The Instigator
ViceRegent
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
bartol
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points

How do atheists rationally know truth from fiction?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/16/2016 Category: Religion
Updated: 9 months ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,546 times Debate No: 86650
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (115)
Votes (0)

 

ViceRegent

Con

Atheists love to live under the delusion that they are the guardians of rationality. But how can they hold this title when they cannot even articulate a rational way to know truth from fiction. If they cannot do this, they are literally ignorant and the ignorant cannot guard anything. So, what atheist can give me a rational way atheist know truth from fiction?

IF YOU DO NOT KNOW HOW TO TELL TRUTH FROM FICTION, DO NOT RESPOND TO THIS DEBATE.

And please do not respond if you have responded before or if you admit you have no way of rationally know truth from fiction, or if you believe you make up your own reality, or if all you have is "science", for science relies on the your senses and reason, which begs the question of how you know your senses and reason are valid. Perhaps you can tell me, which is fine, but if the way you validate you senses and reason is with your senses and reason, you lose the debate because circular reasoning is not rational.
bartol

Pro

You cannot say atheists have the same opinion or the same point of view on certain aspects(reality,in this case), just because they have the same opinion in one thing. Reality and fiction aren't constant either, as they change depending on if the person is under the influence of narcotics, alcohol, etc. Whoever told you that atheists are the guardians of rationality is wrong, because a person may believe in god(s) can also believe in scientific and rational conclusions, for atheist and believers are different in one spiritual aspect. Atheists may not even believe in science as a rational explanation, making them not believe in anything and thus negating the existence of everything including themselves, and the whole reality-fiction concept you asked for doesn't exist in the minds of those atheists. However, as we atheists aren't the same, there are those who find that reality is purely in the minds of those atheists who believe in something other than gods. Therefore, if we only follow the rational, morale, which is irrational, doesn't exist. And if morale doesn't exist, what is stopping us from abandoning every rule or aspect that keeps us in order, embrace the irrational and become savages. If we embrace the irrational, however, we also embrace morale and thus create a paradox. And that paradox defines us atheists from other atheists and believers, and sets the border for reality and fiction. If the border between reality and fiction is clearly set(and I'm getting the impression that you want just that) how are all humans, atheist or religious different than one another).
Debate Round No. 1
ViceRegent

Con

All those words, and this unreasoning animal still did not tell me how he rationally knows truth from fiction. Amazing.
bartol

Pro

The reason I used morale as a factor in my previous post is because, like reality, it depends on the person. Everyone has their own sense of morale which can easily be influenced and/or changed, like someone's sense of reality. I don't want to sound like a hipster, but only you can decide the border between fiction and reality. It is impossible for me to do it for you, so I really don't see the point in making a debate like this. If it was possible to make a distinct, non-changing border between reality and fiction, there would be no crime. Think about it.
Debate Round No. 2
ViceRegent

Con

There you have it, another atheist fool who thinks reality is subjective, which is another way of saying he has no rational way of knowing fact from fiction and that he is delusional. I win. Who is next?
bartol

Pro

Please ViceRegent, there are still 2 rounds left. Act your age and think about what I said in the previous post. I haven't stated that I don't know the border between reality and fiction, I simply said that the border is purely subjective. You may follow various commands and rules that are made to be the border, if you will. There are some basic things that may be the border. It depends on you, the society around you, the political form of your country and other.
Debate Round No. 3
ViceRegent

Con

Again, he has conceded that he has no idea how to rationally know truth from fiction and that he is delusional, believing he determines reality. I win.
bartol

Pro

My last two posts have explained to you how to find the border between reality and fiction. In my last post I told you how basic laws and rules influence this border and specify it a bit. If you think I told you nothing, please read my posts carefully.

P.S. Being arrogant by stating you win without even letting the debate end, let alone wait until the voting is over will not get you anywhere. It only bores the ones seeing this debate and discourages them from voting, which may harm you as well. Consider that the next time you debate.
Debate Round No. 4
ViceRegent

Con

It is hilarious watching evolved pond scum tell me they answered my Q when they did, though they did admit to not knowing how to tell truth from fiction.
bartol

Pro

I have said everything I wanted to. I am disappointed to see that this debate turned into an argument, but a part of that is also my fault. I will let the other users vote now.

Good luck, and may the best man win.
Debate Round No. 5
115 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by rock8380s 9 months ago
rock8380s
Yes these atheists are certainly wrong and misguided and perhaps some of your insults and accusations might even have some truth to them. It is not proper though to be insulting them and telling them that they are going to be burning in hell... how do we know they won't turn from their atheistic ways? Saying "ROFL" before saying it kind of makes it a lot more mean.

As Proverbs 24: 28 says:

"Don"t be happy when your enemy has troubles. Don"t be glad when they fall. The Lord will see this, and he might be upset with you and decide not to punish your enemy"

Though you are still are for the most part on the right track in trying to get them to turn from their atheism, but I just warn you that insulting them is not a good way to do it.

Again I commend you for your efforts and as Proverbs 25: 26 says:

"Good people who don"t stand strong against evil are like springs that have been polluted or pools that have turned dirty and muddy"

But again you cannot do evil to do good... Nothing of a lasting goodness can come from it. Standing against Atheists and their evil Atheism does not mean insulting them directly... But admonishing them and teaching them to turn from the evil atheist way. Obviously, yes... offence is always hard to avoid... Because as we Christians know, The Truth can be offensive to a lot of people. There is no reason though to be unnecessarily rude or mean to them. But to show them good paths.

My above paragraph does not mean there is never any proper time for the usage of harsh words and perhaps even on occasion corporal punishment (especially for our own children). However unnecessariness is unnecessariness... and we ought to avoid it. For example for children; any more then using a paddle board or maybe belt or whatever is probably unnecessary. I have not been given the gift of having children yet, but when I do; spanking them with the paddle board or belt is the most I'll do...
Posted by rock8380s 9 months ago
rock8380s
The epistemology thing that you mentioned... Reality of the universe? What would you say is the "reality of the universe" then?
Posted by rock8380s 9 months ago
rock8380s
Um? What "papist" 'heresies'? Because I am Roman Catholic? Well yes I am... That is what my church teaches... Not to dwell about other people's state of salvations. Yes we are to admonish, warn, guide others etc. In fact it is a sin to us to in any way give scandal to another person. We are to warn others and guide our fellow people into the truth of Christ.. We are not to allow others to fall into sin if we have the ability to convince them to stop.

If Roman Catholicism is wrong then doesn't that make the Bible and the Scriptures wrong? All of our practices are supported by Holy Scripture. We do not make up our traditions... they come from the Holy Spirit and God. The Anointing of the Sick, The Eucharist, Corporal Works of Mercy, Confession, Baptism, Holy Communion, The Mass, Veneration of the Saints and holy creatures (Dulia), Veneration of Mary (Hyperdulia), Worship of god (Latria), etc etc, are all supported by scripture. I can quote scripture for them, also, if you want. All of them are also rooted in the Early Church as well (40 AD to 1050 AD).

You will not find evidence for any sort of protestant early church other then in the likes of Arius (the founder of Arianism and blasphemed that the holy trinity is not true and that god was only a man).
Posted by WhineyMagiciann5 9 months ago
WhineyMagiciann5
Im pretty sure you're the one that wants attention considering you repost the 20+ times and proceed to insult others.
Posted by ViceRegent 9 months ago
ViceRegent
I love how these fools despise me and yet they all want my attention.
Posted by bartol 9 months ago
bartol
Please, everyone. I am not justifying anything that VR has said about atheists or anyone commenting on this. However, it is more than rude that 3+ people are actively attacking VR because he lacks some fundamental knowledge of atheism, mental illness, etc. I am sorry everyone, but that is not OK. As for you VR, could you please answer the questions meant for you without using rude language, name-calling and stating atheists are evil because they are atheists. You should be punished for that, but I think we should all be better people about this.
Posted by WhineyMagiciann5 9 months ago
WhineyMagiciann5
gamapro is here just trying to be nice and calm things vice. and you go insult his knowledge of his own religion. just answer any of the question we have posed.
what is your evidence of this almighty truth?
how do theist rationally know the difference between reality and delusion?
why must atheist be unable to distinguish reality and delusion?

these questions have been posted on the 20+ times you have posted this debate. its your turn to answer these questions or you will be waved off as an irrational narcissist.
Posted by klaralein 9 months ago
klaralein
Wow. VR. You are so rude and incompetent it is laughable.

Please, check out my debate with him. He doesn't even know the rules of debating! He doesn't even offer an argument! LOL! He states that we can't know rules of debate when they are LISTED ON THE WEBSITE. ROFL.
Posted by ViceRegent 9 months ago
ViceRegent
They attack me and then copy me. Man, I love the cognitive dissonance.

When a child of Satan praises you, you are doing something wrong.
Posted by klaralein 9 months ago
klaralein
And thank you, Gamapo, for your ability to respectfully debate people of different beliefs. If only VR can be like you. Thank you for your consideration to others and niceness, Gamapro.
No votes have been placed for this debate.