The Instigator
acetraveler
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Cody_Franklin
Con (against)
Winning
33 Points

I can take the highest scores by using my homework.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/7/2009 Category: Education
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 2,226 times Debate No: 9426
Debate Rounds (2)
Comments (16)
Votes (6)

 

acetraveler

Pro

http://www.toronsil.com...
http://www.amazon.com...

I participate the class 'Reading books and Debate'. I participate this class by using Korean. I need to finish this homework before 16th in this month. This homework is that I should read 'Bad Samaritans' and make summary, appreciative criticism, debate topic based on the book. I need my opponent who will correct my homework by pointing out my weakness in my homework as harsh as possible. If someone do this, I will advocate my homework that have worth to give me highest scores. Because I want to do this, I translated my original Korean homework to English. I should finish my homework by using Korean, but I need help from this site.
You can pointing out anything, and everything that will prove that the homework have not worth to give me highest score. For example, you can pointing out the summary is too long or too short. You can pointing out my summary contain unnecessary things or does not contain necessary things. You can pointing out
'appreciative criticism' have many logical errors. Or you should pointing out my debate topic cannot fulfill the standard.
1st. 'Debate Topic' should be made for dividing pros and cons clearly.
2nd. Pros should require 'change current situation', Cons should require 'keep current situation if they debate by accepting debate topic.

[My homework]
(Bad Samaritans, Ha-Joon Chang, Random House)
(Summary)
Economic policies that are based on neoliberalism does not helpful for developing economy of developing countries. Developed countries did not wear 'golden straitjacket' called by Thomas Friedman for developing economy. When they got enough wealth, they kick way the ladder by propagating policies of free-market to the other countries. Theory of comparative cost is right when each countries just keep their level of technologies. Imposing legal controls on foreign investments is needed because capitals also have nationality. The regulations are not the important cause to disturb foreign investments. The incentives for foreign investments are 'marketing opportunities', 'superiority of labor and SOC'. Problems of public enterprise are 'master-representative', 'steal a ride', 'limit of soft budget'. These problems are also existed in large, private corporations. Privatization plans for the utility companies is not good solution for enhancing efficiency. In addition, it is harder to use the policies of Imposing legal controls on private corporations and giving a subsidy to private corporations than managing public enterprises for governments in the developing countries. Although the patent and copyright system are also needed, excessive protection for copyright will cause decrease public interests. Keeping nation's fiscal health and price stabilization does not a cure-all for economy of developing countries. Irregularities and corruption, and non-democratic governments are not enemies to economic growth. Proper incentives will quickly change cultures. So, developed countries should suggest developing countries policies of protective trade for their economic growth.

(appreciative criticism )
Policies of protective trade by United Kingdoms damaged textile manufacturing industry in India. So I guess UK became rich but India became poor. By following principles of free-trade, UK could get copyright of textile manufacturing machines first. Next UK could get royalty from textile manufacturing industry in India, or could built factories in India. I think thwas the win-win game. If UK took this plan, UK did not satisfied with its own position, but it could get better position by itself. And the author told that developed countries should support developing countries because the support gives developed countries economical profits. But, he did not mention 'opportunity cost' that the cost consumed for supporting developing countries could be used to develop technologies for developed countries itselves. So the plan by the author have many weakness. If the capitalism of market suggests that people can invest by following their own incentives but they should be charge of the result of investment, it is hard to invest 'uncertainty' just because he or she took the suggestion based on 'No investment, No profits.'. And, I need contrast between author's 'low growth rate', 'the unimproved gap between rich and poor' and the comments related to same topic in the book 'Skeptical Environmentalist'.

(Debate Topics)
1. A common idea that observing principles of free market made the the miracle of Korean economy should be changed?
2. Should developed countries suggest developing countries policies of protective trade for their economic growth?
3. We should not allow editing history for winners and reinterpreting past by using the view of present.
4. Policies of free trade and free market based on neoliberalism does not help to get growth and equality?
5. Should public enterprises come under private management?
6. Is it essential that developing countries bollow ideas from advanced countries for economic growth?
7. Should we admit that irregularities and corruption come from 'excessively huge market?'
8. Should we admit that free market does not absolute friend of democracy?
9. Should we admit that people in developing countries are lazy because the countries are poors?
10. Should countries in the world abolish industry customs completely?
11. Should we take a short-period loss to develop abilities in the long period?
12. Our country should concentrate to develop the manufacturing industry instead of the first industry and the service industry.
13. Our country should hire first-class economists to manage good economic policies.
Cody_Franklin

Con

This debate has been on the list for several days, and I figured that I would perform the courtesy of taking this debate off of here, since, clearly, the instigator has no desire to do so.

1. The Request

a. My opponent's request is, essentially, that his opponent help him to critique his homework; however, that is not what this website was designed for; my opponent has created an absolutely pointless debate in which neither competitor can argue, due to this being more of a 'study session' than a debate round; it is clear that my opponent has misunderstood the purpose of starting a debate, which is to exchange ideas, not to help someone to correct his homework.

b. Though I have no obligation to do so, the best way I can see to help my opponent to revise his homework is to make a thread on the forums; if he chooses to do so, then he can not only receive a wider number of critiques from a diverse collection of minds, but he also would not have to worry about being on a deadline in which to make his next post; thus, I have fulfilled my burden of 'helping' my opponent, ergo you must vote Con.

c. One problem that I see is that, when translating from Korean to English, my opponent's grammar became rather disjointed; it would seem that, without knowing Korean, any assistance that we could render my opponent wouldn't be used to its fullest potential, since Pro's first language is clearly not English; ergo, I believe that he would be better suited seeking help from his classmates, or from his teacher, since they would share a common language, making communication easier, critiquing more exact, and would produce a better final product, ergo a better final grade.

d. For a more fulfilling intellectual experience, and for more practice with English, I would recommend that my opponent take one of his 12 debate topics, and start a debate on that; in doing so, he creates a far better experience for both himself and his future opponent, while further contributing to the purpose of the site; also, I believe that my opponent would be able to learn more through a stimulating debate than he would if we simply handed him advice and criticism on a silver platter; furthermore, actually discussing a topic (as opposed to asking for critiques) would serve to better Pro's skill in matters of logic, and would allow him to better develop his own ideas, thus allowing him to gradually rely less and less on outside criticism, which in turn would gradually increase the quality of his work.

For these 4 reasons, I urge the Con vote. :)
Debate Round No. 1
acetraveler

Pro

If someone accept debate, they should keep the rules.
First, he or she should show direct arguments related to debate topic.
Second, he or she should directly refute opponent's arguments.
But he did not keep the rules anything. I should request he should directly point out the weakness of my homework and I should point out his arguments directly.

a. I set up the topic that can divide Pro/Con clearly. In this debate, pro should prove that the homework have worth to take me highest score, and the con should prove the opposite. Dear members in www.debate.org. What makes you debate? You can find books and articles to get the same thing that you saw in the debate. And you can see many debate videos. You can see many speakers who have more experience and talent in debate. But, every person have biased view. By using debate, they can contrast his/her view with others. And they have the chance to see themselves. Because of these reasons, this is also a debate. Just I use the matter - homework - to create this topic.

b. I already got help from my Korean colleagues related to this homework. But I keep this debate. Why? Because more advice, more information will be useful to me. But, he does not just help my homework. If he thought this is not a proper debate, he should not accept this debate. But, once he should accept to become opponent, he should keep the rule of debate.
1st, he didn't show direct arguments related to debate topic.
2nd, he didn't directly refute opponent's arguments.

c. He makes you wrong idea. Advice doesn't have to have fullest potential. You should not forget who will be charge of accepting advice. I will accept some reasonable advice, and I will oppose the other unreasonable advice. I have the English that can help me understanding advice by using English. But, he didn't give me any advice related to debate topic directly. So, he should be charge of this problem. And I already give him how he can point out my weakness.
"You can pointing out anything, and everything that will prove that the homework have not worth to give me highest score. For example, you can pointing out the summary is too long or too short. You can pointing out my summary contain unnecessary things or does not contain necessary things. You can pointing out 'appreciative criticism' have many logical errors. Or you should pointing out my debate topic cannot fulfill the standard." Dear members. Does you think this suggestion is reasonable to help managing debate. Doesn't you?

d. Dear members. I already have the debate like his suggestion. So he gave me useless advice. That means his arguments are based on no evidence.
http://www.debate.org...
I don't want to have more forfeit so I should finish this debate, but he just consumed his time even he did not keep the rule of debate.

Dear members, you should vote for me because he violated the basic rule of debate.
1st, he didn't show direct arguments related to debate topic.
2nd, he didn't directly refute opponent's arguments.
Cody_Franklin

Con

1. An actual debate?

a."This homework is that I should read 'Bad Samaritans' and make summary, appreciative criticism, debate topic based on the book. I need my opponent who will correct my homework by pointing out my weakness in my homework as harsh as possible." That, right there, is my opponent's topic. He wants his opponent to help him with his homework through criticism, proving that he would not get the highest score for it; yet, the fact that he is here, asking for criticism, and asking us to help him finish his assignment, my opponent has already admitted imperfections in his homework, thus proving that, as it stands, he would not get "the highest scores" for his work; further, my opponent has yet to specify the grading scale or criteria upon which his work would be judged.

b. "more advice, more information will be useful to me." As my point b in Round 1 explains, the best way to get a lot of advice is to make a topic on the forum; in making this into a 'debate', my opponent is limiting criticism to a single view; further, my opponent later admits "I don't want to have more forfeit so I should finish this debate"; as he failed to address, making a debate puts my opponent on a very strict deadline, forcing him to respond, whereas creating a forum topic would allow not only a larger, more diverse trading of information, but there would also. be no timer tick-tocking away; to connect this to the 'topic', by sticking to a single opinion here in this debate, my opponent will not be getting as much advice as he would be from the larger DDO Community, and thus he would be far less likely to get a high score through the methods that he is currently employing.

c. "Advice doesn't have to have fullest potential." My opponent is advocating a lot of advice, but yet he isn't necessarily advocating good advice; this is a simple case of quantity over quality; by wanting more and more advice, but disregarding overall quality, my opponent may not be getting the best criticisms of his work, and may actually be adding imperfections to his paper, meaning that, not only might his score not increase, it may actually decrease.

d. "So he gave me useless advice. That means his arguments are based on no evidence." This claim makes absolutely no sense. I was making recommendations, and critiques against the idea of the topic; clearly, the only real 'evidence' that one needs would be the use of reason. He likes to claim that I broke the rules, but clearly, I've argued against the topic, refuting my opponent's request, and actually offered him a method by which he could get more opinions than merely my own. I think my burden is fulfilled here.

e. Further, on the idea of choosing a debate topic, Pro doesn't address that, to best choose a topic, he should start a debate on one of THOSE, as opposed to this; not only would he learn more about the topics that he is studying, but that extra knowledge would help to contribute to the integrity of his assignment, thus earning him a better grade.

2. If it makes my opponent happy...

Foreword: You don't need to vote on these new arguments.

a. "Economic policies that are based on neoliberalism does not helpful for developing economy of developing countries." - I ask you, why not? You explain nothing further on this assertion, failing to even define neoliberalism in your summary.

b. You also fail to explain the concept of the "golden straitjacket"; your paper has to be understandable for generally everyone, meaning that you have to explain these concepts, and not just throw terms around.

c. This might just be a western thing, but you need to explain the weaknesses in a lot of these ideas, such as keeping a certain level of technology, and one idea that I really didn't like was: "Keeping nation's fiscal health and price stabilization does not a cure-all for economy of developing countries." It seems to me that, if you keep up a nation's fiscal health, and you stabilize prices, you're probably going to have a reasonable economy, even in a developing country.

d. One thing that really bothered me: "Irregularities and corruption.. are not enemies to economic growth." You really need to take that out; personally, the idea that corruption ISN'T an enemy of economic growth is a bit... strange to me.

e. From what I can understand, your criticism is alright, but you need to do more explicating on examples and reasoning as to why the UK's protective trade policies hurt India; put in some statistics, or historical facts.

There's more that I have on this, but, as I said, it's in my opponent's best interests to put this on the forums.

Oh, yeah... and uh, vote Con.
Debate Round No. 2
16 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Alex 8 years ago
Alex
I doubt Pro is gonna respond, now it's gonna be on the "debating period" list for even longer.
Posted by Xer 8 years ago
Xer
The resolution doesn't even make sense. Easy win for con. Stupid debate...
Posted by Cody_Franklin 8 years ago
Cody_Franklin
I almost want to take this and run the 'We shouldn't be expected to do your work for you' angle.
Posted by brittwaller 8 years ago
brittwaller
Agreed. Word-for-word translation make brain hurting to been reading. Interested idea, if somewhat fail attempted and laziness.

Either way I can sense you having sarcasm on commented "So you cannot understand what my translation means? I guess you don't know all of them. Please require me to elaborate 'unknown part."

Very far not get you attitude of this way.

My advice: instead of wasted time on nonsense translated you could/should have just done the work yourself.

:)
Posted by Cerebral_Narcissist 8 years ago
Cerebral_Narcissist
Do your own homework, or find a forum to pester. This is not a debate topic.
Posted by acetraveler 8 years ago
acetraveler
So you cannot understand what my translation means? I guess you don't know all of them. Please require me to elaborate 'unknown part.
What I want is, 'I need my opponent who will correct my homework by pointing out my weakness in my homework as harsh as possible. If someone do this, I will advocate my homework that have worth to give me highest scores. Because I want to do this, I translated my original Korean homework to English. I should finish my homework by using Korean, but I need help from this site.
You can pointing out anything, and everything that will prove that the homework have not worth to give me highest score.'
Posted by JustCallMeTarzan 8 years ago
JustCallMeTarzan
I can sure do English - Spanish better than that...

I still dunno what he wants tho...
Posted by Xer 8 years ago
Xer
"Awful grammar, instigator."

He's Korean... Can you translate from English to any language that good?
Posted by wjmelements 8 years ago
wjmelements
Awful grammar, instigator.
Posted by JustCallMeTarzan 8 years ago
JustCallMeTarzan
So you want someone to correct your English...

I have a PayPal account you can donate to for that...
6 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Vote Placed by kalyse020908 7 years ago
kalyse020908
acetravelerCody_FranklinTied
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Vote Placed by jurist24 8 years ago
jurist24
acetravelerCody_FranklinTied
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Vote Placed by RoyLatham 8 years ago
RoyLatham
acetravelerCody_FranklinTied
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Vote Placed by pogib14 8 years ago
pogib14
acetravelerCody_FranklinTied
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Vote Placed by Xer 8 years ago
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acetravelerCody_FranklinTied
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Vote Placed by Cody_Franklin 8 years ago
Cody_Franklin
acetravelerCody_FranklinTied
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