The Instigator
JustVotingTiedDebates
Pro (for)
The Contender
CuriousFear
Con (against)

IS= Islam?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/22/2016 Category: Religion
Updated: 1 month ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 366 times Debate No: 96338
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (18)
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JustVotingTiedDebates

Pro

Terms:

IS: Islamic State (The one existing in Syria, Iraq, Egypt, Libya, Somalia, Nigeria, etc.. currently)

=: Represents

Islam: Islam is the religion articulated by the Quran, a text considered by its adherents to be the verbatim word of God (Allāh), and, for the vast majority of adherents, by the teachings and normative example (called the sunnah, composed of accounts called hadith) of Muhammad Pbuh (c. 570"8 June 632 CE). It is the world's second-largest religion and the fastest-growing major religion in the world, with over 1.7 billion followers or 23% of the global population. [1]

Structure:

I'll let my opponent start by his arguments supporting why IS does NOT represent Islam.

R1. Rules for PRO, Acceptance & first argument for CON.

R2. Rebuttal for PRO & Defense for CON.

R3. Defense for PRO & CON.

R4. Defense & conclusions for PRO & CON.

Rules:

1. No forfeiting unless there are a same number of forfeits

2. No trolling

3. No plagiarism, or you have to quote it.

4. Cite sources in 'Sources' Category

5. No new arguments in the beginning round.

6. BoP is shared in this debate.

7. Not following rules is an automatic loss.

8. We cannot have new arguments in the first round or the final round.

I STRONGLY CALL UPON VOTERS TO VOTE BY FACT AND POWER OF DEBATE, NOT BY OPINION.

I thank my opponent. Let's have a wonderful debate!

Sources:

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org...
CuriousFear

Con

So if I read this correctly, you're a Muslim that actually believes that ISIL is Islamic.

ISIS has been denounced by 99.9% or 100% of Islamic scholars and Muftis. The grand Mufti of Saudi-Arabia called ISIS "the #1 enemy of Islam".

Here is a list of a few scholars, learners and muftis denouncing the dogs of hell (=ISIL).



Mufti Menk, Hamza Yusuf, Yasir Qadhi, Muhammad al-Yaqoubi, Abdullah bin-Bayyah, Shafayat Mohamed, Bilal Phillips, Abu Usmah At-Thahabi, Imran Hossein, Abdul Muhsin al-'Abbaad, Haitham al-Haddad, Abdur Raheem Green, Abou Arfa, Zakir Naik, Salih as-Suhaymee, Asim Hussain, Salih al-Fawzan, Habib Ali Al-Jifri, Muhammad Ibn Abdullah Al-Muhaisini, Nourman Ali Khan, Muhammad Bin Ramzaan, Sheikh Omar El Banna, Sh. Khalid Yasin.

These are just a few.

- "And We have sent you (O Muhammad SAW) not but as a mercy for the "Alameen (mankind, jinns and all that exists)"
[al-Anbiya" 21:107] ISIS has no mercy, showing a clear contradiction.
- [If a Muslim calls another kafir, then if he is a kafir let it be so; otherwise, he [the caller] is himself a kafir.' (Abu Dawud, Book of Sunnah).]
ISIS will call anyone a kaafir who does not agree with their wicked ideology.

- Qur'an 4:29" "And do not kill yourselves, surely God is most Merciful to you."
ISIS directly violates this command that is also continuously found in authentic Hadiths.

-Qur'an 17:23: "And your Lord has decreed that you not worship except Him, and to parents, good treatment. Whether one or both of them reach old age [while] with you, say not to them [so much as], "uff," and do not repel them but speak to them a noble word."
ISIS militants on the other hand disrespect their parents and will even kill them if they do not agree with ISIS.

- Qur"an 6:151 specifically and explicitly prohibits the killing of Muslims and ISIS directly violates this.
- The Quran 5:69 mentions in that among the Jews and Christians there are also believers who will enter paradise. ISIS kills Christians as well, but they don't kill Jews obviously.
- Qur'an 5:82 even mentions "You will surely find the most intense of the people in animosity toward the believers [to be] the Jews and those who associate others with Allah ; and you will find the nearest of them in affection to the believers those who say, "We are Christians." That is because among them are priests and monks and because they are not arrogant.".
- Qur'an 2:190 mentions that Allah does not love transgressors when it comes to fighting, meaning killing innocent people.
- "Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy handhold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things. (Quran, 2:256)"
- "Say, 'The truth is from your Lord': Let him who will believe, and let him who will, reject (it). (Quran, 18:29)"
-"God does not forbid you from showing kindness and dealing justly with those who have not fought you about religion and have not driven you out of your homes. God loves just dealers. (Qur'an, 60:8)"

If ISIS is anyone then they are the Kharijites or the Khawarijs, also known as the worst of the creation.

Hadith 1:
Nu"aym b. Hammad records in his Kitab al-Fitan (The Book of Tribulations):
"It is related on the authority of "Ali (may Allah ennoble his countenance): "When you see the black flags, remain where you are and do not move your hands or your feet (It"s a common phrase meaning: "Stay put and don"t get involved in the fighting"). Thereafter there shall appear a feeble folk to whom no concern is given. Their hearts will be like fragments of iron. They are the representatives of the State (Ashab al-Dawla). They will fulfill neither covenant nor agreement. They will invite to the truth, though they are not from its people. Their names will be agnomens [i.e., Abu So-and-so], and their ascriptions will be to villages. Their hair will be long like that of women. [They shall remain so] till they differ among themselves, and then Allah will bring forth the truth from whomever He wills.""

Hadith 2:
"a group of young people who would be immature in thought and foolish." They would speak beautiful words but commit the most heinous of deeds. They would engage in so much prayer and fasting that the worship of the Muslims would appear insignificant in comparison. They would call people to the Quran but would have nothing to do with it in reality. The Quran would not go beyond their throats, meaning they wouldn't understand its essence at all, merely regurgitating it selectively. The Prophet then went on to describe these people as "the worst of the creation." (Sahih Bukhari)

In another Hadith the Kharijites are called the dogs of Hell. The scholars I presented also call them the Khawarij.
Hamza Yusuf talking about the Khawarij/Kharijites: https://www.youtube.com...

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The Instigator
CuriousFear
Con (against)
CuriousFear
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The Contender
Vivec
Pro (for)
Vivec
Tied
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ISIS/Daesh are Islamic and are doing the right thing according to the teachings of Islam
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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 0 votes the winner is...
It's a Tie!
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/16/2016 Category: Religion
Updated: 1 month ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 275 times Debate No: 95447
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (5)
Votes (0)

CuriousFear

Con

I am Con in this debate, you are Pro.

ISIS has been denounced by 99.9% or 100% of Islamic scholars and Muftis. The grand Mufti of Saudi-Arabia called ISIS "the #1 enemy of Islam". There are no recognized scholars that see ISIS as good and true Muslims.

Videos of scholars, muftis and learners denouncing ISIS and terror attacks.
Mufti Menk: https://www.youtube.com......
Hamza Yusuf:
Debate Round No. 1
JustVotingTiedDebates

Pro

R2. Rebuttal for PRO & Defense for CON.

Before starting I would like to ask voters not to vote except if they are Muslim. The reason is clear.

I thank my opponent for his arguments.


My strategy in rebuttal:"Argument" -Rebuttal

Rebuttal:

1. "ISIS has been denounced by 99.9% or 100% of Islamic scholars and Muftis. The grand Mufti of Saudi-Arabia called ISIS "the #1 enemy of Islam Here is a list of a few scholars, learners and muftis denouncing the dogs of hell (=ISIL).Mufti Menk, Hamza Yusuf, Yasir Qadhi, Muhammad al-Yaqoubi, Abdullah bin-Bayyah, Shafayat Mohamed, Bilal Phillips, Abu Usmah At-Thahabi, Imran Hossein, Abdul Muhsin al-'Abbaad, Haitham al-Haddad, Abdur Raheem Green, Abou Arfa, Zakir Naik, Salih as-Suhaymee, Asim Hussain, Salih al-Fawzan, Habib Ali Al-Jifri, Muhammad Ibn Abdullah Al-Muhaisini, Nourman Ali Khan, Muhammad Bin Ramzaan, Sheikh Omar El Banna, Sh. Khalid Yasin.These are just a few. " -CON
- A very bad starting. you haven't even read the resolution properly! It isn't: Do most muslim beleive IS represents Islam. IS= Islam means you have to prove IS does NOT represent Islam (not Islamic scholars), which mean that ALL of your proofs should be from KITAB, SUNNAH, IJMA(Quran,Hadith, and the saying of PREVIOUS scholars, such as Ibn Taymiyah, the four Imams,...etc.) ONLY . All of the previously stated dajjal scholars and muftis are payed by governments, and all the governments around the globe are against IS.

2. " And We have sent you (O Muhammad SAW) not but as a mercy for the "Alameen (mankind, jinns and all that exists)"

[al-Anbiya" 21:107] ISIS has no mercy, showing a clear contradiction."-CON
- If you are saying that Islam doesn't support war, The Prophet Pbuh has taken part in total 29 ghazwahs (battles), other than the battles in which he sent his companians but didn't take part in. THE LAST SENTENCE IS COMPLETELY INWARRANTED.

3. "If a Muslim calls another kafir, then if he is a kafir let it be so; otherwise, he [the caller] is himself a kafir.' (Abu Dawud, Book of Sunnah).] ISIS will call anyone a kaafir who does not agree with their wicked ideology."-CON
- Do you remember me calling you a Kafir??? Then again, warrant please.

4. "- Qur'an 4:29" "And do not kill yourselves, surely God is most Merciful to you." ISIS directly violates this command that is also continuously found in authentic Hadiths."-CON
- Let me show you some contradiction. You have mentioned, in the list of dajjal muftis: Dr. Zakir Naik. Take this> Source [1]

5. " -Qur'an 17:23: "And your Lord has decreed that you not worship except Him, and to parents, good treatment. Whether one or both of them reach old age [while] with you, say not to them [so much as], "uff," and do not repel them but speak to them a noble word." ISIS militants on the other hand disrespect their parents and will even kill them if they do not agree with ISIS."-CON
-COMPLETELY INWARRANTED WITH NO EXAMPLES AND/OR PROOF.

6. "- Quran 6:151 specifically and explicitly prohibits the killing of Muslims and ISIS directly violates this."-CON
- -COMPLETELY INWARRANTED WITH NO EXAMPLES AND/OR PROOF.

7. " The Quran 5:69 mentions in that among the Jews and Christians there are also believers who will enter paradise. ISIS kills Christians as well, but they don't kill Jews obviously."- Qur'an 5:82 even mentions "You will surely find the most intense of the people in animosity toward the believers [to be] the Jews and those who associate others with Allah ; and you will find the nearest of them in affection to the believers those who say, "We are Christians." That is because among them are priests and monks and because they are not arrogant."" -CON
-LOL. Ever heard of Jews in Iraq?! In Syria? Egypt? There actually are Christians in all of the countries that have IS in them. Secondly, the Christians and Jews mentioned in this verse are those who beleived in Musa and Isa AND FOLLOWED THIER FAITH. [2]

8. "Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy handhold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things. (Quran, 2:256)"God does not forbid you from showing kindness and dealing justly with those who have not fought you about religion and have not driven you out of your homes. God loves just dealers. (Qur'an, 60:8)""-CON
- There is IJMA that compulsion in religion means converting to Islam. IS does NOT have it compulsory to convert to Islam. Pay Jizyah and you are free. [3]

9. “If ISIS is anyone then they are the Kharijites or the Khawarijs, also known as the worst of the creation.” –CON

-Warrant from Kitab and/or Sunnah please?

10. As for the Hadiths about Khawarij, my refutation is the same for rebuttal point (9).

11. “dogs of hell (=ISIL)” –Con

- VOTERS! CONDUCT! The Quran says: “Invite to the way of your Lord with wisdom and good instruction, and argue with them in a way that is best.” [4]
Thanks,
Adil,
Qatar.


Sources:

[1] https://www.youtube.com...
[2]Quran 5:72-73 + 5:17
[3]Quran 9:29
[4]Quran 16:125

CuriousFear

Con

I made a mistake in the first round with copy and pasting (from my own previous debates), I have no idea how that happened.
I also say that the only ones who should vote on this debate are Muslims, which was originally proposed by PRO.

You seem to be blaming me for apparently not reading your resolution properly, but you yourself make a contradiction.
In your rules you stated that I couldn't make an argument in the first round, but before that you said that I should. If you make contradictions in your rules that's your problem, not mine.

1. You say that the absolute majority of Islamic scholar don't represent Islam, but you're trying to tell us that criminals represent Islam. What are you on about Adil?
2. You said that this verse is "INWARRANTED", I would assume that you meant unwarranted. You made this claim without providing an explanation.
3. I never made a comment about you, unless you're part of ISIS off course. ISIS has murdered more Muslims than non-Muslims. During the attack in Nice more than 30 Muslims died and 10 children died. This attack was done by someone who was part of ISIS, yet didn't practice Islam.

Prohibition on killing women and children:

Volume 004, Book 052, Hadith Number 257 Narrated By 'Abdullah : During some of the Ghazawat of the Prophet a woman was found killed. Allah's Apostle disapproved the killing of women and children.

Say, "Come, I will recite what your Lord has prohibited to you. [He commands] that you not associate anything with Him, and to parents, good treatment, and do not kill your children out of poverty; We will provide for you and them. And do not approach immoralities - what is apparent of them and what is concealed. And do not kill the soul which Allah has forbidden [to be killed] except by [legal] right. This has He instructed you that you may use reason." (6:151)

Prohibiton on killing Muslims explicitly laid out in the Qur'an:
And do not kill the soul which Allah has forbidden, except by right. And whoever is killed unjustly - We have given his heir authority, but let him not exceed limits in [the matter of] taking life. Indeed, he has been supported [by the law]. (17:33)

4. The video you presented does not prove your point. It proves my point because Zakir Naik says that it is seen as haram by most scholars. The very scholars that made exceptions still say that it is mostly haram to perform such a suicide bombing. You refuted yourself to be honest.

5. You misspelled unwarranted again and you didn't provide any explanation either.
ISIS member executes own mother:
http://www.ibtimes.com...
https://www.theguardian.com...
http://www.bbc.com...
http://www.usatoday.com...

6. No explanation. Sources here.
http://www.globalresearch.ca...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
http://www.independent.co.uk...
http://edition.cnn.com...
http://www.csmonitor.com...


7. Where did I freaking mention that there are no Jews or Christian in Arab countries? Explain how this verse is only speaking of these Jews?

8. Religion is not just the Islam, but any religion.

And say, "The truth is from your Lord, so whoever wills - let him believe; and whoever wills - let him disbelieve." Indeed, We have prepared for the wrongdoers a fire whose walls will surround them. And if they call for relief, they will be relieved with water like murky oil, which scalds [their] faces. Wretched is the drink, and evil is the resting place. (18:29)

This verse proves my interpretation. You can't bring a Hadith to try to disprove my claim because the Qur'an has the highest authority and anything that contradicts it can be concluded as false (or it has to be interpreted in another way).

9+10.

يَخْرُجُ نَاسٌ مِنْ قِبَلِ الْمَشْرِقِ وَيَقْرَءُونَ الْقُرْآنَ لَا يُجَاوِزُ تَرَاقِيَهُمْ يَمْرُقُونَ مِنْ الدِّينِ كَمَا يَمْرُقُ السَّهْمُ مِنْ الرَّمِيَّةِ ثُمَّ لَا يَعُودُونَ فِيهِ حَتَّى يَعُودَ السَّهْمُ إِلَى فُوقِهِ

There will come a people from the east who recite the Quran but it will not go beyond their throats. They will pass through the religion just as an arrow pierces its target and they will not return to it just as the arrow does not return to the bow.

Source: Sahih Bukhari 7123, Grade: Sahih

+

Sahih Al-Bukhari Hadith 9.68 Narrated by Yusair bin Amr

I asked Sahl bin Hunaif, "Did you hear the Prophet (saws) saying anything about the Al-Khawarij? He said, "I heard him (saws) saying while pointing his hand towards Iraq, 'There will appear in it (i.e, Iraq) some people who will recite the Quran but it will not go beyond their throats, and they will go out from (leave) Islam as an arrow darts through the preys body.'"

and

إِنَّهُمْ انْطَلَقُوا إِلَى آيَاتٍ نَزَلَتْ فِي الْكُفَّارِ فَجَعَلُوهَا عَلَى الْمُؤْمِنِينَ
Verily, they take verses that were revealed about unbelievers and use them against the believers.Source: SP3;ahP3;iM2;hP3; al-BukhaM2;riM2; 6531, Grade: Sahih

and

Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah (may Allah have mercy on him) said:

The Khawaarij who deviated, whom the Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) enjoined us to fight, and whom Ameer al-Mu’mineen ‘Ali (may Allah be pleased with him), one of the Rightly-Guided Caliphs fought, and whom the leading scholars of Islam among the Sahaabah, Taabi‘een and those who came after them were unanimously agreed upon fighting, were not described as disbelievers by ‘Ali ibn Abi Taalib, Sa‘d ibn Abi Waqqaas and others among the Sahaabah; rather they regarded them as Muslims even though they fought them, and ‘Ali did not fight them until they shed blood unlawfully and raided the property of the Muslims; then he fought them in order to ward off their wrongdoing and aggression, not because they were disbelievers. Hence he did not take their womenfolk captive and he did not seize their wealth as booty.

End quote from Majmoo‘ al-Fataawa, 3/282

Kharijites: https://en.wikipedia.org...

11. Ibn Maajah (173) narrated that Ibn Abi Awfa said: The Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “The Khawaarij are the dogs of Hell.

Debate Round No. 2
JustVotingTiedDebates

Pro

My strategy in defense: “Argument” -Defense.

DEFENCE:

1. “You seem to be blaming me for apparently not reading your resolution properly, but you yourself make a contradiction. In your rules you stated that I couldn't make an argument in the first round, but before that you said that I should. If you make contradictions in your rules, that's your problem, not mine.” –CON

-I’m not sure if you know what the resolution is. The resolution is IS = Islam. So, as I mentioned before, you have to bring proof from Kitab, Sunnah, and Ijma ONLY. Secondly, I did make that mistake. It’s ok, you have no wrong in that. Thirdly, you haven’t followed rule 4: Cite sources in ‘Sources’ Category. Rule 7: Not following rules is an automatic loss.

2. “You say that the absolute majority of Islamic scholars doesn’t represent Islam, but you’re trying to tell us that criminals represent Islam. What are you on about Adil?” –CON

Thanks for knowing my name. What I meant is that we aren’t talking about side 1, the scholars. This debate is about side 2, IS. So you have to prove- let me make a new term- from KSI (Kitab, Sunnah, and Ijma) ONLY.

3. “You said that this verse is “INWARRANTED”, I would assume that you meant unwarranted. You made this claim without providing an explanation. -CON

When did I say that a verse was unwarranted? Please quote it for me. My sentence was: THE LAST SENTENCE IS COMPLETELY UNWARRANTED. The last sentence was: ISIS has no mercy, showing a clear contradiction. What I mean by unwarranted is that you gave no examples or proofs that IS has no mercy. Now don’t go on and give me examples from sources like CNN and BBC. IS has released videos showing their ‘crimes’, right. Give me examples from them.

4. “I never made a comment about you, unless you’re part of ISIS off course. ISIS has murdered more Muslims than non-Muslims. During the attack in Nice more than 30 Muslims died and 10 children died. This attack was done by someone who was part of ISIS, yet didn’t practice Islam.” –CON

I’m not a part of IS, but my Aqeedah is exactly like them. I never called you a Kafir, though. Secondly, about the Muslims and children dying, just suppose there is a battle between Kuffar and Muslims, and you go with the Kuffar, the Muslims kill you. Can you say: see, they have killed a Muslim? So if you really want to go to France, and celebrate their national day with them, I don’t say you deserve to die, I say IF there if someone bombs them, and you die with them, it’s YOUR OWN FAULT. As the for the killing of children, the Quran says: " And fight against the disbelievers collectively as they fight against you collectively.” 9:37. Also: “And We ordained for them therein a life for a life, an eye for an eye, a nose for a nose, an ear for an ear, a tooth for a tooth, and for wounds is legal retribution.” So the Prophet (((pbuh))) forbid the killing of children in case they don’t kill our children. Just see the bombing in Raqqa, Halab, etc. But if they kill our children, we are allowed to kill their children. With all that, the children were NOT killed intentionally. Even if they had been killed intentionally (which is not the case), it is allowed.

5. “Prohibition on killing women and children: Volume 004, Book 052, Hadith Number 257 Narrated By 'Abdullah : During some of the Ghazawat of the Prophet a woman was found killed. Allah's Apostle disapproved the killing of women and children.
Say, "Come, I will recite what your Lord has prohibited to you. [He commands] that you not associate anything with Him, and to parents, good treatment, and do not kill your children out of poverty; We will provide for you and them. And do not approach immoralities - what is apparent of them and what is concealed. And do not kill the soul which Allah has forbidden [to be killed] except by [legal] right. This has He instructed you that you may use reason." (6:151) Prohibiton on killing Muslims explicitly laid out in the Qur'an: And do not kill the soul which Allah has forbidden, except by right. And whoever is killed unjustly - We have given his heir authority, but let him not exceed limits in [the matter of] taking life. Indeed, he has been supported [by the law]. (17:33)”
-CON

- Just a red herring. The debate is NOT about prohibition of killing women and children. IT IS ABOUT IS. So prove first that IS does not represent Islam, then talk about all this.

  1. 6. The video you presented does not prove your point. It proves my point because Zakir Naik says that it is seen as haram by most scholars. The very scholars that made exceptions still say that it is mostly haram to perform such a suicide bombing. You refuted yourself to be honest.” –CON

- I’m not talking about that. Zakir Naik, after all what he said, allowed suicide bombing as a SoW. Secondly, what do you mean by saying that they say it’s haram to do a suicide bombing? Scholars who have allowed suicide bombing have made it Haram to do a suicide bombing?! Is that English?!

7. The news sources about IS member killing his mother. –CON

- Of course all news is wrong about that. Anybody will give false news about his enemy. Not a proof. Refer defense point 3 ^. Secondly and the most important, it says: “RIBSS however said that the woman was killed for the crime of apostasy.” The punishment of apostasy from Islam is execution. Keep in mind, RIBSS is against IS.

8. Where did I freaking mention that there are no Jews or Christian in Arab countries? Explain how this verse is only speaking of these Jews?”-CON

- Are you playing dumb? Or are you really not understanding? You had said that why does IS not kill Jews, and I asked you if there are Jews the countries IS soldiers are present in. Do you want them to kill Jews in Israel when they are still in Syria? As for Christians, there are Christians in Egypt, Syria, Libya, Iraq…. etc.

9. “Explain how this verse is only speaking of these Jews?” –CON

-I never said so!

10.Religion is not just the Islam, but any religion.”-CON

-Still not understanding me, or acting so. I’m asking which is religion is the verse: “Let there be no compulsion” about? Isn’t it about Islam?! So yes, it IS forbidden to convert anyone forcefully to Islam, and IS does NOT do that.

11. “I asked Sahl bin Hunaif, "Did you hear the Prophet (saws) saying anything about the Al-Khawarij? He said, "I heard him (saws) saying while pointing his hand towards Iraq, 'There will appear in it (i.e, Iraq) some people who will recite the Quran but it will not go beyond their throats, and they will go out from (leave) Islam as an arrow darts through the preys body.”

- The Khawarij have already came from Iraq and gone at the time of Ali (rAa). YOUR SOURCE [1] SAYS THIS: The Khawarij (Arabic: الخوارج, singularخارجي, khārijiyy) or the ash- are members of a group that appeared in the first century of Islam during the First Fitna, the crisis of leadership after the death of Muhammad.[1] It broke into revolt against the authority of theRashidun Caliph Ali after he agreed to arbitration with his rival,Muawiyah I, to decide the succession to the Caliphate following theBattle of Siffin. A Khariji later assassinated Ali, and for hundreds of years, the Khawarij were a source of insurrection against the Caliphate.[1]

DROPS:

1. If you are saying that Islam doesn't support war, The Prophet Pbuh has taken part in total 29 ghazwahs (battles), other than the battles in which he sent his companians but didn't take part in.

Lastly,

You haven’t followed rule 4: Cite sources in ‘Sources’ Category. Rule 7: Not following rules is an automatic loss. BECAUSE OF THAT, YOU HAVE ALREADY LOST, but let’s continue the debate.

Thanks,

Adil,

Qatar.

Sources:

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org...

CuriousFear

Con

Well if I already lost, there's no need to follow the stupid rules or even continue this debate.
I have already shown you enough evidence that ISIS are kharijites.
Be one of them or be part of Ahlul-Sunnah wa Jama'a.
Debate Round No. 3
JustVotingTiedDebates

Pro

Wow! A good way to withdraw just because you are losing. I already told you that you have been forgiven for not following the rules, butyou felt yourself losing, and my arguments very powerful, so you withdraw?!
"I have already shown you enough evidence that ISIS are kharijites.
Be one of them or be part of Ahlul-Sunnah wa Jama'a."
You haven't prooved anything. You just gave me Ahadith about the Khawarij but didn't show the link between any of them and IS.
I AM WITH IS, AND IS IS THE MOST POWERFUL GROUP OF AHL ASSUNNAH WAL JAMAAH.


VOTE PRO.


Thnx,
Adil,
Qatar.
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 4
18 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Overnight 3 weeks ago
Overnight
Pro was way to aggressive. Would lose conduct in my opinion. I think CON would win. Con had better arguments.
Posted by UtherPenguin 3 weeks ago
UtherPenguin
Cant vote due to forfeit glitch
Posted by JustVotingTiedDebates 1 month ago
JustVotingTiedDebates
@SampleDebater Sorry? Explain plz.
Posted by SampleDebater 1 month ago
SampleDebater
Pro is being passively aggressive towards Con, which I belive is poor conduct.
Posted by TheThinker01 1 month ago
TheThinker01
Quran 49.90 "Humanity is but a single brotherhood, so make peace with your brethren."

Quran 16.90 "Allah commands justice, the doing of good, and liberality to kith and kin, and He forbids all shameful deeds, and injustice and rebellion: He instructs you, that ye may receive admonition."

Quran 5.32 "Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely. And our messengers had certainly come to them with clear proofs. Then indeed many of them, [even] after that, throughout the land, were transgressors."

Quran 2.8-13""And of the people are some who say, "We believe in Allah and the Last Day," but they are not believers.In their hearts is disease, so Allah has increased their disease; and for them is a painful punishment because they [habitually] used to lie.And when it is said to them, "Do not cause corruption on the earth," they say, "We are but reformers."Unquestionably, it is they who are the corrupters, but they perceive [it] not.And when it is said to them, "Believe as the people have believed," they say, "Should we believe as the foolish have believed?" Unquestionably, it is they who are the foolish, but they know [it] not""

The prophet Muhammads rules of war are as follows.

Do not cut a tree,
kill a child,
an old person,
destroy a place of worship,
temple or church,
destroy a building,
kill those who surrender,
those who run away,
a woman,
a sick person,
a monk or priest,
an animal (except for eating).
Do not disfigure the dead, don't enforce islam,
feed your prisoners and be good to them.
Posted by TheThinker01 1 month ago
TheThinker01
Isis' formaton was simply politics, tell me one thing religious about this.

1979 Soviets invade Afghanistan and cause Afghani's to struggle, and they're agressiveness, immorality, and pointlessness of the war, gives birth to groups of angry muslims.

1990 Bin Laden creates al Qaeda, Zarqawi fails to create group (IS).

They then go back to afghanistan and work with taliban.

2001- 911

2002 :

U.S invades afghanistan, Bin Landen flees to pakistan

U.S Invade Iraq, Saddam Hussain and cause sunni insurgency.

Zarqawi takes lead, deliberatley targets shia and causes Sunni, Shia split.
2004

2003: Abu Musab al Zarqawi took advantage of disorder amongst the sunnis after U.S invasion to create Al Qaeda in Iraq, then attacks embassies in Iraq.He had an army of 50,000 insugents.

2005-8, Sunnis are called to fight Al Qaeda.

Febuary 2006, al Qaeda attacks the golden al askari mosque, the most holy shrin for shia muslims.

Zarqawi killed by U.S airstrike.

2010 Iraq is temporarily free and stable, and this causes the US to leave.

2011, arab spring, bashar assad of syria (not Iraq) violently controls protesters who eventually fight back.

This leads to syrian civil war.

In Iraq, the Al Qaida in Iraq change name to ISI, under lead of abu bakr al baghdadi.

2012:

He then sends a new branch called "jashat al nushra," to syria to fight alongside the rebels

He then attacks prisons, releasing former Jihadists and recruits new ones among the broken prisoners, and possibly may have forced them to join.

2013- Baghdadi then declares he will take control of both rebel forces being ISI and the syrian rebels, forming ISIS, (Islamic State in Iraq and Syria) There is much conflict concerning his demand, mainly with the jashat al nushra.

Dictator Assad tolerates this divide, because the groups are now fighting eachother rather than his own army.

2014- Conflict is over, ISIS is under Baghdadi.

Iraqi Sunni's surrender to ISIS and help tak
Posted by TheThinker01 1 month ago
TheThinker01
What about the African "Christian" terrorist in Begui, eating muslims alive, arethey Christians?

What about the racist Dutch Reform Church, the KKK, Nazi are they?

What about the Buddhist monks in Burma, slaughtering muslims and raping they're daughters, are they Buddhist.

What about the Hindus in India, slaughtering the minority muslims left in India?
Posted by TheThinker01 1 month ago
TheThinker01
Before you attack Islam, look at your own religion.
Posted by TheThinker01 1 month ago
TheThinker01
Exodus 21 : 20/21

"If a man strikes his servant or his maid with a rod, and he dies under his hand, he shall surely be punished. Notwithstanding, if he gets up after a day or two, he shall not be punished, for he is his property.

2 King 2 : 23/24

And he went up from thence unto Beth-el: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. He looked behind him and saw them, and cursed them in the name of Yahweh. Two female bears came out of the woods, and mauled forty-two of those children.

Leviticus 20 : 15

And if a man lie with a beast for copulation, he shall certainly be put to death; and ye shall kill the beast.

Exodus 19 : 13

not a hand shall touch it, but it shall certainly be stoned, or shot through; whether it be a beast or a man, it shall not live. When the long drawn note of the trumpet soundeth, they shall come up to the mountain.
Posted by TheThinker01 1 month ago
TheThinker01
*RJUPUDI*
VIOLENCE IN THE BIBLE.

Zechariah 14 : 2

For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city will be taken, the houses rifled, and the women ravished (RAPED). Half of the city will go out into captivity, and the rest of the people will not be cut off from the city

Judges 21 : 10

The congregation sent there twelve thousand men of the most valiant, and commanded them, saying, "Go and strike the inhabitants of Jabesh Gilead with the edge of the sword, with the women and the little ones.

Numbers 31 : 17/18

Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man by lying with him. But all the girls, who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.

Deuteronomy 20 : 16/18

But of the cities of these peoples, that Yahweh your God gives you for an inheritance, you shall save alive nothing that breathes; but you shall utterly destroy them: the Hittite, and the Amorite, the Canaanite, and the Perizzite, the Hivite, and the Jebusite; as Yahweh your God has commanded you;

Joshua 6 : 21

They utterly destroyed all that was in the city, both man and woman, both young and old, and ox, and sheep, and donkey, with the edge of the sword.

Joshua 10 : 28

Joshua took Makkedah on that day, and struck it with the edge of the sword, with its king. He utterly destroyed them and all the souls who were in it. He left none remaining. He did to the king of Makkedah as he had done to the king of Jericho.

Deuteronomy 7 : 20-24

Moreover Yahweh your God will send the hornet among them, until those who are left, and hide themselves, perish from before you...
He will deliver their kings into your hand, and you shall make their name to perish from under the sky: no man shall be able to stand before you, until you have destroyed them.
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