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The Contender
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7 Points

Informal: Skepticism

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/20/2010 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 6 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 1,574 times Debate No: 12377
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (11)
Votes (2)




You don't know anything because you could be a brain in a vat/deceived by an evil daemon/fed false information from your perception, etc.

Yea, I dropped the bomb lol

Just looking for someone to pick my brain on the topic.


I am one of the evil daemons and I cannot pick your brain because it against health regulations for me to take it out of the vat.
Also, you didn't drop the bomb. That was false information we fed into your brain.
Debate Round No. 1


First, I would like to thank my opponent for returning my debate.

I would like to negate my opponents points.

Point 1: It is within health regulations to remove brains from vats in Midland, Texas, where this debate is being virtually held. But if we are all brains in vats being fed information, one brain cannot remove another brain from a vat, so this negates the notion of my opponent being an evil daemon.

Point 2: The false information that is being fed into my brain must be fed by a "mover" or some sort of cause. Since there is an infinite regress of potential "movers" for who set up the brain in a vat, there is actually no one to feed the information. If there is no feeder, there is no fed, thus I negate my opponents point of feeding me false information.

Being that my opponent is both a brain in a vat and not an evil daemon, I have shown that his testified information is not reliable or true. Anything he says from this point on is on behalf of his lies and should be ignored by the voters.

Thank you.


I would like to thank my opponent's brain in the vat.

The location of this debate is actually Section XHJ-019 of the Cratylus section of our Brain Vat unit, where my opponent XHY-019-74937's brain is located. Part 2, Division 3.5, Section 47 of the Brain Vat Health and Safety act of 2837AD clearly states: "No unqualified member of staff is to clean, open, modify, tamper, move or eat any part of the SRL-100 Brain Vat unit. Any violation of this code will result in immediate disembowelment."
As a member of the simulated reality design division, I am not qualified to gain access to your brain outside the vat and would risk disembowelment by doing so.

My Daemon name is Qualeixjar, a denizen from the Hadesrealm and as I previously mentioned, I am a member of the Simulated Reality Design division of our Earthrealm operation. I am unable to provide evidence of this because it would cause a fatal error in the programming of this Reality which would result in a massive loss in our Brain Harvest. Since human brains are such a delicacy among my kind, such a loss would result in me having to spend between 800 and 1000 years encased in a Lava prison sorting out screws of different sizes into separate piles.

I believe my extensive knowledge of such things will prove beyond doubt that I am in fact a Daemon, not one of the brain in a vat. My opponent is forming what we call a Explanatory Loop in his False Knowledge Regulator to account for my revealing myself, hence why he will continue to argue that I am not a Daemon. Without such an automated device programmed his brain would melt, causing his False Reality to disappear. We generally explain such disappearances by Alien Abduction or Spontaneous Human Combustion.
Debate Round No. 2


I would like to again thank my opponents brain in a vat for telling such a remarkable work of fiction. Unfortunately, Richard Wrangham already wrote that in his epilogue at the end of his book Sexual Coercion in Primates and Humans'.( Harvard University Press, Cambridge, MA.) This is often a malfunction that can be similarly seen to the brains of the red-headed barbet in vats. Yes, animals are also brains in vats. This was pointed out by Duncan Campbell, the 1st lord of Loch Awe in the 1400's.
In psychology, they would call Con's reaction to this malfunction "cognitive dissonance." He has actually created a virtual world within the realm of his brain in a vat. This could be similar to the infinite regress of virtual worlds programmed to create other virtual worlds. (Sims characters creating other Sim like characters on this Sim computers.) This situation is only a result of a malfunction of certain mono-poles in Con's brain.
A reaction similar to this is what other brains in vats call "the big bang," which is the giant mass collision and beginning point of the expansion of the universe and "brain in vattiness."
Please disregard Cons rambling as it is a side effect of the malfunction.

Thank you.


I will keep my forth round argument short and sweet.

I believe I have already explained all my opponents arguments through my discussion on Explanatory Loops and False Knowledge Regulators. So let me take a different angle.

I call this the tri-attack of daemon doom!

The contention of my opponent is to prove that YOU don't know anything, because you could be a brain in a vat and blah blah blah. The key here is the YOU part. Either he is talking about "Everyone" including himself, "Everyone" not including himself or "YOU" the person reading this right now.
Let me address each of these.

If he is talking about "Everyone" including himself, he loses the debate because his third round argument implies that he knows that I am not a daemon and he refers to knowledge to base this contention on. If he argues that he doesn't know this, this is paramount to admitting that I am in fact a daemon, which means I win the debate.

If he is talking about "Everyone" not including himself, he loses the debate because he assumes that everyone knows what The Sims is and bases his third round argument on this assumption. Also, he risks me changing his False Reality programming to trap him inside a room without a door, like a Sim.

If he is talking about "YOU", the person reading this sentence as this very second, he loses the debate because I, the daemon Qualeixjar, declares YOU are the most handsome user of all and flattery will get you EVERYWHERE! BWAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!

Debate Round No. 3


obrya1jr forfeited this round.


As I warned I might do, I have trapped my opponent inside a room and deleted the door, like one might do to a Sim they want to get rid of. Of course, I won't allow him to die and I will alter his memories so that he doesn't remember the traumatic experience.
Debate Round No. 4


Greeting from Portland OR!

Brain in a vat here. I just traveled from Detroit MI to Portland OR in two days! This is a justified true belief coming from an infinitely reliable testifier.

A brain in a vat cannot physically travel from Detroit to Portland in two days.

This is why I had to forfeit the last round.

Thus, I am not a brain in a vat.


Nor am I.
Debate Round No. 5
11 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by J.Kenyon 6 years ago
"What is a Daemon?"

Posted by mongoose 6 years ago
"What is a Daemon?"

An evil type of Digimon.
Posted by wjmelements 6 years ago
What is a Daemon?
Posted by tvellalott 6 years ago
I'm disappointed no one is voting for this. I'm proud of my nonsense. :)
Posted by TheSkeptic 6 years ago
"You don't know anything because you could be a brain in a vat/deceived by an evil daemon/fed false information from your perception, etc."

Well for one, you know that you "could be a brain in a vat/deceived by an evil daemon/fed false information from your perception, etc." :D

Anyway, not only does this not serve to damper the vast majority of our knowledge (as they aren't based on certainty), but even if we did live in a Matrix this still wouldn't endanger most of our beliefs. Chalmers wrote a great article about this.
Posted by Kinesis 6 years ago
Stuff about the brain vat world.
Posted by obrya1jr 6 years ago
What can you know if you are a brain in a vat?
Posted by Vi_Veri 6 years ago
You can still know something if you are a brain in a vat.
Posted by Danielle 6 years ago
Ps. I'm not saying I believed that haha I just like that alternative to the Brain in Vat theory.
Posted by Danielle 6 years ago
Haha this is one of my favorite debates. I've always thought that us being in a virtual reality or rather a simulated (controlled) environment with some kind of spectators is more likely. When I consider how some people can literally create fake worlds via computers (like Sims) it becomes possible to imagine others doing this on a much grander scale, eh? Good luck to both debaters :)
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by tvellalott 5 years ago
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Vote Placed by obrya1jr 6 years ago
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Total points awarded:10