The Instigator
tahir.imanov
Con (against)
Winning
13 Points
The Contender
kimmi
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points

Is Jesus God or Son of God (literally)?

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
tahir.imanov
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/9/2013 Category: Religion
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,218 times Debate No: 37544
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (5)
Votes (2)

 

tahir.imanov

Con

To answer this question first we should ask Who God is and Who God is not.

1.God is The Creater and God is The Beginning-less and The End-less. Jesus was born so he has beginning and he died (according to Christianity), so he has end.
2.God is The Dependable, He does not depends on others and needs nothing to depend on. Jesus ate and drank, so he needed food and water to live.
3.God is The All-Seeing, The All-Hearing and The All-Knowing. Jesus did not know and does not know the Hour (the time of last day).

4.God is not subjected to anything of His creation. Jesus lived on Earth, so he was subjected to gravity, time, to all laws of Universe.
5. God cannot be seen. The people who saw Jesus, saw Jesus.
6. God cannot die or cannot be killed. Jesus killed so he died. And also If Jesus is God and If He was crucified then God submitted a suicide.

And also in New Testament Jesus never explicitly says that He is The God or He is The Son (of God).
Jesus prays to God, can God pray upon God? What is the point?

Thanks for reading.
kimmi

Pro

Jesus is the recarnation of god himnself in the bible it said the god sent his only begotin son that who so ever that beleive in him shall not parish but have ever lasting life thourgh him
Debate Round No. 1
tahir.imanov

Con

My opponent made very short statement, did not show any fact or proof to support that statement and has tons of spelling mistakes. But, however I am going to examine the statement.

Jesus is the recarnation of god himnself in the bible it said the god sent his only begotin son that who so ever that beleive in him shall not parish but have ever lasting life thourgh him.
(Actually it should be : Jesus is the reincarnation of The God Himself. In the Bible, it said The God sent his only begotten son and whoever believes in him shall not parish, but have everlasting life through him.)

1. Reincarnation
2. In the Bible it said
3. Begotten
4. Who so ever that beleive in him shall not parish(Salvation)

First of all, nowhere in the Bible you can find the word reincarnation.And nowhere it says Jesus is the reincarnation of God. The idea of reincarnation is Hindu-Buddist idea, and it has nothing to do with Judaism or Christianity.

Secondly, you are saying that everything Bible says is true, then it cannot have any internal or external contradictions. So, let's examine Bible,
Internal Contradictions
(a)MAT 1:16 - And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.
LUK 3:23 - And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli.
(b)MAT 27:5 - So Judas threw the money into the temple and left. Then he went away and hanged himself.
ACT 1:18 - With the reward he got for his wickedness, Judas bought a field; there he fell headlong, his body burst open and all his intestines spilled out...
(c)MAT 28:1 - In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.
MAR 16:1 - And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him.
JOH 20:1 - The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.
(d)JOH 10:30 I and my Father are one.
JOH 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
External Contradictions
(a)1KINGS 7:23 -Then he made the molten sea; it was round, ten cubits from brim to brim, and five cubits high. A line of thirty cubits would encircle it completely.
Now you are telling me The God, Who created the universe does not know how to calculate the circumference of circle. C=2πr andπ (pi) is definitly not equal to 3.
(b)According to Genesis, Earth was created before Sun. Which is totally discrimination against Sun. And how you can have day and night without Sun.
(c) According to Genesis Light created on very first day, even before the Source of Light was created.
(d) According to Genesis Vegetation was created before Sun.
(e) According to Genesis Universe was created in six days. If day means long-period of time then how vegetations survived without Sun. Clearly Universe was not created in 6 24-hour days.
(f)PSA 78:69 -The earth will abide forever.The Sun has expiration date, and without Sun, Earth will be no more.

Third point, begotten, you are reffering to 1 John 4:9. Actually in original scripts there is no 'begotten' is used. Latest Bibles corrected it.
It says :God's love was revealed among us in this way: God sent his only Son into the world so that we might live through him.
If you digg into the original scripts you wouldn't find the word "only" also.

Fourth and the last point, Salvation. Jesus himself said that if you want a salvation just obey the law (commandments) and say :
Sh'ma Yisrael Adonai Eloheinu Adonai Ehad - Hear, O Israel: the Lord is our God, the Lord is One, not three or three in One.
And Jesus is also said if you sin, just repent, seek forgiveness.

Conclusion, from very simple and short statement I made four points and answered to these points. I hope next argument of my opponent will have some reasoning.

Thank you for reading.
kimmi

Pro

WELL you are saying that you don't believe that god sent his only son into our world to be the one who died for us so that we could have a place in haven to live among the rest of the angels and be one our self and have the peace and joy where the is no more death and pain but you are saying is that god made him self into a younger and more perfect person to be born among human and live an imperfect life so that he can die on a cross for us so that we can have ever lasting life because of salvation that is why there is a god and Jesus
Debate Round No. 2
tahir.imanov

Con

First of all, there is difference between "believe" and "know". You can check Merriam-Webster. I know facts. If fact opposes to belief then belief is wrong. If there is no fact that supports the statement "god sent his only son into our world to be the one who died for us so that we could have a place in haven to live among the rest of the angels and be one our self and have the peace and joy where the is no more death and pain" then this statement is not true, because there are facts that say this statement is false. Read my previous arguments.

The second part of your statement is "you are saying is that god made him self into a younger and more perfect person to be born among human and live an imperfect life so that he can die on a cross for us so that we can have ever lasting life because of salvation that is why there is a god and Jesus". Ok, I never said that, do not put words in my mouth. What I said if there is no fact to support your belief and there tons of facts opposes your belief, then you believe in wrong things.

What I say - God is God and Jesus is Jesus, just a man.

I believe in, What I know.

If you want to prove your point, please bring some evidence.

Thank you for reading.
kimmi

Pro

god is real and Jesus is gods son and the proof is in the bible so look it up I am right not u
Debate Round No. 3
tahir.imanov

Con

You say proof in the Bible, it means whatever Bible says is true. Please provide fact or facts to support this statement.

If Bible is All-True, thent it cannot have internal and external contradictions. But it has, please read my Round 2 argument. And if you read my Round 1 argument, you will see why Jesus is not God, or Son of God, literally.

Son of God used many time in Old Testament. The prophets are sons of God, Jews are sons of God, Angels are sons of God. It is methaphore. And all Jews agree that, it is methaphore.

Thank you for reading.
kimmi

Pro

god had sent Jesus and told him that she is to have jesus and there is nothing wrong with that
Debate Round No. 4
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by tahir.imanov 3 years ago
tahir.imanov
1+1+1=1 is a mathematical miracle
Posted by Artur 3 years ago
Artur
jesus is god, father is god, ghost is god, and they three form one god means 1+1+1=1

a god means one god, when we describe them we count three gods anyway they form one. 1+1+1 doesnot make one, it makes FUN
Posted by tahir.imanov 3 years ago
tahir.imanov
Well, you do not have any fact to support the assertion.
Posted by Gwydion777 3 years ago
Gwydion777
Jesus is fully God and fully human. 2 natures in one being. He became flesh and lived for awhile among us.
Posted by KernGordon 3 years ago
KernGordon
Jesus is the son of god not god
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by sweetbreeze 3 years ago
sweetbreeze
tahir.imanovkimmiTied
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Total points awarded:60 
Reasons for voting decision: S/G to Con, because Pro didn't capitalize or put a full stop most of the time. Convincing arguments to Con, because he actually argued, while Pro just stated what he believed. Sources go to Con. He used evidence from the Bible.
Vote Placed by Leonardo 3 years ago
Leonardo
tahir.imanovkimmiTied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: Con had good conduct, almost perfect spelling and grammar, better and precise arguments; using sources from the Bible.