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Post Voting Period
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/22/2010 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 7 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,264 times Debate No: 12388
Debate Rounds (2)
Comments (4)
Votes (2)




Opponent's choices:

1) The Cleveland Indians & Atlanta Braves should not have to change their mascot.
2) Education modifications are unrealistic in the real world.
3) DUI is the equivilent of attempted manslaughter.

In Round 1, my opponent will only leave me my 3 choices to be argued in Round 2. My opponent will choose 1 of the above the and argue either side in Round 2.

Judges will determine who presented the better case. Good luck and enjoy!


I thank my opponent for the debate.

I shall leave my opponent with three choices for argumentation in Round 2.

I choose to argue my opponent's first presented choice.

I will debate the proposition, "The Cleveland Indians & Atlanta Braves should not have to change their mascot."

Here are my opponent's choices:

1) Should the National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA) pay its athletes? Should amateur players be compensated for the use of their names and images in official NCAA merchandise?

2) Should certain types of advertisements—such as for prescription drugs, alcohol or tobacco, and ads aimed at young people—be regulated? Or should companies be allowed to present their products as they wish, leaving it up to the consumer to decide whether to buy the product?

3) Since the 1980s, AIDS has killed roughly 32 million people worldwide, and there are currently some 40 million people living with HIV/AIDS. Is focusing on prevention efforts the best way to combat the disease? Or should efforts focus on treating those who already have HIV/AIDS? How should other diseases, such as malaria, be addressed?

I thank my opponent for the debate.
Debate Round No. 1


twsurber forfeited this round.


Unfortunately, my opponent has forfeited the debate.

Here is some interesting information that supports the continuation of sports mascots that represent Native Americans or Native American symbols.

Why would a team or school name itself after something that it did not like and respect? That is the question often posed by those who support using Native American images for sports teams. If people did not view Native Americans in a positive light, they would not name teams after them, proponents say.

"Teams are not named after things that people don't like," says Roger Clegg of the conservative National Review. "After all, people will be rooting for the team and, in the case of schools, will call themselves whatever the team's name is, even if they aren't on it."

That Native American imagery has become popular among sports teams is actually quite understandable, supporters say. For many, Indians represent honor, courage and determination--all qualities that are revered on the field of play. "We often associate with Indians the same martial virtues that we like in our athletes: courage, strength, boldness, resourcefulness," says Clegg. So, proponents say, choosing a mascot that symbolizes the qualities that athletes are supposed to possess makes sense.

The University of Illinois and Chief Illiniwek are among those heavily criticized by opponents of Native American mascots. But many people, including Illinois Gov. George Ryan (R), say they cannot understand what the fuss is about. "I think it's done honorably. I think it's done professionally," Ryan said of the mascot. "I don't see any degradation at all."

Many Native American team names, supporters say, come about as the result of a geographic or historical connection. Florida State University, for example, is nicknamed the Seminoles because that tribe is from Florida. The Cleveland Indians were named in honor of the first Native American to play in the major leagues.

Given the history of most Native American team names, supporters say, the argument that they are an intentional insult is not valid. "It seems a little odd to suggest that naming a team after Indians is a calculated insult," Clegg says.

Many team names and mascots have long traditions at schools, and to throw away that tradition is unfair, supporters say. This is particularly true at colleges and high schools, where an entire student body, and often an entire town, roots for a school's teams and feels a connection to the past via the name adopted by the teams. To remove all traces of a school's past is hardly beneficial, they say.

For example, in the Fonda-Fultonville school district, just north of Albany, N.Y., the high school teams have been named the Braves for decades. The name "has been part of the school since its founding in 1953," school superintendent Glen Goodale says. "A lot of kids I've talked to construe the name 'Brave' as someone to be looked up to and revered as someone with qualities that are virtues."

Supporters also say that many Native American tribes are honored to have teams named for them. Cambridge, another town north of Albany, still calls its teams the Indians. And they have support from some local Native Americans. "I feel like when the Cambridge school is representing itself as the Indians, they're doing it in a positive kind of way," says David Honyoust, an Oneida chief. "They're making it good to be a Cambridge Indian in sports. They aren't making fun."

At Eastern Michigan University (EMU) in Ypsilanti, Mich., the sports teams used to be called the Hurons, after the Huron Indians of that region. In the early 1990s, the regents of the school voted to switch the name to the Eagles.

Descendants of the Hurons were not consulted about the switch and disagreed with the decision because they said that the name was an honor to their people. Despite the efforts of the Huron-Wyandotte Association of Southern Michigan and Huron chiefs from Oklahoma and Canada, the school did not reverse its decision.

Central Michigan University (CMU) lies less than 150 miles north of EMU, in Mount Pleasant, Mich. But the story at CMU is quite different. CMU sports teams are also named for an Indian tribe, the Chippewas, but unlike EMU, they continue to use their Indian name. As at EMU, the tribe supports the use of the Indian name. "The team name helps people recognize that we're a tribe in the middle of Michigan," says Frank Cloutier, a spokesman for the Saginaw Chippewa tribe.

Experts say that sensitivity on the part of schools using Native American imagery is essential. School administrators at CMU work with the tribe to ensure that the name is used respectfully. For instance, the school has agreed not to use an image of a Chippewa on its logo. And fans at games do not beat drums in the stands or do the tomahawk chop.

Another example of a school and tribe that have cooperated is Florida State University (FSU) and the Seminole tribe. While some criticize FSU for using the Seminole as its mascot, the tribe has actually worked very closely with the school. For instance, the tribe helped the school design the Seminole costume that an FSU student wears during football games. And the mascot, named Chief Osceole, is named for a real Seminole chief who fought federal soldiers during the 1830s.

Some supporters also point out that teams and schools would incur a considerable expense in changing names and mascots. For a professional team, the burden might not be so bad, because it can market apparel with their new logo and likely make more money in the process, analysts say. But college and, in particular, high school teams often simply lack the funds to go through a name and mascot change, proponents note.

One high school football coach and athletic director from upstate New York said that it would cost around $100,000 to change the school's Indian logo. The school's teams would need new uniforms and all of the symbols would have to be removed from the school and athletic facilities. With school budgets facing shortfalls, and with sports generally given lower priority than academics, some supporters say that schools simply could not pay to change their logos. And if they were forced to change, proponents say, students might be forced to pay for their own uniforms.

Proponents also point out that Native Americans are not the only people portrayed in logos: Other groups are represented as well. For example, the University of Notre Dame has the Fighting Irish, San Diego State University has the Aztecs, the NFL has the Minnesota Vikings and the Montreal Canadiens are one of the better known teams in the National Hockey League.

Supporters of Native American team names wonder why none of the other groups speak out against the use of their names. "Few if any people think these team names are slanderous, even after a losing season," writes John Miller of the National Review. Supporters wonder why Indian team names are being singled out for removal.

Some supporters also contend that deciding whether to rename a team or keep a name is an issue that should be decided locally. So far neither the federal government nor any state government has stepped in and mandated a name change. But some analysts say it could happen, especially in the wake of the past year's condemnation of Native American names and mascots by the U.S. Commission on Civil Rights and the New York State board of education.

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Debate Round No. 2
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by studentathletechristian8 7 years ago
I had a decent argument for my topic. Shall I post it?
Posted by twsurber 7 years ago
Well poo, I missed my round! SCA8 gets this one.
Posted by twsurber 7 years ago
Nags, I suppose it could be. Maybe I should have called it attempted murder? A person assumes risks and liabilities when they get behind the wheel of an automobile after consuming a certain amount of alcohol or prescription medication. Given this, it is common knowledge that they are endangering other people's lives. If they kill someone in an intoxicated state, a case can be made against them.
Posted by Xer 7 years ago
Attempted manslaughter seems to be an oxymoron. No?
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by InsertNameHere 7 years ago
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Vote Placed by studentathletechristian8 7 years ago
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Total points awarded:06