The Instigator
wjmelements
Pro (for)
Losing
26 Points
The Contender
bored
Con (against)
Winning
46 Points

Homosexuals already have the same rights of marriage as heterosexuals.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 12 votes the winner is...
bored
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/14/2009 Category: Politics
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 4,623 times Debate No: 7834
Debate Rounds (2)
Comments (13)
Votes (12)

 

wjmelements

Pro

I am of course referring to human homosexuals living within the United States.

DEFINITIONS:
same- Conforming in every detail http://www.thefreedictionary.com...
rights to marriage- (divided up)
right- Something that is due to a person or governmental body by law, tradition, or nature http://www.thefreedictionary.com...
marriage- The legal union of a man and woman as husband and wife http://www.thefreedictionary.com...
(though my opponent may prefer:)
marriage- The state of being married; wedlock http://www.thefreedictionary.com...

This is a heavy burden on myself, but the first round of this debate shall be reserved to definitions and clarifications, and the second round shall be reserved for arguments.
bored

Con

Thank you very much; I look forward to this debate.
I shall try to restrict myself to definitions, however, I think my opponent covered most of the direct denotations but I would like to cover some general concepts.

The Constitution of the United States does not mention marriage between either heterosexuals or homosexuals. However, the Supreme Court Justices have.
"When the Court decides to hear a case, it usually does so for one of two reasons. Many cases that reach the Court involve an important question of constitutional interpretation that the Court wants to decide. In other cases, the Court chooses to resolve a "split among the circuits". There are twelve different federal circuit courts of appeal, and sometimes these appeals courts will reach different decisions in different cases on an important legal issue. The Court will then decide to take one of the cases to resolve the issue. " http://www.essortment.com...

Therefore, the Supreme Court Justices are the ones who interpret the constitution and constitutional law. However, the Constitution never mentions marriage at all. In that case, the Supreme Court should keep out of it, but they're not. I say 'they' because every state has a Supreme Court, and so far there are four states whose Supreme Courts have ruled homosexual marriage as legal.

I shall reserve my arguments for the next round:)
Debate Round No. 1
wjmelements

Pro

I thank my opponent for accepting this debate.

---------------
BURDEN:
I must prove that Homosexuals have the same rights of marriage as heterosexuals.
--------------
CASE:

A heterosexual man has the following rights to marriage: He can marry 1 woman (and in 4 states, 1 man). http://www.usmarriagelaws.com...
A heterosexual woman has the following rights to marriage: She can marry 1 man (and in 4 states, 1 woman). http://www.usmarriagelaws.com...

The 14th ammendment grants all people "equal protection" under the law. http://www.usconstitution.net...
Because of the 14th ammendment, these same rights are bestowed on homosexuals:

A homosexual man has the following rights to marriage: He can marry 1 woman (and in 4 states, 1 man). http://www.usmarriagelaws.com...
A homosexual woman has the following rights to marriage: She can marry 1 man (and in 4 states, 1 woman). http://www.usmarriagelaws.com...
---------------
CONCLUSION:
Both homosexual men and heterosexual men have the same rights to marriage.
Both homosexual women and heterosexual women have the same rights to marriage.
So, on can conclude that both homosexuals and heterosexuals have the same rights.

I thank my opponent for this debate.
bored

Con

I thank my opponent very much for his promptness.

However, I am afraid to let a misconception go by on a terminology technicality.

It is true that both a heterosexual and a homosexual have equal opportunity to change his/her beliefs and marry someone permitted by law, but that does not entitle them to the same rights!

Heterosexuals are able to marry whomever they want. This is absolutely true, based upon the definition (sorry, I should have put this in earlier, I suppose) http://www.medterms.com...
that heterosexuals are attracted to members of the opposite sex!
therefore, a heterosexual would have no problem in today's legal system.

A homosexual, on the other hand does have a problem. In forty six out of the fifty states of America, he or she is not allowed to the same 'pursuit of happiness' that a heterosexual is. Only four states have legally approved the homosexual's right to happiness. Even there, they are not all united. Iowa has recently approved homosexual marriage.
***************
""It's, quite frankly, a disaster," said Brian English, a spokesman for the Iowa Family Policy Center, a nonprofit research and educational organization committed to strengthening the family.

"Obviously, we're extremely disappointed," he said. "We're saddened. Perhaps a little bit surprised in the unanimous decision that the court handed down."

English, who said opponents of gay marriage prayed outside the courthouse Friday as they awaited the court's decision, already has begun lobbying the legislature for an Iowa Marriage Amendment."
********************

how often do you hear that the idea of a heterosexual couple's marriage is disastrous or saddening?

Therefore, homosexuals do not have the same rights as heterosexuals, neither in the minds of the public nor the views of 92% of the state courts in America.

Thank you,
please vote Con.
Debate Round No. 2
13 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by wjmelements 8 years ago
wjmelements
This debate was over whether or not homosexuals and heterosexuals already have the same rights OF MARRIAGE. While they cannot pursue happiness the same, in the terms of the debate, I affirmed the resolution.
Posted by bored 8 years ago
bored
The Constitution states that we are all allowed the right to the pursuit of happiness, in whatever way we deem best, as long as it does no harm to others. http://www.usconstitution.net...
the government is here to enforce that rule.
Clearly, homosexuals do not have the same rights in accordance to the pursuit of happiness as heterosexuals.
The pro argument is like saying that facilities should not have to be made handicapped accessible because handicapped and strong people already have the same rights.
Posted by fresnoinvasion 8 years ago
fresnoinvasion
Mongeese learned something new in English class!

Good job to the con debater.
Posted by Alex 8 years ago
Alex
But it's right
Posted by Alex 8 years ago
Alex
"it seems like when a kid who wants a swimming pool, makes his parents life unbearable until the parent gives in, they spend all their savings to buy the backyard pool to make the child happy. Then the kid never swims in it, but instead stands on the deck and pees in it."

Not mine i just found it.
Posted by Alex 8 years ago
Alex
The fact that homosexuals AND heterosexuals have the exact same restrictions on marriage technically means they have the same rights.

Neither party can marry someone of the same gender.
Both parties can be with whomever they want in a civil union.

EXACT SAME RIGHTS

Rights and wants of rights are different, however they have the same
Posted by wjmelements 8 years ago
wjmelements
In what way do you suppose that homosexuals and heterosexuals have different rights?
Posted by alto2osu 8 years ago
alto2osu
Kind of snide assuming we don't know what ethos, pathos, and logos mean...

Either way, the logos of rights theory is still intact. Having the same ability and the same right are not the same thing. Rhetoric aside, how is the ability to do something the same as the right to do something?
Posted by mongeese 8 years ago
mongeese
I think that bored's ETHOS arguments pale in comparison to wjmelement's LOGOS arguments.

Don't know what I said? Look 'em up.
Posted by alto2osu 8 years ago
alto2osu
I think that the con wins on the distinction of rights. It isn't enough that men can all marry any woman they want and women can all marry any man they want. Considering that our own founding documents call for our ability to pursue our own happiness (so long as that doesn't rob another of their liberty, which homosexual marriage does not), marrying someone of a sex that you are not biologically compatible with is not fulfilling that right to pursue happiness.

In other words, heterosexual and homosexual have the same ability to marry as each other, but not the same rights. For rights to be equal, sex must be taken out of the equation.
12 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Vote Placed by brycef 8 years ago
brycef
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Vote Placed by wjmelements 8 years ago
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Vote Placed by bored 8 years ago
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Vote Placed by alto2osu 8 years ago
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