matter my opinion on this matter as what I see to be morally correct is not necessarily what a God would see as morally correct.
My opponent bases himself on how he views an objective good or bad, rather than what a God would view as objectively bad, therefore a majority of his arguments are invalid.
I will address the ones that I view as valid, for now.
"Do you really think that if god can create the universe in 6 days, that he is NOT going to control your Free Will? Are you insane? Of course he is. "
No, hence why the God of the Bible is seen as a loving and caring God rather than the ones in Roman times or any other God for that matter.
Summary:
Nothing my opponent said came close to refuting my arguments and he based himself on the idea of an objective good and bad.
Debate Round No. 2
backwardseden

Pro

I have to continue this debate because there are a few things that were not mentioned in the previous rounds. So we will bounce around a bit.

Something that wasn’t talked about in these debates thus far is that god is evil and hateful enough to have created the children to suffer.
god knowingly created the 5-Year-Old Stepdaughter After She Asked For Food. He knowingly knew quadrillions of years in advance that she would suffer horrifically at the hands of this stepfather while she was being stabbed to death. To knowingly create children to suffer is as evil and as hateful as it gets. You cannot get more evil and as hateful than that if you wanted to. Oh yeah your god is as immoral as it gets. Btw, since when did this child have the FREE WILL to say “no” while she was being stabbed to death?
So my opponent believes in and evil, immoral and hateful god.

“My opponent may deem that I must attack his premises and disprove them,” Yeah. That’s what a debate is. Every single one of them, a true atrocity has committed at least 5 times in his bible. But you don’t have the answers. That’s why I listed them. I knew 100% that you have no counter as you tried to change the subject and come up with a truly miserable excuse. But all you did is wade yourself in concrete in a baby pool without a paddle.

My opponent neatly ignores the evil’s of god and pretends that god is always good. But then again how can god be good when he knowingly creates evil, commits evil AND when he freely admits that he is evil?
Btw since when is evil a necessity, a need, or a requirement? Only in god’s seedy little world.
* Strange isn’t it that in comparison that the Inca, many of the native American Indian tribes until your white man greasy sweaty racist pig christian wiped them out, the aborigines, Hindu’s, Gaia Mother Earth, Buddhists etc they do not practice nor preach nor go to war over their religions, not anywhere close to the evils nor hate that the christians do. Now why is that? Yet according to your god worshiping other gods is considered to be the most evil thing there is and you should be stoned to death for it. Well then great. You follow your lord’s orders and you come on down here and stone me to death. Whatsamatter? You are not going to follow your god’s orders? Why? Why not?

Here’s your god freely admitting that he is evil. So will you take your god’s word that he is evil or not?
Isaiah 45:7 "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things."

2 Samuel 12:11-14 11 Thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will raise up evil against thee out of thine own house, and I will take thy wives before thine eyes, and give them unto thy neighbour, and he shall lie with thy wives in the sight of this sun. 12 For thou didst it secretly: but I will do this thing before all Israel, and before the sun. 13 And David said unto Nathan, I have sinned against the LORD. And Nathan said unto David, The LORD also hath put away thy sin; thou shalt not die.14 Howbeit, because by this deed thou hast given great occasion to the enemies of the LORD to blaspheme, the child also that is born unto thee shall surely die. (theevilbible.com) [The child dies seven days later.] This has got to be one of the sickest quotes of the Bible. God himself brings the completely innocent rape victims to the rapist. What kind of pathetic loser would do something so evil? And then he kills a child! This is sick, really sick!

1KI 22: 22-23 “And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so. 23 Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil concerning thee.”

2 Chronicles 18:22,”Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil against thee.”

Lamentations 3:38 “Out of the mouth of the most High proceedeth not evil and good?”

Jeremiah 18:11 “Now therefore go to, speak to the men of Judah, and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, saying, Thus saith the LORD; Behold, I frame evil against you, and devise a device against you: return ye now every one from his evil way, and make your ways and your doings good.”

Jeremiah 19:3 “And say, Hear ye the word of the LORD, O kings of Judah, and inhabitants of Jerusalem; Thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel; Behold, I will bring evil upon this place, the which whosoever heareth, his ears shall tingle.”

Amos 3:6 “Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it?”

And more evil verses… DT 30: 15, 2 Kings 22:16, 2 Kings 22:20, JU 9:23, JH 19:15, JH 23:12


My opponent has stated nothing on HIS “free will” issue which is something that he brought up. So obviously he has conceded that one and it is his god that is ultimately responsible for everything. Since god is responsible for everything, then he is ultimately responsible for evil and hate.

So let’s divulge deeper into the Free Will issue…
Here’s some questions and statements for yesterday’s Atheist Experience and they are humdingers as they dig into philosophy as well as free will thus proving once again that if you believe in your god that you have no free will, none. Its irrefutable.
* Tracie Harris “Let’s say that if I knew if I had a child and it would go out and murder, like it would become the next Hitler, and I said ‘I’m going to have this baby and I KNOW that this is going to happen, how am I NOT responsible for it?”
Do you understand what she is saying? Or is that required to be blurbed to you?
More on that…
* Tracie “Did he know what it would be before he created it or not? Could he have chosen other universes with other outcomes?”
Matt Dillahunty “Could he have chosen another universe where you were holding my position? and I was there holding your position?”
Caller “Sure”
Matt “Then he chose this particular universe…”
Tracie “And we didn’t have choices. He put it into production and put in into play and he knew what we were all going to do. He knew what Tracie would do from start to finish before she did it and---he---chose---for---that---Tracie.”
Matt “Yeah if he didn’t make a choice, if this was the only universe he could create, knowing what would happen doesn’t make him responsible. But the triple threat of knowing what would happen, choosing this particular one, and creating it, that’s how you get to the responsibility. An action, knowing the outcome that could have been different means that he chose this universe. And he chose this one in which I’m destined for annihilation or hell assuming I don’t change my mind...”
Tracie “Then blamed us that we should die for it, then killed killed his own child/ himself to atone for us.”
Matt “Its really weird.”
Yeah. Man has no Free Will IF you believe in god. None.


And now “we” can get to your ridiculous statements.
“We can not, and will not, argue the existence of a God in a debate arguing the morality of a God.” First off, who is this “we”. No its you. You stand all alone on that one. And that proves if you don’t then you are truly incapable of thinking, reasoning, rationalizing, using common sense and using logic on your own. But you NEED god as a necessity and as a requirement. I don’t. In fact no one does. That’s been proven since the dawn of man.
By you stating that it means that you believe that you cannot question your god. So how can you tell right from wrong, up from down, good from evil, what is moral and immoral? Have you read your bible? Do you know that murdering is morally wrong and raping a woman is morally wrong? Apparently not. But not according to your god in his bible.
Yeah I can imagine you murdering and raping a woman and then you claiming that while you are on the stand that well in the bible its morally correct according to god. Yep. They’d probably lock you up, throw away the key and execute you. Oh but wait, you’d still make it to heaven for believing in your precious little christ while I would not for having done nothing wrong for not believing. Well goodie for me. All the more reason for not believing. Now that’s evil, racist and morally wrong according to your god. So don’t talk to me about morality.


My opponent bases himself on how he views an objective good or bad, rather than what a God would view as objectively bad,” Rubbish. As stated in the previous round its all listed there right there in YOUR bible as an A+ positive good and love song huggable cherished christmas tune “yes” .So what if its pure terrorism and if its to your weepy saddened teary eyed disagreement, it happens to be true. Oh and btw, god doesn’t objectively view them as bad, he sees them as his charm school bracelets. But you don’t know that. That’s because, rather blatantly and obviously, you don’t read your bible just like nearly 80% of those who claim themselves to be christians don’t read their bible’s. Please, oh pretty please with beef jerky and sugar on top do try harder.. So you had to invent that excuse, as nearly all christians do (hey its either that or they scurry for the rodent field) yet again and flat out lie to make yourself look like a tire iron squashing an ant when its really me who is obviously intelligent and educated in comparison to you on the issue of your god when you have none. Therefore what arguments of yours are valid? None.

Tracie Harris “Why doesn’t god answer any of these great theological questions? Is it trust that he’s got good reason for not answering these questions?”

Summary
If you are going to state something, then you should at the very least try to back it up with evidence. god doesn’t have any evidence. He only has faith.
ChurnedCreamery

Con

My opponent once again tries to represent an objective good and evil, which we have already established can not be known. We can therefore not carry out any other ideas or principles into this debate as it will just lead to our views of morality.
My opponent once again views certain actions as objectively good or bad, take this thought experiment.
Was the death of Hitler objectively good?
Was the death of a child in Africa objectively good?
No, neither were objectively good or bad, as my opponent is a moral realist, he will disagree, which I am fine with. But we must first and foremost, establish that the existence of anything is objectively good or bad is not only illogical but impossible.
I will now move onto refuting all his arguments at once: There is no way of knowing what is objectively good, no way of thinking what an objectively good or bad God may think, there is only perception.
Now we must establish the existence of God in this scenario to be given
If we are to look upon the existence of an Evi or Good God, we must establish his existence in this scenario to be absolute. The existence of God must be taken as absolute as for a reason to critique the course of his actions.
Summary:
Nothing my opponent said came close to refuting my arguments and he based himself on the idea of an objective good and bad.
Debate Round No. 3
backwardseden

Pro

My opponent once again tries to invent excuses and evade what is out forth to him. Wow boring. So once again he proves that he does not know how to debate with evidence. Its either that or he does not know what the difference is between good and evil is. Its either that or he does not know what the difference is between right and wrong is. Its either that or he does not know what the difference is between what is immoral and moral is. Its either that or he does not know what the difference is between what right and wrong is. Its either that or he does not know what the difference is between up and down is. Its either that or he does not know what the difference is between right and left is. Its either that or he does not know what the difference between having an intelligence and an edumacation verses being utterly stupid and etc etc etc. Wow um no. Actually its my opponent who clearly does not know what the difference is between anything is as he blankly has to automatize the world and stare blankly at it. Only christians do this. And they try to justify their positions by thinking voidly that murder, rape, war, hate, needless death, anger, wrath, fury, rage, jealousy, evil is somehow perfectly OK whereas no---other---group---of---people---on---earth---would. No one.

“My opponent once again tries to represent an objective good and evil, which we have already established can not be known.” No ---we--- haven’t. Because its only YOU as stated. Learn to read please. Because ---we--- have, those that are moral, unlike you. Those who know the difference between good and bad, what is moral and immoral. And clearly you don’t because you worship a god that praises the bad and immorality. Here's some videos to help you with your wayward troubles.
https://www.youtube.com... 6:45 thru the end
https://www.youtube.com... When the bible states a man rapes he rapes a woman he has to marry her 4:30, the bible explicitly sanctions slavery. How is that moral? 8:45, Ex 21:1
https://www.youtube.com... Objective Morality


“Our views of morality”? Well yours as a christian are clearly wrong.
Here’s you as an example…
Oh I get it, so if you as a christian were to see a gay person kissing another man and then see someone raping a 6 year old child, you'd call the police on the gay couple. Good job in proving just how badly we need christians in this country because it is only christians that opposes being gay at such high levels here on this soil. However, thankfully christianity is fading and failing fast and rightly so. Don't you christians have better things to do with your time like helping others like the 6 year olds being raped? Isn’t that what YOUR religion is supposed to teach you? But then again it doesn’t teach you that at all now does it? It in fact it teaches you to hate. That’s because god is based entirely on hate which is so ridiculously easy to prove as god hates children. The hate has gotta stop people. christians need to become responsible and own up to their stupid mind numbing that don’t--make--any--sense--stances. christianity has lost 5.1% of its following since 2007 and atheism has doubled. 5.1% is a huge number. Rightly. Justly.

Its not “our” morality” that is screwed up. Its yours that is screwed up because you can’t even identify with it. But you certainly can identify with immorality as its splattered all over your bible with all of its hate. But then again, you haven’t read your bible. That’s one of the major problem with christianity. Its not that hard to figure that one out and it doesn’t take a crystal ball that glows in the dork.

“Was the death of Hitler objectively good?” That’s a really stupid question. I mean its really stupid. Your god should have never created Hitler to begin with. Now what part of that don’t you get and or not understand?
“Was the death of a child in Africa objectively good?” Was there suffering and pain involved? See you have no evidence to put forth with your lame brained mundane questions that you spitoon forward. So why ask me?
“No, neither were objectively good or bad,” Oh really? Well billions, well actually um no, nearly 100% of this planet’s population would disagree with you on the death of Hitler thingy that you sprawled out.
Now ask yourself why you do not have the ability to think, reason, rationalize, use common sense and use logic? I’ll tell you why… Its because your god, religion nor bible does not require a single sliver of it. And you just proved it.

We’re done. This debate is over. You lose. With what you have to say it is so clear that you like so many christians, especially here on this particular website has no genuine friends or loved ones. What do I mean by genuine? Those that will go way way wayyyyyyy out of their way to help you out in time of dire need and never ask you a single question. For that I cannot even pity you. But you did it to yourself. You deserve it. You will die alone.

Summary
As usual my opponent has presented absolutely no evidence whatsoever. Certainly no evidence that anybody will agree with except for a very small band of innocent christians who are truly gullible and do not know any better.
A god/ supreme deity would not rely on faith. A god/ supreme deity would present evidence and not continually state radical opinions.
So its over and out for this debate and I wish my opponent the best and I truly hope he thinks about things before he voices his opinions without evidence, otherwise he will find himself in a world of………………… tribulation and torment.
ChurnedCreamery

Con

At this point, this isn't a debate, it's just denial
Vote Con please
Pro has clearly shown that he is delusional, even to the point where he tries to point out an objective good and evil. He has never successfully proved the existence of an objective good and evil and is using ad hominems constantly. He has shown to be unable to see the difference between black and knight, he is in such denial that he is filled with constant rhetoric, unable to refute any of my rebuttals.
Nothing he has said has disproved the non-existence of an objective good and evil, rather he has proven it to all be in his gaze. He has made claims presenting no evidence, I know quite a few people that believed in national socialism and more that think that the death of people is neither good nor bad.
The truth of the matter is that pro is delusional, all his arguments have been focused on the existence of God and he is having a conflict with himself. I also want to make it clear that I am not a Christian, rather I came here for a good debate, not some delusional man making statements about how God is evil without proving the existence of an objective good and evil.
Proof that nothing he says is objective: I disagree with him first and foremost
Vote con please, thanks for reading.
Debate Round No. 4
7 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 7 records.
Posted by ChurnedCreamery 12 months ago
ChurnedCreamery
From your first debate
"Let me remind everyone why I dropped out. It was because I have never met a more hateful, egotistical, and closed minded person so far on this site and continuing would be a waste if my time. Every argument I have and any evidence I shared was completely ignored, and I just wanted to cut it off. He is welcome to ignore me, but the people are to decide who wins here. Again, my opponent is extremely unpleasant to debate with and I do hope an admin on this site brings him up to date on what is allowed, because he has harassed and ridiculed anyone who disagrees with him do far. God bless you all, including my opponent, and go have a wonderful summer. Thank you."
Posted by canis 12 months ago
canis
There is no "why"..only "does"...Just like "santa"..
Posted by backwardseden 12 months ago
backwardseden
@ Lilieze I once had a friend who was raped, beaten and tortured by her stepfather at the age of 4 once per week, sometimes twice per week at the age of 4 all the way up until 17. That was only the start of her horrors. So she runs away. She gets married. They have a kid. They get a divorce. The state takes their kid. She attempts suicide by jumping off of a high dive into a pool with no water. Of course she survives. It breaks her back so she can scarcely walk. Of course the hospitals will not give her painkillers. So she starts to turn tricks so she can get her crack to kill the pain. Then she gets AIDS and dies. I seriously doubt if she had a happy week in her entire life. I once asked her what she asked most in her life and she said a "family". I would have happily put a ring on her finger if she was not terribly addicted to her crack. She also asked me if I believed in god and I said "No, not because of what he has put you through. That's a bunch of B.S. and what other this god puts CHILDREN through in their lifetimes. No 'loving, caring god would EVER do anything like this."
Of course that's not the real reason why I do not believe in god. But its as good as any. When I was 14, two of my christian friends and I, I was jewish, we were comparing our bible's and my torah printed in English. We noticed that the book of Ruth was out of chronological order. They being so smug and thinking that they were right, we took it to their pastor. He said "Well maybe its us that's wrong." BANG! If one book is out of chronological order, then the entire text is out of order.
Then I started to read the bible and all of its mistakes, its uncounted horrors, its terrors, anger, wrath, commandments and laws that nobody can possibly follow, its hate that this god represents and commits unto his people, its truly laughable miracles that nobody can possibly take seriously, contradictions etc... I'm not gullible and there's nothing tangible to prove anything that the bible shows.
Posted by Lilieze 12 months ago
Lilieze
Pro is an incredibly biased and delusional person, it kinda hurts to read his "logical" arguments.
Posted by backwardseden 1 year ago
backwardseden
I mean come on. How can anyone distinguish this. I mean come on. It doesn"t make any sense. It doesn"t matter how its translated. It doesn"t matter what version. If it was written by an omnipotent being there would be ONE VERSION. And there would be only ONE WAY to interpret it because it would be written well." Amon Ra
Actually it wouldn"t be written at all. What"s wrong with your god comin" down and talking to people? "Hey you know some of that stuff that"s in the book? I"m here to correct it." Matt Dillahunty

We have to rely on copies of copies of anonymous authors with no originals and the textural testimony to a miracle for example, there"s no amount of reports, anecdotal reports that is sufficient to justify in believing that actually happened as reported. And anything that would qualify as a god would clearly understand this and if it wanted to clearly convey this to people in a way that is believable would not be relying on ---TEXT--- to do so. And this to me is the nail in the coffin for christianity. The god that christians believe in is amazingly ---STUPID---!!! If it actually wants to achieve its goal by spreading its word to humanity by relying on text, by relying on languages that die off, by relying on anecdotal testimony, that"s not a pathway to truth. And anything that would qualify for a god would know this.which shows either god does not exist or doesn"t care enough about the people to understand the nature of evidence to actually present it. Now which of those two possibilities is accurate?

Oh absolutely its god's fault. You think that god is going to create the universe in 6 days and its NOT going to be?
"since all humans must die in the first death"? I guess you must be thinking of Hinduism and not the actual god according to the bible. OK. Then your entire conversation up until that point falls apart and you need to redefine what you are talking about.
Posted by backwardseden 1 year ago
backwardseden
@Perussi If you believe in god then you have no Free Will. None unless you believe in pure hate and evil of god. That was just proved in round two that was just posted which is irrefutable. Wow are you so gullibility brainwashed. You can't even prove your god exists so you have to come up with the excuse "That's why the bible was even created, to teach us so we can be saved from our sins." In which you clearly don't know what you are squawking about.
Does every man sin?
Yes. There is no man who does not sin (I Kings 8:46; see also 2 Chronicles 6:36; Proverbs 20:9; Ecclesiastes 7:20; and I John 1:810)
No. True Christians cannot possibly sin, because they are the children of God. Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is a child of God.. (I John 5:1). We should be called children of God; and so we are (I John 3: 1). He who loves is born of God (I John 4:7). No one born of God commits sin; for Gods nature abides in him, and he cannot sin because he is born of God (I John 3:9). But, then again, Yes! If we say we have no sin we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us (I John 1:8)
So you got caught in a super massive hypocritical contradiction, one of thousands in YOUR bible leaving you completely confused, just like everybody else.
Well no so-called god and or supreme deity would ever ever ever create a "bible" in text form, the worst form of communication so we could all get it wrong.
"If god is all knowing and he knows the future of all events and he wrote a book that can only be interpreted as if it endorses slavery and if its heinous violence against your children against your neighbors" how could a god be that omnipotent and devise a book where we can"t distinguish between the law of Israel and god"s law? I mean their interwoven where we have metaphor and fact and nobody can distinguish the two. We don"t know what we"re supposed to take figuratively. We don"t know what we"re supposed to take literally. Was it actually a tree? I mean come on.
Posted by Perussi 1 year ago
Perussi
We have free will- that's why. And people do evil with it. That's why the bible was even created, to teach us so we can be saved from our sins. It ain't god's fault. And anything we do in the first life doesn't matter (the book of Ecclesiastes). It also doesn't matter how we will die since all humans must die in the first death. Which is just dying as anybody would define it.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Luxray2854 12 months ago
Luxray2854
backwardsedenChurnedCreameryTied
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Total points awarded:23 
Reasons for voting decision: First off, I'd like to say that this was an incredibly interesting debate, and I won't take my vote lightly. First, I have to give a point to Pro. Their use of sources was really solid, and it did help him build his case. I have to say though, from my perspective, Con did have a much better debate. He raised a solid point in round 1 that was never really refuted by Pro, and instead, Pro just rambles on, attempting to prove god is evil, but never gives a solid response to Con's point (where he states an objective good and evil cannot be known). Good work by Con, and because of that, I have to give him the points.