The Instigator
ilovejews7
Con (against)
The Contender
qwzx
Pro (for)

If our current version of capitalism works, why is their so many post recession part-time workers?

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Debate Round Forfeited
qwzx has forfeited round #5.
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/13/2017 Category: Society
Updated: 9 months ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 359 times Debate No: 101947
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (2)
Votes (0)

 

ilovejews7

Con

There is a record number of part-time workers, independent contractors and concentrated poverty, post recession economy. With the wealth being so centralized, and people struggling to meet the basics of maslow's hierarchy of needs, is capitalism working, and if so, can the system continue this way? With automation encroaching the labor force, how can the system continue to meet the volume of consumer spending if jobs are being replaced? How can a system such as this continue when austerity is the answer? how can a system such as this, mitigate the variable and unpredictable effects of climate change, which cost the united states, as well as the global economy, significant, record amounts of capital...

excuse my unedited grammar sentence structurue

http://www.politico.com...

https://www.theguardian.com...

https://www.theguardian.com...

https://www.washingtonpost.com...

Sources below:

http://money.cnn.com...

http://www.reuters.com...

https://www.theguardian.com...

https://www.theguardian.com...
https://www.ncdc.noaa.gov...

https://www.yahoo.com...
qwzx

Pro

So you said a bunch of stuff with a bunch of premises in which I want to address. I want to break it down for easier comprehension of your arguments.

Your Premises
1. Wealth is being centralized
2. Automation is replacing labor force
3. Capitalism can't stop climate change
4. There is a record number of part-time workers, independent contractors and concentrated poverty, post recession economy

Your Conclusions
1. People in USA are struggling to meet the basics of Maslow's hierarchy of needs
2. Capitalism and Free Trade is failing. The economy will essentially go crappy again due to lack of jobs
3. Capitalism is wasting money on environmentalism and therefore bad.
4. Economy must be going downhill

While wealth is being centralized in the USA, that is not inherently a bad thing. Inequality and inequity are TWO different things. The wealthy today is simply richer than the wealthy of yesterday. People in the USA on the whole are not struggling to meet the basic needs of survival. The average person in America can make it past the safety tier of the hierarchy, even the homeless have welfare checks and charity organizations. Very few people are actually starving to death and can't fulfill the basic needs, to paint a picture of a struggling America is false. Automation replaces jobs and you are indeed correct. AND......? It might surprise you but humans adapt to new technologies, the invention of cars replaced the horse drawn carriage and factories replaced cottage industries. You don't think the factory workers aren't just going to leave and get a new job? The Industrial Revolution replaced many jobs with new technology, the USA's economy after the revolution did not just fall over and die due to the decrease in jobs. Capitalism is an economic strategy and has nothing to do environmentalism. The MARKET has wasted money on environmentalism due to governmental pressure and that is usually the opposite of capitalism. You then go on to talk about how there is a record high in part time jobs after the fairly recent recession of 2008. It might surprise you but, an increasing population and growing workforce right after a recession tends to lead to slightly above normal levels of part-time workers, independent contractors and concentrated poverty. It simply takes time to transition unemployed to part time and then to full time workers.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org...
https://en.wikipedia.org...
https://www.merriam-webster.com...
https://en.wikipedia.org...
https://en.wikipedia.org...
http://www.heritage.org...
http://sgba-resource.ca...
Debate Round No. 1
ilovejews7

Con

I agree with you regarding automation as well as some other things, such as inequity.

Even though 2016's natural disasters were the costliest of the united states history, it shouldnt be implicated that future climate change related disasters will increase the federal budget, despite the trend of unusual natural disasters amounting to the trillions between 1980-2017 ( https://www.ncdc.noaa.gov...) Climate change is costing several sectors significant losses such as agriculture ( coffee, potatoes etc), fishing industry ( cod) as well as tourism( southern florida). Climate change is also projected to signficantly shave profits off of the global economy
qwzx

Pro

You are confusing climate change with natural disasters. Climate change is where the water levels will rise a couple feet after a hundred years or so. Humans adapt to such "problems" for centuries now and we are doing fine. The city of Venice has been flooding since it's creation and it's population is not dying at a rapid rate. There will still be tornadoes, hurricanes, earthquakes, volcanic eruptions regardless of climate change. In fact, we don't even know how much climate change even really affects us. All the studies conducted tend to be rushed and many have been proven to contain some falsified data. I am not saying all studies are lies but, this type of research requires more time to monitor. To give up the most effective economic system on the basis of a maybe is too risky and would truly harm the world's economy.
Debate Round No. 2
ilovejews7

Con

1. america alone had six 1-1000 yr precipitation events that economically inundated several states since 2010

2. Since 1980 - present natural disasters have cost the federal budget a total of $1.1 trillion dollars. The most expensive total sum spanning three decades. If these storms were not unusual, how come the storms did not amount to the billions annually, between 1950- 1979? Last year alone, natural disaster cost america a historical amount of $16 billion dollars.

3. the 2011 icelandic volcano eruption ,as well as its future eruptions, are actually linked to climate change. The deglaciation, in the vicinity of the Eyjafjallaj"kull volcano, is allowing magma to rise, which will obviously continue due to earth becoming warmer. The 2011 Eyjafjallaj"kull volcano delayed europeans flights which affected the economy...

4. Climate change has been quite expensive for cities such as Miami. Miami, which has a limestone foundation, is resorting to expensive pumps to pump out the dramatically rising sea during normal storms. Climate change is also an expensive problem for many coastal tourist cities that are experiencing unique beach closures dilemmas , such as flesh eating bacteria and green algae, not just from phosphorous, but from warming waters.

Excuse my unedited grammar and sentence structure

sources:

http://www.yalescientific.org...

http://science.time.com...

https://www.nasa.gov...

https://www.climate.gov...

https://www.usatoday.com...
qwzx

Pro

So you managed to make a solid case about how natural disasters hurt the economy but what does it have to do with Capitalism? You had danced around my question during round 1. We are debating Capitalism effectiveness in question due to the record high post recession part-time workers. I have already addressed that issue in it's entirety and have fulfilled my requirements in this debate. I don't have to get involved in this sidetracking about climate change. Unless, you can provide me a solid argument with evidence on how Capitalism and Climate Change is linked...I see no reason to discuss this topic with you.
Debate Round No. 3
ilovejews7

Con

If tomatoes become expensive to grow, how can a businessman sell pizza?

my last response was evident of how climate change is already affecting economies worldwide
qwzx

Pro

Even then you must explain how Capitalism causes such climate change. If, Capitalism isn't the culprit then the system is not flawed and leaves your whole climate change argument obsolete.

If, your argument is that Capitalism is incapable of changing itself to adapt to climate change then you are completely wrong. Capitalism is where the most efficient solution is implemented to maximize profit. That is why revolutionary inventions such as the railroads, radio, TV, internet, etc. were easily implemented in Capitalist societies.

If, tomatoes become too expensive then the business man will sell more expensive pizzas or just switch over to a more profitable item. The debate title is about Capitalism and NOT the effects of climate change on the economy.
Debate Round No. 4
ilovejews7

Con

1. the capitalism that your referring to, is gone.

2. Trickle down economics has exasperated poverty since its enactment. here is a report by the world bank that better explains the effects of reaganomics: http://elibrary.worldbank.org...

3. green house gas Mitigation is what will benefit not just the economy but our species. It is obvious that we have no choice to adapt especially when several areas experience things that scientists refer to as "climate shifts". However, relying solely on climate change adaption to increase profit, is futile as well as ignorant, unless if businessmen one day miraculously possess magical powers. Here are three examples of climate change adaption issues:
http://www.nola.com...

http://www.miamiherald.com...

https://www.nytimes.com...

4. Even though the unemployment rate is 5%, 6.1 million americans live below the poverty line and are seeking full-time jobs....The economy has gained most its jobs that were lost during the recession, yet concentrated poverty as well as a higher than normal part-time worker rate, indicates a trend of failed economic policies. And this seems more troubling as automation which is different from past innovations especially in regards to the work force, further encroaches its convenience into the job market.

excuse my unedited grammar sentence struture punctuation imcomplete sentences
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 5
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by ilovejews7 9 months ago
ilovejews7
I am a psuedo intellectual so i dont know. I see opportunist everywhere,and i wonder how their endeavors will gain, when there are such big systemic problems, that will inevitably affect everybody, even the elite. That is why i made this "debate". The title was wrong and it was naive in details...
Posted by RR-MKIV 9 months ago
RR-MKIV
You didn't happen to base this on a forum post that happened a little while ago that included a vid on automated systems seizing human jobs? Just curious, there are a lot of parallels here...
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