The Instigator
Cutiepuffle
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
Joshokitty
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Is Feminism Still Needed In 2016?

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 0 votes the winner is...
It's a Tie!
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/19/2016 Category: Politics
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 445 times Debate No: 98212
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (3)
Votes (0)

 

Cutiepuffle

Pro

Rules: (by accepting this debate, you accept these rules)
1. My opponent cannot make rebuttals in Round 3, and I cannot in Round 1.
2. Wikipedia is NOT an acceptable source.
3. Due to short argument time, forfeiting a round is NOT an automatic disqualification.

Claim: Feminism is still needed in 2016, in third world countries, and to some extent in the first world, as men and women are not yet completely equal.
Joshokitty

Con

Claim: Feminism in 2016 is not necessary. Note: true definition of feminism is the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.
Debate Round No. 1
Cutiepuffle

Pro

As my opponent has stated, the definition of feminism is: the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.

For economic equality, women are reported to make only 80% of what men make, despite working the same positions.
http://www.iwpr.org...

For social inequality, while it might be to a lesser extent in our first world, in third world countries, women are still suffering from oppression and discrimination.

In Yemen, a woman's word on a trial is only considered half of a man's word.
In Saudi Arabia, women can't vote. Same with Vatican City, what's considered home to one of the largest Christian denominations.
In Morocco, female rape victims can be put in jail for sexual deviancy.
https://www.washingtonpost.com...

The world is a lot larger than people realize, and in many places feminism isn't needed. Yes, the movement could use some redirecting and fixing, but to say we don't need it is absolutely not true.
Joshokitty

Con

On average, yes, women are reported to make less than men despite working the same positions. However, 20% is inaccurate. On sources that DO NOT include "women" in the website address, we see that there is much less than a 20% difference in pay:

http://www.payscale.com...
http://money.cnn.com...

While my opponent focused mainly only on third world countries, first world countries are in much less need of feminism. Take America, for example. In America, women are allowed to vote, protest, go to the same schools and are on the same social and political status of men. There is literally no reason to promote feminism in these first world countries because men and women have never been more equal than now in them.
Debate Round No. 2
Cutiepuffle

Pro

I see my opponent has made no arguments of his own, so I will try to debate common arguments that may or may not arise.

One of the most common arguments against modern feminism is that men and women are already equal in the West. When women acquired the right to vote, people said they already got what they wanted, but they exposed a more severe income inequality and fought to reverse that to their best potential.

Just because you're past step one doesn't mean you stop there. Yes, the revolutionaries of the American Revolution got their own country that allowed them to be free, but to this day, we still fight to help other people acquire the rights they deserve.

This bridges into intersectionality. Intersectionality is the school of thought that the organization and passion that feminists are able to organize are able to be used as a platform to help all sorts of other people gain rights. Feminism started off as rights for white women, evolved to women of all colors, and then eventually expanded to help women of all sexualities and genders. In the process they helped the LGBT and the Civil rights movement.
http://socialdifference.columbia.edu...

With intersectionality, people are able to gain more rights, thanks to feminism's assistance.

And also, there are still problems in our nation regarding gender roles. While women have now made progress and are able to be breadwinners and more expressive, there are still some fields that they still have to pave the way for. Many women aren't being given the same encouragement as their male counterparts to explore STEM fields, due to some of the previous roles for women lingering around.

This is one of the things the feminist movement has been able to help push, as they help young girls broaden their horizons from just the education and healthcare jobs that they are usually prescribed to end up in.
Joshokitty

Con

My opponent has disregarded the definition of feminism we are using which is: the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.

Therefore, this will not cover race relations, sexual orientation or other genders UNLESS related to women and [gender] relationships.

As my opponent stated, women got the right to vote. Great. They got what they wanted, BUT you are correct, they didn't get *everything* they wanted. Yet you failed to name another thing that women fight for.

As for the stereotypical "roles of women," that have been constricting young women of today from exploring STEM fields and more is absolute trash. Women have had the opportunity to explore any fields they would like to be in. Feminism and protesting will not change the past. There is nothing that can be done about the restricted life of women in the past besides learning about it and realizing history shouldn't repeat itself. This argument is irrelevant as the only thing restricting women from being what they want (career-wise) is themselves and those around them, not the roles of women in the past.
Debate Round No. 3
Cutiepuffle

Pro

I would like to apologize for claiming my opponent had no arguments of his own, as I did not see the second half of his round 2 argument.


Link to STEM gap: http://www.esa.doc.gov...



If you are going to bring up the point of the discussion, then need I remind you that the topic is "Is Feminism Needed In 2016?". That's not exclusive to Western Feminism, so to ignore the entire other half of the world that still needs feminism, is something I disapprove of.

And going back to the topic, it's talking about whether feminism is needed. Ergo, the feminist movement. And yes, it is related to women and gender relationships. It's because these LGBT, PoC, and working class groups had women in them that were willing to fight, that they could all unite under one cause to help the oppressed people as a whole. Feminism provides a foundation and a base for people to start off by fighting for women's rights and build off from there. To say that it's not relevant to women would be to ignore the entire point of my argument.

It's easy to say that women have the freedom to choose their major, yet when there are a lack of female role models and societal expectations, women miss out on an opportunity that might have served to empower them.

It doesn't end there. Because of feminism's ties with the pro-choice movement and the fight against sexual assault, the movement is able to assist women in times of need.

Just because the law says something is legal, doesn't mean people aren't going to try to stop it.

Texas passes laws frequently to restrict women who choose to get abortions, while technically working within the law's perimeter.

Feminism, just like any other movement to empower people's rights is a never-ending fight.
Joshokitty

Con

lol since i cant rebut whats the point lmfao gg man EX DEE
Debate Round No. 4
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by whiteflame 1 year ago
whiteflame
*******************************************************************
>Reported vote: Hylian_3000// Mod action: Removed<

4 points to Pro (S&G, Arguments). Reasons for voting decision: Conduct: Both had good conduct S&G: Text language used in last round Arguments: Not only did Con concede, but he only focused on America. The debate was about feminism around the world. Sources: Sources were equal in credibility

[*Reason for removal*] (1) S&G is insufficiently explained. Unless the "text language" used by Con in the final round made the point he was making difficult to understand, this point may not be awarded. (2) Arguments are insufficiently explained. The voter is required to specifically assess arguments made by both debaters. That requires more than just pointing out that Con"s arguments were too narrowly focused on the whole.

Note: The R4 post made by Con is not a clear concession. The rules of the debate required that Con not give rebuttals in his final round. Some of what"s written here could be perceived as a concession, but unless it"s very clear, a concession cannot be the chief reason for awarding points.
************************************************************************
Posted by whiteflame 1 year ago
whiteflame
*******************************************************************
>Reported vote: Agonist// Mod action: Removed<

7 points to Pro. Reasons for voting decision: This was an easy vote. The Contender misunderstood the scope of the debate and argued only with respect to a specific country. The Instigator clearly indicated that the scope was global. Furthermore, the Instigator put in effort in subsequent rounds whilst the Contender essentially conceded after initial resistance.

[*Reason for removal*] (1) The voter doesn"t explain conduct, S&G or sources. (2) Arguments are insufficiently explained. The voter is required to specifically analyze points made by both debaters. Merely stating that one side had a better grasp of the scope of the debate and that they put in more "effort" is not sufficient.

Note: The R4 post made by Con is not a clear concession. The rules of the debate required that Con not give rebuttals in his final round. Some of what"s written here could be perceived as a concession, but unless it"s very clear, a concession cannot be the chief reason for awarding points.
************************************************************************
Posted by Cutiepuffle 1 year ago
Cutiepuffle
Rules should be "I cannot rebut in Round 2, and my opponent cannot rebut in Round 4, sorry"
No votes have been placed for this debate.