The Instigator
faraecho
Con (against)
Winning
16 Points
The Contender
Emorose
Pro (for)
Losing
7 Points

In LeVay's Satanist Bible Satan does exist

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 4 votes the winner is...
faraecho
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/20/2009 Category: Religion
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 3,394 times Debate No: 7494
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (12)
Votes (4)

 

faraecho

Con

I do not believe that there is a Satan that lives in some imaginary Hell.

There is no proof that there is a person that lives in the depths of the Underworld and tortures the dead souls brought before him. I do not believe that there is an afterlife in which Satan can reside in. No one has ever experienced the pleasure of seeing or feeling him in a sane state of mind.

Christians believe that their Holy Bible provides proof that there is a Hell, and that all that do not believe will be condemned to eternal damnation in the fiery pits of their Hell. This is merely nonsense. Christians love to delude their followers into believing that there is an afterlife that you will receive if you do not abide by the strict rules of the "Holy Ghost". Not only is their religion corrupted, but Satan is only a mascot that strikes fear into the believers of God.

Many people believe that the religion Satanism has to do with making pacts with the Devil, and selling your soul to him. This is a ridiculous notion that I ridicule and laugh at. Souls exist as much as Satan does. I believe that Satanist's use the Christian's name for the Lord of Hell as a mockery statement, since Satanism is basically the opposite of Christianity (or any other theist belief) Satanist's mock the Christians with the name of their god's nemesis. So therefore this states that Satanism is not another one of the many religions that state Satan exists because Satanist's do not worship something that doesn't exist. They believe in the truth. As the Satanic Bible states that Satan is merely a representation.

Side note: The following answers the question, "If you don't believe that Satan exists, why do you call the entity a he? "
I believe it is rude to call things an it, even if they don't exist, and that if Satan were to exist that he would not be a girl, much to my displeasure.

Source link: The Satanic Bible- http://std.kku.ac.th...
Emorose

Pro

I believe there is a Satan, aka devil.

It says so in the Satanist bible, http://std.kku.ac.th...
Since this is rather long I will let you know, it is on page 7.

I will allow my opponent to explain where she gets the notions from, before explaining my point any further.
Debate Round No. 1
faraecho

Con

I will post the rest of my argument when it is not three in the morning and you (Emorose) are actually online so I can ask you random questions which make absolutely no sense.

In this round I was planning to ask each and every one of you if you have actually seen Satan. You cannot prove that something exists if you've never seen it, or felt it, or can even catch an atom of it. That is said because people would complain about the air. You can't see it (your can feel it), but you can catch an atom of it and declare that it is indeed air. Since no Satan atoms have been yet to be identified, there is no reason for anyone to believe that there is a Satan, or an afterlife, etc.

I would like to also, quickly, mention that the Holy Bible and the Satanic Bible are written by men. And of all creatures, who would think that man would be honest? So, just because there are bibles it doesn't really clarify that there is a Satan.

This veto's my earlier comment about how I mentioned that the Satanic Bible mentioned that there was no Satan. I would like to mention that LeVay did also mention several times that there is an existing Satan. The comments are vague, as far as I can tell, and I will be honest. I haven't gotten a chance to read the Satanic Bible, yet. I'm going by what my friend told me.
So what if there were no bibles? No religion? Who would doubt me? They would probably laugh that I even asked such a silly question, but since we do live in a world of religion and men's ideas, etc. I feel the need to justify my reasoning.

One more thing I must mention before I retire. The Satanic Bible says that there is no afterlife. So if Satan did exist, where would he reside? I do not think it would be likely of him to reside in the human world? But I will take it into consideration. I have a question to ask my opponent. If we both agree that there is no afterlife, and that Satan exists in this world, what form does he exist in? Does he change forms? Is he considered just a dark mass, waiting for blind humans to tap into? If you would answer that, than maybe I can better argue my case.
If we assumed that Satan was just a black mass that "tainted" the minds of humans that got to close, there would have to be some proof that he was there. A human would've been bound to have come across it before in ancient times, and wrote of it. Or it would've been detected by humans equipment. After all, we've pretty much discovered what's on the inside of the Earth without every looking inside of it (but we could be wrong). I do have another question. If Satan does exist, wouldn't he be smart enough to evade such equipment, or would he let himself be caught? And so concludes my turn.
Emorose

Pro

LOL!!! I am very surprised you took that aproach.

Okay (I already told her this like 2 days ago, but I'll repeat it for everyone on the internet to know)
The LaVey version of Satanism does NOT see Satan as a physical being. They see him more as "the evil" that must be in the world. The reason Satan exists is because religion exists. (let's pick on Christians, I really don't mean to offend, if you offend easily STOP READING NOW!), if they hadn't made a God that made basic human insticts as sin, and there needed to be a punishment for that what shouldit be? I know the scariest thing would be to burn in a lake of lava for eternity! Oh, but we must tell them they don't need any of them. The reason they feel need is they are being influenced. By what? I don't see anything? Satan! He hides, and guides you to think and do his will! We must pour holy water on you and sing some random songs about being SAVED!!!
Anyway it is written that he exists because people do "evil" by eing jealous, gluttonous, angry, proud, or any of the other 7 deadly sins.
BTW they are called deadly because it is said that "If you do any of them you are being influenced by Satan, and your soul is lost to be dead in a pit of lava."

Therfore, according to the Satanic Bible written by LaVey, there is a Satan, because Christianity (well any religion could fit) exists.
Debate Round No. 2
faraecho

Con

Okay, so what if the LeVey (sorry more misspelling his last name earlier) says that there is a Satan? The books was written according to one person's views. LeVey wasn't one to be considered as an almighty powerful being with all knowing knowledge, so there isn't any reason to see that his essays are entirely correct. I understand that this questions my religion so no comments about it. Also consider that the Holy Bible was written by a man. Yes. Yes I am questioning your religion. If I weren't already doing that.

So we now agree that we mean a non-physical form of Satan that is used? Not the Christians version. Sorry, Christians, we just love to pick on you while making our point. You say that Satanist's see Satan as "the evil" that must be in the world? Are you saying that there must be evil in the world? I thought that we both agreed that Satanism was the truth. Not an evil. And now back to the topic. I would like to mention that the name Satan is once again being used as a representation. Satanists, Christians, etc. are using the name Satan for a representation of "the evil" or the "lord of Hell".

Some man decided that the world was to depressing if people thought that there really was no afterlife, and so he wrote the bible (whichever one you believe was written first). He used (let's just assume the Holy Bible was written first) the name Satan as a representation of the Lord of Hell. Hell being the place of eternal condemnation, a place where bad souls go. The man must've thought while righting the bible, "Hey, if I'm giving something for people to believe in, I might as well tell them that they should be good in this life. That might make them behave better. "
So after so many years, Satanism comes along and sees right through the Holy Bible, and form their own "religion". You could call Satanism more of a life choice. Satanism basically tells you that the Holy Bible is a lie. That means that Satan is a lie. Along with God and heaven and hell.

You could say that evil exists, but not in a physical form. When it becomes a physical form I might consider giving it a name, but I don't think that I would think that the evil in physical form was this "almighty, lord of hell" guy. Its just an emotion, anyway. Happiness, sadness, and anger aren't in physical forms (as we know of yet) and we haven't given them names. I'm going to go ahead and ask each and every one of you what would you call happiness if you could give it a name?
Emorose

Pro

LMAO you just proved my point.

Saying Satan exists, but not physically, wasn't that like my whole arguement?

Sorry Christians, but for arguements sake don't we already know the Christian veiw is wrong.

LMAO you don't understand much do you. Do yourself a favor and actually read the bible (La Vey's Satanic one of course). It's in your best interest, if you want to win any type of debate with it envolved.

La Vey's Satanism, doesn't worship Satan. The deal is, in the case of the 7 deadly sins it preaches indulgance where-as Christianity preaches abstinice.
Thus Christians saw to it that those that believed in indulgance in those were "devil worshippers".
Some people heard of this and formed a Theist Satanism, where Satan is as real as he is in christian veiw.

Because Christians saw them as the same, and that the 7 deadly sins were influenced by Satan, that soon formed La Vey's version of Satanism. The one we are arguing about.

We wouldn't be debating if it weren't for the Christians for they created Satan, according to La Vey Satanism, just the same as they created God.

If God symbolises all that is good, then Satan represents the opposite.

Thus you see Satan=evil
whereas La Vey's veiw on Satanism only sees the truth.

Thus according to The Satanic Bible as written by Anton Szandor LaVey believes that Satan exists.
Debate Round No. 3
12 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Emorose 8 years ago
Emorose
ummm okay....
Posted by faraecho 8 years ago
faraecho
good luck deciphering that cuz i can't and i wrote th *amn thing
Posted by faraecho 8 years ago
faraecho
why do we calv satanists though...stupid keyoard it has taken me ten min.2 just rit this so no i am typin lik u txt & dat isnt working i'll rit whati hav tsay wh m kyboard is woking beue;'musfoettitbk s buoneause that isn't workingso you can see how crappy the keyboard is...oh great now it's woking..

rose i thouht we agreed we were'tgoing to go easy on one another? ithough we didn'tcare? stupid space bar....anyway...i'm winningsomehow

how the h*ll am i lady? chihiro dude guy thingy...

and what's that supposedtomean? 'your approach was more interesting anyway'? huh? whatever i'm to tired to make a goodthreat....i went to magi springs and th idios didn't hve ourtickets printed yet andthi keyboard is still screwing up and so we waiting in the hot sun for ou tickets and th struid people wouldn't let me change attco bell so i had the change inside the parand since it wasso hot it was hard to change because my d*mn clothes were sticking to me. so anyway. i stayed in hte water park all day andfloated down hte lazy riverwhich isn'tso lazy. a kid nearly drowned in th wave pool um...lets see what esehppened? lori lost her fone. phone...whtever...i havn't read the satanist bible atallrose,. i'm too lazy. i came with random stuff out o the buttom of my head.

anyway. i thoughtwe were talking about something like a christian['s idea of a satan because i thougt you aidthat levay's bible (i think i may have misspelled his name) mentioned htat thereisa christian's iea o a satani existing somewhere around here so i thought we weregoing todebate about the fact that he doesnt exist but satan is anoher word forevil and i suppose evidoes exist althoughit may not be evil to the person...crp what do you call thosep eople? there's victims and then...what are they called? screw it. screw it screw it! argh! u mother f*cking keyboard! you will die! you stupidownloading thigy that i DELETED!! but isstill thereyou mother f*cking something!! ahh!!

where was i? oh yeah, i'm outof
Posted by Emorose 8 years ago
Emorose
LMAO! Farah that was the exact thing I thought of first and I was like "No, she hasn't read much, I'll go really easy on her. Besides this is her first debate."

Who says we don't follow it? lol, I agree with most of it, but I don't follow it, or any other religion. Interesting to dable in though. lol
Posted by feverish 8 years ago
feverish
The interesting fact is that most Christian's idea of Satan isn't represented in the Christian Bible, never mind the so-called satanist one.
http://www.debate.org...
Posted by Epicism 8 years ago
Epicism
Replace abstinence with indulgence...

And that's why I should stop typing past the 2AM mark.
Posted by Epicism 8 years ago
Epicism
I suppose you could have just said Satan exists because Satan is;
Abstinence,
Vital existence,
Undefiled wisdom,
Kindness to the deserving,
Vengeance,
Responsibility to the responsible,
Man perceived as an animal,
And so called "sins".

As long as these things exist, Satan exists. Then Con would have to prove that none of these things exist in the universe in order to disprove "Satan".. But your approach was more interesting anyways lol.
Posted by chihiro 8 years ago
chihiro
I have a friend here that is a satanist herself.Sometimes it's best to just have a chit chat with people who actually follow the religion rather than try to interpret something in your own eyes.

enjoy ladies!
Posted by Emorose 8 years ago
Emorose
no. Satan existing. At all.

I TOLD you I could prove it. And all my points
It's your fault for not listening.
Posted by faraecho 8 years ago
faraecho
i thought we were argueing against a physical satan? isn't that what we agreed upon?
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Vote Placed by mongeese 8 years ago
mongeese
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