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Is Jesus really a God?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/1/2014 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 536 times Debate No: 48105
Debate Rounds (4)
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Hello this is a debate on whether Jesus claimed to be divine or is divine as the Christian say and this is how it goes(I am new to this :

1st round is for acceptance
2nd is for Argument
3rd is for rebuttal/Argument
4nd is for ending statement/rebuttal


okay so umm when the debate start
Debate Round No. 1


My main point is 'Did Jesus claim divinity', I have studied the Bible but I see in the Bible that Jesus as Christian claim that he is God or Son of God, in many accounts in the Bible it shows that God had many other sons other than Jesus(Romans 8:14 Luke 3:38
Genesis 6:2) and it shows that Jesus is ignorant about things(Matthew 24:36 Mark 13:32)
Jesus is the son of man, the OT tells us not to trust the son of man The New Testament makes it very clear that Jesus is the son of man(Matthew 8:20 Matthew 9:6
Matthew 12:8 Luke 9:44 Luke 9:22 John 5:27)
The Old Testament tells us not to put our trust in the son of man:
Psalms 146
1 Praise ye the LORD. Praise the LORD, O my soul.
2 While I live will I praise the LORD: I will sing praises unto my God while I have any being.
3 Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.
So note, Jesus is the son of man, the OT tells us not to put our trust in the son of man; therefore we cannot place our trust in Jesus so he cannot be God. The OT is basically saying that you shouldn"t put your trust in men as you do with God, so hence we cannot put our trust in Jesus in the same way we do with God since Jesus is just a man, and he cannot really save us. So hence Jesus cannot be God.
The OT also tells us that there is no help in the son of man, therefore this means Jesus cannot help anybody, therefore he is not God since God can help all. So we cannot place our trust in Jesus, nor can he help us, therefore he cannot be God according to the OT.

Jesus was GIVEN power and authority, he did not own it. As we all know, God is all-powerful and is independent, he needs no help from anybody. However so this is not the case with Jesus, unlike God, Jesus needs help from God, unlike God, Jesus does not own any power or any authority, rather it is given to him from God.
(John 13:3 John 17:6-8)
So as we can see, Jesus GIVEN everything he had! This all included miracle, doctrine etc. Basically Jesus did not do anything of his own, he never performed a miracle by his own power, he was given the miracle. He never taught anything of his own, rather he was taught by God and spoke what God told him to speak.
John 7:16 Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me
John 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.
John 8:26 I have many things to say and to judge of you: but he that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those things which I have heard of him.
John 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.
So everything Jesus had was from God, from the Gospel to his miracles. God needs no one to give him power, God needs no one to tell him what to do, therefore Jesus is not God.
I challenge any Christian to bring me one single miracle Jesus performed on his own, just one. The Christian will never be able to meet this challenge.

Jesus was sent to a specific nation only, not to mankind
Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
So as we see, Jesus was sent only for the lost sheep of Israel. His main duty was for them, not the gentiles or the world. Christians often like to say Jesus told his disciples to go preach to the gentiles, however so this doesn"t change anything. Jesus" real mission as we see was for the children of Israel, not the gentiles, the verse I posted cannot be refuted. The verse is very clear, Jesus is SENT for the lost sheep of Israel, not the Gentiles, Jesus saying go preach to Gentiles does not mean he was sent for gentiles.

Jesus denied being good in the sense that God is good.
If Jesus is God one would expect him to admit he is good in the sense that God is good, meaning perfect. However when we read the Bible we see that Jesus denies being good in the sense that God is good which is perfect. Here are the passages:
Mat 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? [there is] none good but one, [that is], God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

So note, the man calls Jesus good, Jesus tells the man there is non good but God. Obviously Jesus referred to God as someone else, which also proves Jesus isn"t God. However the main importance of the passages is that Jesus denies being Good in the way God is good, which is to be perfect.

Jesus could not save anyone
The Bible also claims that Jesus cannot save anyone! Here is the passage:
Hebrews 5:1-8: 1 For every high priest taken from among men is ordained for men in things pertaining to God, that he may offer both gifts and sacrifices for sins: 2 Who can have compassion on the ignorant, and on them that are out of the way; for that he himself also is compassed with infirmity. 3 And by reason hereof he ought, as for the people, so also for himself, to offer for sins. 4 And no man taketh this honour unto himself, but he that is called of God, as was Aaron. 5 So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee. 6 As he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec. 7 Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; 8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered

So Jesus cried to the one who could save him from death, this means Jesus could not save himself from death, therefore this also means Jesus cannot save anyone else from death. How can Jesus be God when he cannot save anyone? This also shows that Jesus is not in control of life and death, God however is in control of everything, including life and death:

And they have taken besides Him gods, who do not create anything while they are themselves created, and they control not for themselves any harm or profit, and they control not death nor life, nor raising (the dead) to life. S. 25:3 Shakir

I need evidence, clear evidence from the Bible for Jesus being divine.


droenik47 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2


The con forfeited, vote for the OWL!!


droenik47 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3




droenik47 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
8 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 8 records.
Posted by Sagey 2 years ago
Though in considering the Teachings of Jesus Christ, such as the Sermon On The Mount, much of what was said by Jesus could not be remembered accurately after 30 years, so a lot if it, if not the entire Sermon was likely made up by the Gospel writer, from bits he learned about from followers.
The words stated in the Sermon likely never came out of Jesus Christ's mouth.

Such is stories written down over 30 years after the event.
Ideas and ideals may remain fairly much the same: Oral Tradition.
Though, details would have been lost, the following day after the Sermon was presented: Oral History.

So the Gospels were Traditionally accurate, but completely Historically inaccurate.

The Gospels differ on nearly every aspect of Jesus's life, death and resurrection.
About the only thing the Gospels have in common is his name and means of death, though these were likely not from real experiences, but regurgitating the Legendary stories surrounding Jesus.
Posted by Sagey 2 years ago
I read the Qur'an when I was in my youth, but the attitudes towards non-believers within it made my stomach turn. Such a violent attitude towards infidels was totally unwarranted.
Though some more modern translations have removed much of the violence I read back in the 70s.
It's a bit like altering Muhammad's teachings to suit modernity.
Which I think of as being a bit deceitful.
Such as I read in the 70s a passage that stated that non-believers when captured or arrested are given 3 chances to state their belief in Allah.
Though I've forgotten some of the detail, since the modern version I have, no longer shows this passage.

After the first time they are introduced to Allah and they still disbelieve, they can have fingers removed,
After the second time and they still do not believe their eyes can be removed.
After the third chance, and they still do not accept Allah, their heads can be removed.

So basically it is believe in Allah or Die!

That was my understanding of the Qur'an I read in the 70s.
The modern variations have had many such passages removed or softened.

That is just like altering the Bible to suite popular modern ideas.

It makes me wonder if Muhammad really actually taught any of what was in the Qur'an and it was made up later by the Caliphs, if they can alter the teachings of Muhammad so easily.

I'm certain many Christians would like to rewrite the Bible to be more sensible and change some of the teachings of Jesus to make them more rational in the modern rational world.
Though that would be being entirely deceitful and dishonest..

And people often wonder why I consider Islam as a deceitful and dishonest belief system.
Now you know why???
Posted by Valtin 2 years ago
I am already in league. @Piratebats
Posted by piratebats 2 years ago
back to league
Posted by Sagey 2 years ago
In that case you are right, though in the Bible, Jesus did not claim to be God.
Those claims were made much later, after his death.
Posted by Valtin 2 years ago
Well to Christians you need to prove that Jesus is not God from the Bible it self, because outside the Bible they won't believe like the Qur'an which refutes or disbelieves on what the Church says today.(Not the Bible.)
Posted by Sagey 2 years ago
I prefer to find evidence outside of contrived texts like the Bible.
There was no evidence outside the Bible for Jesus's divinity.
Besides, as Lazarus77 cited, He ate food, now what kind of god needs to eat food to survive????
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by Sagey 2 years ago
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Total points awarded:50 
Reasons for voting decision: Con presented a quite well presented argument, Pro appears to have either been scared off by such arguments or gave up for some other reason???? Maybe Pro just wanted debates notched up without actually debating. Hmmm??????
Vote Placed by Zarroette 2 years ago
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Total points awarded:40 
Reasons for voting decision: Con's argument went uncontested. Conduct to Con for Pro's forfeits.