Is Jesus God ?
Debate Rounds (4)
I believe that this belief is a cornerstone in Christianity , so he must be explicit and claim to be God clearly , although , Jesus said that the one who sent him is greater than him(1)..
(1):"You heard me say, 'I am going away and I am coming back to you.' If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I."
John , chapter 14 , verse 28
To me that is pretty much clear.
Before we get angry, I am a man of faith and I hope we both show our opinions in a civil manner.
Looking forward to your response.
First of all I want to tell you that am not trying to offend anybody by posting this debate , we are just seeking the truth , and nothing but the truth am not Christian and I think that it's obvious, but I read the Bible , and one of my favorite verses is "Come now, and let us reason together" Isaiah 1:18 ..
Moreover I read the verse you quoted David , and I don't see that it's an evidence of Jesus' divinity , I asked you to give me a verse where Jesus ask people 'To worship him ' or where he claim being God clearly ,and I don't think that the verse you quoted goes with what I asked .As I told you Jesus divinity is a cornerstone in the Christian faith , it must be pointed out clearly , and not using a metaphorical expression that can be misunderstood . Actually I think that you misunderstood this verse too Mr David , because , if seeing Jesus is considered as seeing God , then , slapping Jesus and spitting in his face (1) is considered as slapping and spitting on God ! Creator of the heavens and earth don't you think that it's a blasphemy to God?
Added to that , I don't think that we can understand the verse you quoted correctly, without reading from the beginning, "I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you to myself",the place that he mentioned is the kingdom. Thomas misunderstood him and said, "Lord, we do not know where you are going. How can we know the way?" (John 14:5).
He thought that the Christ spoke about a real road... Correcting him and explaining that it is a spiritual path, Jesus said "I am the way, the truth, and the life",this is how I understand the Christ claiming that seeing him is seeing the God
, as who ever witnessed Jesus miracles , he had actually witnessed God"s deeds!!These are not my words brother , these are Jesus' words "By myself I can do nothing; I judge only as I hear, and my judgment is just, for I seek not to please myself but him who sent me."(John chapter 5 verse 30 )
Looking forward to your response.
In Genesis 1:26 God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."
please notice that he said "Let US" I personally believe that "us" is God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.
Also I'm sure you know this. John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
And I also have faith in him as God, because I have personally seen people healed in the name of Jesus.
Matt. 4:7; Luke 4:12 - Jesus tells Satan, "you shall not tempt the Lord your God" in reference to Himself.
Luke 19:38,40 - Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord. If these were silent, the very stones would cry out.
Revelation 22:13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last."
John 10:30 "I and My Father are one."
I pray this is what you have been looking for.
Jesus and the Father ,they are two, for Jesus said they are two witnesses (John 8:14-18),they can't be one as one is greater than the other (John 14:28).
Added to that when Jesus prayed to be saved from the cross, he said: "Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done." (Luke 22:42).This shows that they had two separate wills, although Jesus submitted his will to the will of the Father. Two wills mean two separate individuals,but due to the submission of Son of Mary , they shared the same purpose .Furthermore, Jesus is reported to have said: "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" (Matthew 27:46). If one of them forsook the other, then they must be two separate entities.
Furthermore , I think that you posted a verse from the Book of Revelation, which is an unreliable book since early Christians and elders of the Church - Marcion, Caius of Rome, Dionysius of Alexandria, Amphilocius of Iconium, Gregory of Nazianzus, Cyril of Jerusalem, Synod of Laodicea in 360 CE - disputed it.(1)
I think you noticed my brother that the verses you quoted , are not as explicit as the simple sentence 'I am God ' ,which can not be understood differently ..
(1) Bible Research, an internet resource by Michael D. Marlowe. (http://www.bible-researcher.com...)
david_gregg forfeited this round.
No votes have been placed for this debate.
You are not eligible to vote on this debate
This debate has been configured to only allow voters who meet the requirements set by the debaters. This debate either has an Elo score requirement or is to be voted on by a select panel of judges.