The Instigator
Cmb
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Radicalguy44
Pro (for)
Winning
13 Points

Is Suicide A Negative Action?

Do you like this debate?NoYes+1
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Vote Here
Con Tied Pro
Who did you agree with before the debate?
Who did you agree with after the debate?
Who had better conduct?
Who had better spelling and grammar?
Who made more convincing arguments?
Who used the most reliable sources?
Reasons for your voting decision
1,000 Characters Remaining
The voting period for this debate does not end.
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/5/2010 Category: Society
Updated: 7 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 1,016 times Debate No: 11646
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (2)
Votes (2)

 

Cmb

Con

I'm [very] knew to this, but I'll try my best to make this a good debate.

I'm taking the side of con/against on this.

1-Suicide hasn't always been thought of as a negative act. In fact, it was seen as honorable in some cases, like when people dishonored their families or even now, suicide bombers who do it for a cause. Obviously killing other people in the process is a negative thing, but just the act of taking their own life isn't necessarily a bad thing.

2-It doesn't hurt anyone else. It's all about the person making a choice for themself, the same as someone making the choice of a certain career, or live in a certain city. Some other people may be hurt emotionally, but overall, it doesn't hurt the rights of anyone else, or -usually- physically harm anyone else, although I gave the example of a suicide bomber above. That's a rare case, and so speaking on an overall basis, someone commiting suicide doesn't hurt anyone else.

3-It might even be a beneficial thing. One less person for society to support, and if the person is thinking about killing themself, or not really wanting to live then there's a good chance they won't be a truly productive member of society. So all in all, it could even benefit rather than hurt things in the long run.

That's all the arguements i have for my side for now. I'll let my opponent have a turn. Good luck and all.
Radicalguy44

Pro

Hello! I am Radicalguy44 and I will be affirming the resolution. Good luck Con!

Resolved: Suicide is a negative Action
As my opponent has not specified what type of debate he wants this to be, I'll just do a free for all

I will start by attacking my opponent's case, and then posting my own

1) "-Suicide hasn't always been thought of as a negative act. In fact, it was seen as honorable in some cases, like when people dishonored their families or even now, suicide bombers who do it for a cause. Obviously killing other people in the process is a negative thing, but just the act of taking their own life isn't necessarily a bad thin"

Just because it's not thought of as a negative act, does not mean that it is not a negative act. For example, people seemed to think slavery was correct, and yet that didn't make it correct at all. Taking away someone's life, that may have a potential in society is incorrect, and can harm the USA, since this person could've down a great breakthrough.

2) "It doesn't hurt anyone else. It's all about the person making a choice for themself, the same as someone making the choice of a certain career, or live in a certain city. Some other people may be hurt emotionally, but overall, it doesn't hurt the rights of anyone else, or -usually- physically harm anyone else, although I gave the example of a suicide bomber above. That's a rare case, and so speaking on an overall basis, someone commiting suicide doesn't hurt anyone else."

My opponent stated that it doesn't hurt anyone else. What about the relatives of the person who suicided himself? He said it doesn't hurt ANYONE, and his/her family make up that somebody. He himself agreed that emotionally some people are hurt as well.

3) "-It might even be a beneficial thing. One less person for society to support, and if the person is thinking about killing themself, or not really wanting to live then there's a good chance they won't be a truly productive member of society. So all in all, it could even benefit rather than hurt things in the long run."

There's a good chance that this person may have not double thought about his action. Just because you make a mistake doesn't mean you won't be productive. Unfortunately, this mistake caused the person his/her life.

My opponent said that it's beneficial. What if that person owed money? What if that person was a scientist, and he was about to make a breakthrough. He can not safely say that it is a beneficial thing, since this mistake is not beneficial.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I will now state my case

CONTENTION 1: The right to live is the biggest right of all. My opponent said that it doesn't harm anyone's rights. What about their own rights? We all have the right to live!

CONTENTION 2: The potential good of the person is still there, but because of a mistake, the potential dies. We don't want this happening

CONTENTION 3: People look up to other people. If there is a dad who suicided himself, then the younger child looks up to the father, and thinks about doing the same to himself, since after all, his dad is the superhero. It harms others as well, since suicide causes depression and causes people to suicide themselves

As you can see, suicide is never an alternative, and it is never good.
~Radicalguy44
Debate Round No. 1
Cmb

Con

*What I meant was new to this, not knew to this, obviously. Sorry for that. Also, just to clarify, i'm a she. And I'm not promoting suicide, or saying it's a positive thing, but I thought this would make an interesting debate in itself.
Thank you very much for taking up my debate.

1-"Just because it's not thought of as a negative act, does not mean that it is not a negative act. For example, people seemed to think slavery was correct, and yet that didn't make it correct at all. Taking away someone's life, that may have a potential in society is incorrect, and can harm the USA, since this person could've down a great breakthrough."

Though true that not everything that people have thought about positively at one time has been a positive thing, as you mentioned slavery, that's doing harm to another person. What I'm talking about is an act to yourself. Obviously suicide is thought of negatively now, but this is because of the spread of Christianity. Whether you're a Christian or not, the teachings have influenced how most people think of certain issues. "Views on suicide have been influenced by broader cultural views on existential themes such as religion, honor, and the meaning of life. The Abrahamic religions consider suicide an offense towards God due to religious belief in the sanctity of life. In the West it was often regarded as a serious crime. Conversely, during the samurai era in Japan, seppuku was respected as a means of atonement for failure or as a form of protest." ("Suicide." Wikipedia. 6 Apr. 2010. Web. 6 Apr. 2010. .) Though thought of as a negative thing because of certain religions and in the eyes of society, there are just as good reasons that it is not a negative act.

2-"My opponent stated that it doesn't hurt anyone else. What about the relatives of the person who suicided himself? He said it doesn't hurt ANYONE, and his/her family make up that somebody. He himself agreed that emotionally some people are hurt as well."

I was talking more along the lines of it doesn't hurt the rights of anyone else. More than anything, making suicide illegal is violating the rights of the people who choose to attempt suicide. They have the right to life, but they should equally have a right to death. Think about the people with terminal illness who will be in horrid pain for, an example, six months until they die who would rather simply skip all the pain. Yes, the family/friends will be emotionally affected and hurt, but there are many things in life that emotionally hurt people, including death, and it's something that everyone must deal with no matter how it comes to be.

3-"There's a good chance that this person may have not double thought about his action. Just because you make a mistake doesn't mean you won't be productive. Unfortunately, this mistake caused the person his/her life.
My opponent said that it's beneficial. What if that person owed money? What if that person was a scientist, and he was about to make a breakthrough. He can not safely say that it is a beneficial thing, since this mistake is not beneficial."

People who only wish to die, or who think they would be better off not living are most likely not going to make any great strides in fields of science or technology or anything of the sort since in their mind anything they do would seem pointless. Also, there is a very good chance that the person who commits suicide has a mental illness. Often this can even be the cause of the suicide. "A classic study of suicide in adults reported that over 90 percent of individuals who committed suicide had a diagnosable psychiatric illness at the time of their death." (Fawcett, Jan. "Suicidal Feelings." Dana. Mar. 2007. Web. 6 Apr. 2010. .) People with a mental illness, no matter the severity of the illness, will usually not be efficient in their lives, socially or professionally, and can be a burden to those family members or friends that must deal with them. Though they emotionally will be affected by the act itself, no longer will there be an extra burden on them, and probably will end up relieving a great amount of stress. Stress has been shown to cause death in many people, as well as non fatal problems like headaches and ulcers. Then, the people who are being treated for their mental illness, that includes cost of medication and physicians and/or therapy, and often times it takes a while to find the right kind of medication. Had they commited suicide it would save them/the family these costs as well as the stress of dealing with the person until some form of treatment was found. Assuming that everyone will look up to their parents is a very general assumption to make. Because a person's father walks out of their life doesn't mean they'll walk out of their child's life one day. In fact it sometimes motivates them to be a very great parent one day. So because their father kills himself, it doesn't mean the child will kill themself.

Suicide is not a negative, and in some cases, can even be beneficial to the person's family or society in general.
Radicalguy44

Pro

I am sorry for the confusion of gender. Thanks for responding to the debate!

I'll start by saying that the debate focuses mainly on whether suicide is negative. Since my opponent has not defined how negative is defined as, I will just assume that she means negative, as in not good impact on society. Not just society, but the whole world.

I'll start by attacking my opponent's case.

1) "Though true that not everything that people have thought about positively at one time has been a positive thing, as you mentioned slavery, that's doing harm to another person. What I'm talking about is an act to yourself. Obviously suicide is thought of negatively now, but this is because of the spread of Christianity. Whether you're a Christian or not, the teachings have influenced how most people think of certain issues. "Views on suicide have been influenced by broader cultural views on existential themes such as religion, honor, and the meaning of life. The Abrahamic religions consider suicide an offense towards God due to religious belief in the sanctity of life. In the West it was often regarded as a serious crime. Conversely, during the samurai era in Japan, seppuku was respected as a means of atonement for failure or as a form of protest." ("Suicide." Wikipedia. 6 Apr. 2010. Web. 6 Apr. 2010. .) Though thought of as a negative thing because of certain religions and in the eyes of society, there are just as good reasons that it is not a negative act."

She attacks my slavery simile, by saying that slavery harmed other people. Slavery harmed in emotional ways their families, just like suicide does the same. If my opponent agrees that slavery is harmful because of emotional reasons, then she too agrees suicide is not a positive action.

Another quick tip. Wikipedia is not a reliable source, and should not be the turning point of this debate. I also don't see how her argument helps her. She's saying that religions consider it negative, by that she is agreeing with what I am saying!

2) "I was talking more along the lines of it doesn't hurt the rights of anyone else. More than anything, making suicide illegal is violating the rights of the people who choose to attempt suicide. They have the right to life, but they should equally have a right to death. "

How about the times when suicides are provoked because of something that happened. For example, the girl that was on my space, and received a hoax. Her rights were violated, and that led to suicide. http://www.foxnews.com...

Or also, as my opponent said "Suicide bombers" kill other people around them. Whilst that may be suicide, they are ruining others' right to life. She brought up suicide bombers, a point that doesn't really help her.

3) "People who only wish to die, or who think they would be better off not living are most likely not going to make any great strides in fields of science or technology or anything of the sort since in their mind anything they do would seem pointless. Also, there is a very good chance that the person who commits suicide has a mental illness. Often this can even be the cause of the suicide"

There are such things as by products, where you're trying to find something out, and something else appears. This could happen with anyone, not just people who aren't thinking about suicidal. They may be thinking about it, but help can come, which can help them become better people

----------------------------------------------
She did not touch my case, which therefore leaves a hole in the flow, and those points, should according to debate rules, got to the PRO

Great debate, and good luck in round 3 con!
~Radicalguy44
Debate Round No. 2
Cmb

Con

Cmb forfeited this round.
Radicalguy44

Pro

MY opponent has failed to rebut my case, and has not presented any voters as to why she should win. I have presented my case, and attacked hers successfully, since my attacks went through.

I believe that Suicide is negative to the person, and to the families. I ask you to vote PRO in this debate
Please vote PRO / AFF!

~Radicalguy44
Debate Round No. 3
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by Antonio12 7 years ago
Antonio12
What about rights to bodily autonomy? Forcing a person to live a life that they do not want to live, is taking away the rights for a person to govern their own body. While suicide may be unethical, so is forcing a person to live.

I am confused with the claim presented. Are you suggesting that suicide is ethical, or are you suggesting that it doesn't have any negative consequences?

Killing in some instances can be justified, for example, in self-defense, war, etc. Killing yourself is questionable. Obviously there are negative consequences that result from suicide, especially in regards to the pain and/or suffering this creates for loved ones, family, and friends.

If Con can prove that there are more positive benefits that can result from a suicide than negative consequences, then suicide in some situations can be justified.

Martyrs and suicide bombers give their lives for their nations. Some of the positive benefits that are created from their deaths can outweigh any of the negative consequences experienced by their families.

therefore the aff should win
Posted by dollydo 7 years ago
dollydo
What about rights to bodily autonomy? Forcing a person to live a life that they do not want to live, is taking away the rights for a person to govern their own body. While suicide may be unethical, so is forcing a person to live.

I am confused with the claim presented. Are you suggesting that suicide is ethical, or are you suggesting that it doesn't have any negative consequences?

Killing in some instances can be justified, for example, in self-defense, war, etc. Killing yourself is questionable. Obviously there are negative consequences that result from suicide, especially in regards to the pain and/or suffering this creates for loved ones, family, and friends.

If Con can prove that there are more positive benefits that can result from a suicide than negative consequences, then suicide in some situations can be justified.

Martyrs and suicide bombers give their lives for their nations. Some of the positive benefits that are created from their deaths can outweigh any of the negative consequences experienced by their families.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by Antonio12 7 years ago
Antonio12
CmbRadicalguy44Tied
Agreed with before the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:06 
Vote Placed by Radicalguy44 7 years ago
Radicalguy44
CmbRadicalguy44Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:07