The Instigator
Montague_Smith
Pro (for)
The Contender
lua
Con (against)

Is Thomas the tank engine the best kids show of the 80-90s?

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Debate Round Forfeited
Montague_Smith has forfeited round #4.
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/22/2017 Category: Entertainment
Updated: 12 months ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 410 times Debate No: 99205
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (2)
Votes (0)

 

Montague_Smith

Pro

I believe that Thomas the tank engine is that best 80s-90s kids show to be created.
I'm willing for any format but I think that the first round for format, three arguements and a conclusion.
lua

Con

How can someone claim that a show -- a very stereotyped and extremely predictable show -- like Thomas the Tank Engine & Friends be the best kids show from the 80-90s? I was watching an episode called 'Wonky Whistle' last week with my cousin, and I was stunned how this show was a long-running series. The show is so dangerous, so second-rate, so patronizing and insulting.

Dangerous
Thomas shoots out steam while there are people on him, thus pushing them off in the process risking their death, disregarding safety and patience in the process which is a horrible and dangerous lesson to teach younger viewers.

Second-rate
The show is incredibly formulaic and predictable, the formula of the show is known as The Three Strikes Formula, which is very restricting. Exposition dumps from the narrator, my cousin said "can we watch spider-man instead?" when I asked why, he said: "the guy talks too slow and it's boring," referencing to the narrator and the show not being able to please the audience it panders to.

Patronizing and Insulting
Thomas has a broken whistle, the protocol is to stop working, though he didn't, ignoring the rules of railway safety. Also, a broken whistle would leak steam and whistle constantly rather than just be blown with a 'wonky' sound, disregarding how physics/trains work so they can spend less time on their script and force out an episode.
Debate Round No. 1
Montague_Smith

Pro

Alrightly then. Some explaining needs to be done.

First, you say you watched an episode called 'Wonky Whistle' but I feel you are mistaking on the debate at hand. I said Thomas the tank engine is the best show of the 80s-90s NOT present day and Wonky Whistle came out as the seventeenth episode of season fifteen in 2011! So this episode is irrelevant to the debate as the the last season in the nighties was season five.

The first four seasons are all based on the Railway Series by the Rev. W Awdry which were all different and clever in their story telling such as new twists and turns and episodes that ran chronologically. When season five came about, Britt Alcroft (the director) made it her duty to keep the stories as close to the books as possible (as there were no more books to base the show on) to focus more on script and visuals, never using the Three Stikes Froumla and to keep a show about talking trains as realistic as possible.

Also, I highly doubt you can find me a statistics chart that states more people died of smoke inhalation from trains as a result of watching Thomas the tank engine.

By the way, going back to Wonky Whistle, you picked the one episode all Thomas fans hate. So you picked the equivalent of stealing from a baby. And also, the narrators from Seasons 1-5 aren't boring as they barely talk throughout the episode to focus more on visuals and the characters.
Now that my rebuttal is done, I now will move on to my first argument.

Compared to other shows of the 80s-90s, it's clear that this show lasted as a timeless show that still shines a spark in people's hearts. When put against other TV shows such as TMNT or X-Men or Doug, this show does not patronise or insult the audience as it doesn't pander to kids and treats them like adults.

Also just saying, as we didn't discuss a format, I'm saying that in the last round we both do conclusions and no arguements except me who has to rebut for your last argument.
lua

Con

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to watch the episode that everybody hates, I watched the episode that was on at the time

"Compared to other shows of the 80s-90s, it's clear that this show lasted as a timeless show that still shines a spark in people's hearts."

This is pure speculation. If you're going to say something and back it up with no evidence, at least look up a poll or list that shows what the people you are talking about actually like. When you look at the list called The Best Cartoons of All Time [1] based on the votes of thousands, Thomas the Tank Engine & Friends is at #197 and when you look at a show like Batman: The Animated Series -- a series still beloved to this day -- it's at #7.

1.) http://www.ranker.com...
Debate Round No. 2
Montague_Smith

Pro

Before I start, the only part of my argument you bought up was one line. That's not rebutting that's nitpicking.

And yeah and you chose ONE list with only thousands of people being surveyed. That number means nothing when compared to the billions of people who are on the earth right now. I would be contradicting my earlier comment but when that is the only thing you bring up, I've rebutted your whole arguement.

The reason why my arguments are taking so long is because I've been conducting my own survey in the city of Melbourne to find out how many 20-40 years olds (the target audience for the show at the time) have been influenced by the show.
I've done the maths and 76% of people said either the show was educational or 'shines a spark in their hearts'. That's why I used that stamens before. Not speculation, the truth.

Also, if he wasn't influential, how did this train get on The Independant Sunday's Top 100 most influential Britians of 2009 and was placed alongside Quintin Blake and Terry Prachett?
Easy, look above.
lua

Con

"Before I start, the only part of my argument you bought up was one line. That's not rebutting that's nitpicking."

I did not nitpick your "arguments," that was the only argument I responded to because that was the only thing you said that resembled an argument.

"And yeah and you chose ONE list with only thousands of people being surveyed."

Then what's the point of any poll? That statement is absolutely ridiculous.

But let's go by your logic, since a couple hundred voters aren't good enough for you, let's look on IMDb:

Thomas the Tank Engine has a 6.8 on IMDb [1] based on over 2.2k voters, that is not good. Thomas the Tank Engine doesn't have any awards from mainstream awards shows, though it does have one Women's International Film & Television Showcase award... [2]

Batman: The Animated Series has 9.0 on IMDb [3] based on 56k voters, that is very good making it the #27 highest rated show of all time, and winner of a Primetime Emmy and three Daytime Emmys. [4]

"That number means nothing when compared to the billions of people who are on the earth right now."

By that statement, you're implying that billions of people have seen Thomas the Tank Engine. Another absolutely ridiculous statement.

"The reason why my arguments are taking so long is because I've been conducting my own survey in the city of Melbourne to find out how many 20-40 years olds (the target audience for the show at the time) have been influenced by the show. I've done the maths and 76% of people said either the show was educational or 'shines a spark in their hearts'. That's why I used that stamens before. Not speculation, the truth."

If you're going to say that a real poll online with over thousands of voters isn't enough for you, then how is asking a couple people on the street if a show about trains that explains how they work is "educational" for you? I just love how you snuck in "educational," it seems like you're trying to deceive me -- asking if a show about trains is educational for you, please! Plus, your argument could be totally falsified, I have no reason to trust that you actually did that. That's like me saying that I asked a couple dozen people on the streets about Batman: The Animated Series, and say that 80% of the people say they think Batman: The Animated Series was amazing and the best kids show of the 80-90s, I'm sorry, but you can't use an inadmissible argument in an official debate.

"Also, if he wasn't influential, how did this train get on The Independant Sunday's Top 100 most influential Britians of 2009 and was placed alongside Quintin Blake and Terry Prachett?"

It isn't on "The Independant Sunday's Top 100 most influential Britians of 2009, " it's on "The {i}IoS{/i} Happy List 2009 - the 100," [5] Sharon Thiruchelvam -- the person that wrote it -- didn't even put enough time into the insubstantive article to fix the bbcode. But yes, you are right Thomas the Tank Engine is on there... right below cycling track coaches, tutors, and nurses.

1.) http://www.imdb.com...
2.) http://www.imdb.com...
3.) http://www.imdb.com...;
4.) http://www.imdb.com...
5.) http://www.independent.co.uk...
Debate Round No. 3
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Debate Round No. 4
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by Montague_Smith 12 months ago
Montague_Smith
Sorry. I had a suprise birthday. I couldn't. But you have much better arguements so I say you definitely win.
Posted by lua 12 months ago
lua
Darn it, why did you forfeit? :(
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