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Is islam the TRUE FAITH / do they believe in the right JESUS CHRIST?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/22/2015 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,094 times Debate No: 78009
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (67)
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If muslims believe in the same Jesus Christ then explain why the following is missing in their faith that the (TRUE) Christians believe and show:

1. Speaking in tongues (non-language formatted, sounds of actual gibberish at times, and other times speaking a specific unknown language later to be identified what type.) today upon having the presence of GOD.

2. Healing the sick, removing a disease from a person (example, someone having lyme disease in its final stages walking around with a metal walking stool everywhere due to the disease's affect yet over time from prayer being completely healed and able to run around without the metal walking stool), healing the wounded (example, someone falling off a horse leaving a knot in the person's shoulder that would have required medical attention and surgery to be fixed, but later only received prayer with laying of hands and the knot was reduced and removed), removing cancers, removing tumors (example, someone had a generational curse from south africa who's mother was a prostitute as a result she had tumors from head to foot, and upon healing had to hold up the sweat pants from how many tumors were removed from her the same night losing over 30+ pounds just like that) and other like-wise manners as described from being prayed for with laying of hands and similiar methods.

3. Casting out spirits and demons from individuals who are required to be called off by specific names that only JESUS CHRIST can provide the name.

These are just a couple of my questions of how the Muslim faith is the true faith.

Different testimonials can be found from an independent religious healing faith ministry called:

Just listen to some of their video testimonials, and sermons that you will hear being talked in about.

Tell me your faith offers the same and likewise manners and I might consider your faith to be the true faith...

But until I can see such similiar actions, I question your faith being the TRUE FAITH.

Would you be willing to prove me wrong and explain why in full detail?

So your faith has doctors that have made scientific medical break-through, okay and this proves that they listensand follows GOD by making it so that man can try to heal themselves and that brings man closer to GOD by not relying on HIM?


In the name of Allah, the Most Compassionate the Most Merciful.
I willingly accept your debate and wish you luck. May Allah help you to see the truth of Jesus and Islam.

First of all, I must mention something. You said, "I might consider your faith to be the true faith." I can understand from your statement that you have considered your faith to be true and now, you want to know if my faith is true. Am I right? Have you questioned your faith before questioning mine? Are you sure your own faith is true? And whose faith is false if my faith is not exactly the same as yours?
In this debate, I don't want to just talk about what I, as a Muslim, believe regarding Jesus. I want to compare my faith to your own faith, so we can figure out whose faith is the TRUE FAITH.

Ok. Muslims respect and venerate Jesus Christ. They consider him to be one of Allah's greatest messengers to mankind. The Quran re-affirms his miraculous birth and his miraculous abilities. Furthermore, his mother Mary is regarded as one of the most pure and exalted women of all creation. But, the Jesus whom I believe is not the same Jesus you believe. There are some similarities and differences between the" Muslim Jesus and the Christian Jesus.

- The Similarities:

1. Islam agrees with Christianity about the holiness of Jesus. We, as Muslims, believe that Jesus was pure and he never committed sin:
"And mention when the angels said, 'O Mary, indeed Allah gives you good tidings of a word from Him, whose name will be the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary - distinguished in this world and the Hereafter and among those brought near to Allah." (the Quran 3:45)

2. Islam agrees with Christianity about the holiness of Mary, the mother of Jesus. All Muslims believe in her purity and holiness and she was one of the most noble women in all nations:"
"And mention when the angels said, 'O Mary, indeed Allah has chosen you and purified you and chosen you above the women of the worlds." (3:42)

"And Allah presents an example of those who believed... the example of Mary, the daughter of 'Imran, who guarded her chastity, so We blew into her garment through Our angel, and she believed in the words of her Lord and His scriptures and was of the devoutly obedient." (66:11-12)

3. Islam also agrees that Jesus was miraculously born from a virgin mother with no father:

"And mention, O Muhammad, in the Book the story of Mary, when she withdrew from her family to a place toward the east. And she took, in seclusion from them, a veil." Then We sent to her Our Angel, and he represented himself to her as a well-proportioned man. She said, 'Indeed, I seek refuge in the Most Merciful from you, so leave me, if you should be fearing of Allah.' He said, 'I am only the messenger of your Lord to give you news of a pure son.' She said, 'How can I have a son while no man has touched me and I have not been unchaste?' He said, 'Thus it will be; your Lord says, 'It is easy for Me," and We will make him a sign to the people and a mercy from Us. And it is a" matter already decreed.'" So she conceived him, and she withdrew with him to a remote place. And the pains of childbirth drove her to the trunk of a palm" tree. She said, 'Oh, I wish I had died before this and was in oblivion, forgotten.' But he called her from below her, 'Do not grieve; your Lord has provided beneath you a stream. And shake toward you the trunk of the palm tree; it will drop upon you ripe, fresh dates. So eat and drink and be contented. And if you see anyone, say, 'Indeed, I have vowed to the Most Merciful abstention, so I will not speak today to any man.'" (Quran 19:16-26)

4. The Quran attributes to Jesus many of the miracles which are mentioned in the Bible. According to the Quran, Jesus was empowered by Allah to cure the sick, revive the dead, and make the blind see:"

"O Jesus, Son of Mary, remember My favor upon you and upon your mother when I supported you with the Holy Spirit and you spoke to the people in the cradle and in maturity; and remember when I taught you writing and wisdom and the Torah and the Gospel; and when you designed from clay what was like the form of a bird with My permission, then you breathed into it and it became a bird with My permission; and you healed the blind and the leper with My permission; and when you revived the dead with My permission; and when I restrained the Children of Israel from killing you when you came to them with clear proofs..." (the Quran 5:110)

In addition to this, the Quran ascribes to Jesus a miracle that is not recorded in the gospels: Jesus spoke clearly while he was in the cradle:

"Then she brought him to her people, carrying him. They said, 'O Mary, you have certainly done a thing" unprecedented. O sister of Aaron, your father was not a man of evil, nor was your mother unchaste.' So she pointed to Jesus. They said, 'How" can we speak to a child who is in the cradle?' Jesus said, 'Indeed, I am the servant of Allah. He has given me the Scripture and made me a prophet. And He has made me blessed wherever I am and has enjoined upon me prayer and zakah as long as I remain alive..." (19:27-31)

"Indeed I have come to you with a sign from your Lord in that I design for you from clay [that which is] like the form of a bird, then I breathe into it and it becomes a bird by permission of Allah. And I cure the blind and the leper, and I give life to the dead - by permission of Allah. And I inform you of what you eat and what you store in your houses. Indeed in that is a sign for you, if you are believers." (4:49)

5. Islam agrees with Christianity about the temptation of Jesus. As it is mentioned in Matt. 4:1-13 and Luke 4:1-13, Satan tempted Jesus but he couldn't make him commit sin. Because:
"The wife of 'Imran said, 'My Lord, indeed I have pledged to You what is in my womb, consecrated for Your service, so accept this from me. Indeed, You are the Hearing, the Knowing.' But when she gave birth to her, she said, 'My Lord, I have delivered a female.' And Allah was most knowing of what she delivered, 'And the male is not like the female. And I have named her Mary, and I seek refuge for her in You and for her descendants from Satan, the expelled from the mercy of Allah." (the Quran 3:35-36)

These are what we both believe regarding Jesus. In my next argument, I will write about the differences and show you who the REAL Jesus is, the Muslim Jesus or the Christian Jesus?

And about your argument:

1. I am sorry but I cannot understand what speaking in tongues mean... Would you please explain more and make it clear for me?

2. As I said, we believe that Jesus miraculously healed people. But I have not heard that Allah has healed any Christian through Jesus and I am not sure if I should believe it.

We cannot believe it, because after the coming of Prophet Muhammad, all the former religions were to be regarded as null and void, and the relationship amd connection of Christians and Jews with Allah and heavens came to an end. Allah doesn't accwpt their religions, so how can we believe that He accepts their prayers and heal them? Especially a prostitute who has corrupted herself and committed such a major sin all the times?

"Indeed, the religion in the sight of Allah is Islam." (3:19)
"And whoever desires other than Islam as religion - never will it be accepted from him, and he, in the Hereafter, will be among the losers." (3:85)

There are some Christians who claim that they have seen Jesus in a vision. But I doubt it. When I ask them to explain more about those visions, they refuse to answer me. If they really saw Jesus, he would have surely guided them to Straight Path. And if they truely have vision, how do they know that they really see Jesus and not Satan? Because Satan can appear like humans and resemble whomever he wants.
Anyway. As Muslims, we believe in prophet Muhammad and his descendants. We believe they are the pure and chosen servants of Allah and also they are superior to Jesus. We believe that they heal us by the permission of Allah. I myself saw a girl who was healed by them when I visited the grave of Imam Reza (the 8th successor of Prophet Muhammad). If you want some examples of miraculously healing by the household of Muhammad and read the real stories, you can visit these webpages:

3. Oh my gosh! I didn't know that Jesus can cast out spirits from people. I thought that he just could make Satan enters humans and animals!

"Jesus answered,"'It is the one to whom I will give this piece of bread when I have dipped it in the dish.' Then, dipping the piece of bread, he gave it to Judas,"the son of Simon Iscariot.As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into him." (John (13:26-27)

Casting out the Jinn is not a hard thing to do. How do you know that only Jesus can do it? According to Islam, every pious and righteous man can cast out the spirits (we call them Jinn) from others. He just need to learn how to do it. There are some supplications, Dhikr (special words we recite to glorify Allah) or verses of the Quran, if we recite them, we can cast out Jinn from others. Have you ever asked yourself how Jesus could revive the dead? By magic? No. Allah taught him some part of the reality of the Quran. When he recited the Quran upon the dead and revived them. We can do it too. It is narrated from Prophet Muhammad that if we recite the first chapter of the Quran (al-Fatiha) seventy times upon dead people, we can revive them. But we must have a strong faith that we can surely revive them. If we doubt it, this will not happen.

"And if there was any qur'an by which the mountains would be removed or the earth would be broken apart or the dead would be made to speak, it would be this Qur'an." (13:31)

Please post your argument soon. I have many things to say about Jesus
Debate Round No. 1


First I would like to say this sounds like it very well could become a very interesting debate.

(slight personal background on myself) I grew up seeing a spirit/demon that interacted to me as soon as I straddled someone's back at a Christian kid's sports camp away from home inside a college dorm room. What transpired was, I was massaging another kid's back my age in the dark before everyone went to sleep as I always massaged my dad's back in a likewise manner. Upon my massaging the kid's back I saw an image form on his back from no where. I look to the dark wall same form appeared. I closed my eyes, same form appeared. I inquired to the kid I was massaging if he ever saw this same image, and was informed that this same image laughed at him when his father raped his mother. I go to ask an adult counselor "another child's parent" about this image I am seeing and was told, it was just your imagination and it's not real. That conclusion left a question mark in my head as a child that led me when I was older to question the practice of Christianity, I followed it perhaps but everything seemed like something was missing because no one properly explained to me what I saw or why until I was much older. The same kid however denied such an event when publicly confronted with the question when I saw him years later in front of females in highschool he probably was trying to be popular with.

Years later, I deploy to IRAQ; I saw first hand SATANIC/DEMONIC/OCCULTIC/SPIRITUAL influences that were not from GOD, but from Satan. I even made a trial-pact with Satan to later cancel the pact(or agreement). I know Satanism/Occultism/Demonism is real from my own experience. But I have never understood the islam faith in how their claim is real. After my deployment where I saw the events taking place, I found a ministry outreach (the link I provided earlier, and found GOD, not a religion not a belief but GOD. But even today if I am being honest, I still don't fully think that my faith and seeking after GOD's will in my life is where it should be. GOD has shown me Christianity is real, otherwise a good portion of what I have seen and heard taking place would not have transpired in my life where someone has been healed of tumors from a generational curse placed on her by her mother's sins (That's JESUS CHRIST paying for the Sins, diseases, cancers, and health problems for HIS LOVED CHILDREN for those who would seek after HIM). I question the legitimate truth from what doesn't make sense without evidence seen and talked today. (if that makes sense?)

Speaking in tongues in the meaning of what I am saying, is this: Does anyone know the language of the angels or of the demons? Such verbal language is what I speak of that some of the (TRUE) Believers of Christ have, which they use in spiritual battle and spiritual confrontation against spirits/demons, curses on someone's health, and similiar issues.

"If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal."

This is what I am referring to about speaking in tongues and sounding that of gibberish to human's understanding. (Islam doesn't teach or speak of such things that I understand.)

The problem we will have in this debate however is just what you said you don't want to talk about, what you as a muslim believe regarding Jesus. For me JESUS CHRIST is like the super glue that ties the whole connectivity of GOD together with Man KIND.

I cannot compare or discuss the majority of any differences without JESUS CHRIST. For without JESUS CHRIST the Holy Bible is just another fairy tale written only by men that miraculously came up with prophecies that came true through someone's birth at a specific time and specific place.

I don't understand how muslims can respect and venerate JESUS CHRIST if they do not believe HIM to be who HIS actions said HE was. I have watched a two part youtube video debate 1 hour plus long each with how the imam challenged the pastor he was debating to show where JESUS CHRIST claimed these things verbatim.

I view that claim to be that of rediculous proportion, because if someone has guards surrounding him, he makes commands and everyone obeys him, he makes judgement and the punishment is made does that not dictate that he would be that of a very high-power authority without him needing to make such a claim?

I am not saying JESUS CHRIST was exactly how I used the example of above. But if you were to step out of your QURAN and Hadiths only concept and actually studied who JESUS CHRIST was, what he did, how he acted, how he talked, research what type of messiah, king of the JEWS the disciples were looking for you will see a sharp contrast and understand why now JESUS CHRIST did not need to make any type of claim that this mr. deedad(t?) person said JESUS CHRIST absolutely never said.

And please tell me this, if the QURAN re-affirms his miraculous birth and his miraculous abilities, then what about what JESUS CHRIST said to his disciples through the old and new Testament giving the painful burden of knowing and understanding what the old testament meant when writing to the different churches that were formed referring to JESUS CHRIST's teachings and referring to the Old Testament more than one time in similiarities and not differences?

Was JESUS CHRIST not fully Flesh and Blood? Was JESUS CHRIST not fully GOD ALMIGHTY? For notice how Mark Chapter 5 says:

6 He was some distance away when he saw Jesus; so he ran, fell on his knees before him, 7 and screamed in a loud voice, "Jesus, Son of the Most High God! What do you want with me? For God's sake, I beg you, don't punish me!" (8 He said this because Jesus was saying, "Evil spirit, come out of this man!")

Why would such demons scream, "JESUS SON OF THE MOST HIGH GOD"... so how many muslim teachers had this happen to them in your teachings?

I am confused, from your statement as well, for I don't see where in my scriptures it says mary was one of the most pure and exalted women of all creation in my teachings of her. Can you point to me where my religious texts teach of such things?

The Birth of Jesus Foretold

26 In the sixth month of Elizabeth"s pregnancy, God sent the angel Gabriel to Nazareth, a town in Galilee, 27 to a virgin pledged to be married to a man named Joseph, a descendant of David. The virgin"s name was Mary. 28 The angel went to her and said, "Greetings, you who are highly favored! The Lord is with you."

29 Mary was greatly troubled at his words and wondered what kind of greeting this might be. 30 But the angel said to her, "Do not be afraid, Mary; you have found favor with God. 31 You will conceive and give birth to a son, and you are to call him Jesus. 32 He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. The Lord God will give him the throne of his father David, 33 and he will reign over Jacob"s descendants forever; his kingdom will never end."

34 "How will this be," Mary asked the angel, "since I am a virgin?"

35 The angel answered, "The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called[a] the Son of God. 36 Even Elizabeth your relative is going to have a child in her old age, and she who was said to be unable to conceive is in her sixth month. 37 For no word from God will ever fail."

38 "I am the Lord"s servant," Mary answered. "May your word to me be fulfilled." Then the angel left her.

Mary was most pure an exalted where now in scriptures? According to a Catholic Belief Practice? Tell me where and when the Catholics did not add traditions, other religious beliefs, and unholy practices into what was once pure and holy teaching to the masses?

I don't agree with Mary being one of the most pure and exalted women of all creation, for my scriptures do not define her as such an individual meaning those words were added by man's teaching and not GOD's.

I would agree that the JESUS that I believe is not the same JESUS that you believe, making the claim I have heard too many times to be false. Meaning that the Muslims do not believe in the same books of the Christian Faith although if I understood your texts properly, they do not question what the Old and New Testament says according to the debate I watched about muslims and christians. If that be true, then this in itself contradicts itself proving it is not directed by your god to be written, but by man inspired by a demon or unholy spirit with knowledge of human science.

If Islam agrees with Christianity about the Holines of Jesus, then how about when he died on the cross for our sins and rose again in three days? Does your faith believe that, if not then this alone sticks out wonders of altered claims about the same Jesus being the same HOLINESS.

If Islam agrees with agrees with Christianity about the holiness of Mary SHOW ME IN MY TEXTS where it says this as I cannot find any except the specifics of what I already quoted with what book and verse (there are other references, but it is along the same and similiar manner not calling mary holy. Sure she was pure in the sense that she didn't commit pre-marital sex, but that should be the majority of those who actually follow after their true faith, so I'm confused what seperates and takes her apart. What makes her purified, because she was a virgin? I am confused... as I previously stated that's the majority of females who sought after their faith as well but this makes her the most noble of the noblest women in all nations how for this confuses me from my texts that I read and understand if *IT IS AGREED BY BOTH FAITHS.

Please look in the comments, for I have already reached my 10k word limit on this subject..


Well, I'm a bit confused. I don't know I should reply to your comments or argument. So, I first tell you the differences between Muslim Jesus and Christian Jesus and then explain about some of your misconception regarding him.

- Some Differences:
Islam denies some beliefs of Christians regarding Jesus such as:
1. It denies the divinity of Jesus. He's not deity. He's not God. He's not worthy of worship because he himself was a humble worshipper of God."we can't pray to him, bevause he himself prayed to God.

"Beware the Day when Allah will say, "O Jesus, Son of Mary, did you say to the people, 'Take me and my mother as deities besides Allah?'" He will say, "Exalted are You! It was not for me to say that to which I have no right." If I had said it, You would have known it. You know what is within myself, and I do not know what is within Yourself. Indeed, it is You who is Knower of the unseen. I said not to them except what You commanded me - to worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. And" I was a witness over them as long as I was among them; but when You took me up, You were the Observer over them, and You are, over all things, Witness. If You should punish them - indeed they are Your servants; but if You forgive them - indeed it is You who is the Exalted in Might," the Wise." (5:117-119)

2. It denies the sonship of Jesus. He's not the son of Allah. He's just a prophet to guide people. According to Quran, the creation of Jesus is like that of Adam. Prophet Adam had no parents. Allah created him from clay. So it's not impossible for Him to make a virgin woman gives birth to a male, is it?
"Indeed, the example of Jesus to Allah is like that of Adam. He created Him from dust; then He said to him, 'Be,' and he was." (3:59)

"O People of the Scripture, do not commit excess in your religion or say about Allah except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was but a messenger of Allah and His word which He directed to Mary and a" soul created at a command from" Him. So believe in Allah and His messengers. And do not say, 'Three'; desist - it is better for you. Indeed, Allah is but one God. Exalted is He above having a son." (4:171)

3. It denies the crucifixion of Jesus. He wasn't killed on the cross and wasn't resurrected. After Judas betrayed Jesus and when the Israelities wanted to arrest and crucify him, Jesus ascended to heavens by Allah's will. So they couldn't find him. Then Allah made Judas resemble Jesus and the Israelities thought that Judas was Jesus and crucified him. They crucified Judas, not Jesus. Prophet Jesus is still alive and will return with the Son of Man (Imam Mahdi) to bring peace to the world.
"And for their saying, 'Indeed, we have killed the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, thr messenger of Allah.' And they did not kill him, nor did they crucify him; but another (Judas) was made to resemble him to them. And indeed, those who differ over it are in doubt about" it. They have no knowledge of it except the following of assumption. And they did not kill him, for certain." (4:175)

4. According to the Bible Jesus changes his own words. He says something about himself and after a while, he speaks the opposite words. We don't believe in such Jesus:

"As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees"before him. 'Good teacher,' he asked, 'what must I do to inherit eternal life?' 'Why do you call me good?' Jesus answered."'No one is good"except God alone." (Mark 10:17-18)

But suddenly he calls himself good:
"I am"the good shepherd."The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep." (John 10:11)

And I cannot understand something. Jesus said:
"I and the Father are one." (John 10:30) And "The Father is in me, and I in the Father." (John 10:38)

If God and Jesus are one and the same why did he said, "No one is good, except God alone." If God is good, Jesus is good too. Because as Jesus said, they are one...

5. According to the Bible, Jesus denies her mother (Matthew 12-46:50) and disrespects her!
"Woman, what have I to do with thee?" (John 2:4)

He alao wants to make division in families:
"I have come to bring fire on the earth, and how I wish it were already kindled... Do you think I came to bring peace on earth? No, I tell you, but division. From now on there will be five in one family divided against each other, three against two and two against three. They will be divided, father against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against mother, mother-in-law against daughter-in-law and daughter-in-law against mother-in-law." (Luke 12:49-53)

Maybe Jesus hated her mother as his disciples did:
"If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters"yes, even their own life"such a person cannot be my disciple." (Luke 14:26)

But as Islam says, Jesus served his mother:
"And Allah made me dutiful to my mother, and He has not made me a wretched tyrant." (Quran 19:31)

4. According to the Bible, Jesus is cursed:
"'Cursed is he who dishonors his father or mother." (Deuteronomy 27:16)

"Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law"by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: 'Cursed is everyone who is hung on a pole.' (Galatians 3:13)

And as I said, Judas was crucified and hung on a pole. So Judas is cursed, not Jesus.

But Islam says he is blessed:
"And He has made me blessed wherever I am." (Quran 19:31)

These are some differences between my Jesus and your Jesus. As you can see, Islam disagrees with Christianity regarding divinity and sacrifice of Jesus. And it shows that only one of these religions speaks the truth about the REAL Jesus. But which one? Which book speaks the truth? Which book glorifies and respects Jesus more logically without exaggeration? Which book sounds more logical, the Quran or the Bible? We are going to figure it out.

Ok, now I answer and explain about your comments:

- You said:
"If JESUS CHRIST's FATHER was not GOD, then you are unable to adequately explain everything of how GOD was referring to HIS SON and that HE IS THE FATHER."

How do you know that I am unable to explain about it?! The Bible is the only evidence you have to say that Jesus is the Son of God. You don't have any other evidence, do you? So, what will you do if I prove that the Bible is corrupted?

Jesus was from the Israelities and spoke Aramaic language and he spread the word of God in Jerusalem. During his lifetime, only a few people believed in him. But after he ascended to heavens, some of his followers who knew Greek, wrote some books in Greek language and sent them to other countries and told people that those books were the teachings of Jesus. Those people who saw Jesus, witnessed his behaviors, heard his words and knew his language lived in Jerusalem and didn't believe in him. They found these scriptures as false statements. And those who believed in the New Testament and the stories within it - they never saw Jesus, nor did they live in Jerusalem. And also, the authors of the New Testament could write whatever they wanted, even false statements. Nothing could prevent them from this. And the people who lived in the other countries had no choice but to believe in scriptures. They knew nothing about Jesus. They learnt everything from those scriptures. So how could they prove that those scriptures are not true?

"And indeed, there is among them a party who alter the Scripture with their tongues so you may think it is from the Scripture, but it is not from the Scripture. And they say, 'This is from Allah.' but it is not from Allah. And they speak untruth about Allah while they know." (the Quran 3:78)

We cannot trust the Bible because we can find many contradictions within it. Besides, some of the verses are illogican and nonsense. Some of your beliefs can be disproven logically, but we can't prove them!

The Bible is written by men - some people like you and I who were not infallible and pure. They could write whatever they wanted and knowingly or unknowingly coreupt the Torah and the Gospel which were revealed to Moses and Jesus. The stories in the Bible are some narrations which people used to talk about on those ages. Some of them are true, some are fake. If you want to know which part of the Bible is true, you can compare it to the Quran. If the Quran confirms it, that part is true. I have enough evidence to prove yoy that the Bible us false and the Quran is right. If you want, I can present my evidence.

- About the demons addressing Jesus as the Son of God.

Firstly, do not believe whatever you see or hear. Are you sure that a demon was saying such a thing? Are you sure it was not an imagination which superstitious people talk about?

Secondly, you yourself said that they are demons, not angels! The angel says the truth, the demon says whatever he wants! Can you trust a demon? Do you know how Satan deceives us? Does he tell us the truth? Does he tell us about the evil effects and harmfulness of sins to make us disobey Allah? No. Rather, he deceives us by false statements and promises:
"Satan promises them and arouses desire in them. But Satan does not promise them except delusion." (the Quran 4:120)
So can you trust a demon? To my mind, if a demon truely believed in Allah (God), he'd never become evil. Satan said that he believed in Allah, but he disblieved in his heart.

Thirdly, what do you know about demons? We call them "Jinn" in Islam. They are like us and live among us. They eat, drink, get married, have children and etc. Some Jinns are atheists, some are believers. Some Jinns are Christians, some are Muslims. Muslim and righteous Jinn don't harm humans because Allah has prohibited this for them. Only the evil Jinn can enter people's bodies. I don't explain about them. There are many verses and a chapter in Quran which you can read. I just wanna say if what you claim is true andh
a Jinn has said such things, it means that Jinn is a Christian.

Please read my comments too.
Debate Round No. 2


If Islam denies the beliefs of Christians, then this in itself proves they do not believe in the same GOD, and so from a Christian"s perspective alone is evidence to know that the Muslim faith is not being truthful when it comes time for who believes the same.
It is true, the Jewish believe in the same Messiah to come but have been led astray in terms of not accepting JESUS CHRIST on the earth at the time of his death and resurrection.

But the muslims completely twist and change even what the jewish people believe. Claiming that their *newer* testaments prove that theirs is the one and only faith to follow.

Why do I say twist and change?

Because when your faith alter the word of the OLD TESTAMENT and NEW TESTAMENT in how it is understood, that is called twist and change, no matter how you defend it.

But to state the reason it is true is because it was directed to be spoken by GOD directly and the other religions are corrupted because, "god said it is corrupted?"

Someone either has to prove the statements from being actually in the old testament time-frame or dig up archeological proofs for any such claims.

I believe, and will always state that a secondary belief that claims the old and new testament are corrupted because their "god" said it is can only be inspired by SATAN, or one of Satan"s direct followers.

If it was not inspired by Satan or Satan"s direct followers, you will see consistency, accuracy and actual proof not later misinterpreted, false statements, and wrong claims.

I am not worried what religious text you use as evidence in claims made even if it is satanic, but as you use each religious text keep in mind how the text proves or disproves each claim stated and why.

If there is evidence or reason to believe the other religious text is in itself corrupted, twisted, lying, or otherwise believing and making any statements or comments with it proves nothing but the power of that faith and power inside of your own life accordingly.

I have never heard of a muslim who truthfully read the entire old and new testament letter for letter and asked for the GOD of the books to speak to them and not be spoken to if they are being sincere.

If your quran denies the sonship of JESUS, then there was no reason to for the entire new testament to be almost completely about only HIM.

Your own faith speaks of Jesus, the son of Mary as if mary was of some great big importance in how JESUS CHRIST was formed because of what Mary did or is suppose to represent.

If you deny JESUS CHRIST is GOD, the Holy SPIRIT is GOD, and GOD THE FATHER is GOD as three in ONE GOD Trinity, then it provokes the question if you believe in the RIGHT AND True JESUS CHRIST.

My JESUS CHRIST heals, delivers, casts out.. but your Jesus Christ denies such things.

You talk of things that took place a long time ago in your evidence claims of your faith being able to heal.

My JESUS CHRIST is talking of things now, constantly occurring for those who seek and desire to believe and learn of JESUS CHRIST"s grace, mercy and love.

If your JESUS CHRIST and your faith denies the crucifixion of JESUS and resurrection, but claims that he was ascended to heaven by god"s will so they couldn"t find him can you prove such claims your religious faith?

And the on top of it, claiming that they made Judas resemble Jesus and the Israelities thought Judas was Jesus and crucified him you know how contradicting that sounds to the Christian faith who discusses how JESUS Christ was on a closed trial where no one was allowed to see him be on trial for accuracy or evidence being used?

You know how many false testimonies that they used against Jesus Christ?

Do you know the words JESUS CHRIST used upon being crucified on the cross?

Do you know or is that you choose to live in ignorance because it is only what your faith teaches you and since your faith is the most recent, why don"t you convert to the LATTER DAY SAINTS? ACCORDING TO THEM THEY HAVE THE MOST RECENT REVELATIONS OF GOD!

How do you verify your claims of your scriptures just because it is the claims of your faith against another faith?

I will refuse to rebuttal or to debate until you can provide me an adequate answer of these questions leading into the Latter Day Saints:

"If your JESUS CHRIST and your faith denies the crucifixion of JESUS and resurrection, but claims that he was ascended to heaven by god"s will so they couldn"t find him can you prove such claims your religious faith? And the on top of it, claiming that they made Judas resemble Jesus and the Israelities thought Judas was Jesus and crucified him you know how contradicting that sounds to the Christian faith who discusses how JESUS Christ was on a closed trial where no one was allowed to see him be on trial for accuracy or evidence being used? You know how many false testimonies that they used against Jesus Christ? Do you know the words JESUS CHRIST used upon being crucified on the cross? AND THE ACTIONS THAT TOOK PLACE UPON HIS DEATH WITH THE HOLIEST OF HOLIES ROBE BEING TORN IN TWO? Do you know or is it that you choose to live in ignorance because it is only what your faith teaches you and since your faith is claimed to be the most recent. If this is the reasoning why don"t you convert to the LATTER DAY SAINTS? And all their claims and testimonies as well then?"

After all this isn't just a question of one religious belief, but of all religious beliefs; how does one prove all their evidence of claims used to make their belief *right*?

Again, many claim to know and believe the same JESUS CHRIST.... But can you prove the evidence of one religion claiming it was the wrong interpretation AFTER IT ALREADY HAPPENED AND SAW THE HOLY SPIRIT'S POWER IN RESPONSE FOR THE FOLLOWERS?

If Such a claim existed, then I suppose the new testament was full of funny, joking, and playful stories not to be used as instructions as they each had no power or control from who their teacher taught them?

And that they the Latter Day Saints should be the most accurate belief now because it is the most recent after the Muslim faith, so that means that all the muslims should convert to Latter Day Saints right?

Defend so I can understand where you come from and why. For if I use one claim, of faith that is the same is one I can understand, but to have someone else use their own faith as their defining answers and twist using single or two verses in the scripture (as I have seen you doing here) proves you have no character of truth in your claims in my understanding of accurate definitions and explanations.

Or is this part of you being a Muslim and me being a Kafir because I am not a follower of your faith so you are authorized to lie to me being a non-muslim? And you are forbidden by your religion to believe or study anything other than the quran for teaching and understanding and only spread your faith as the only truth and if it isn't proven and can't be proven then everyone else is just an infidel and that's that?

Can you answer this question about the Latter Day Saints in confidence without fear of your other followers who are muslim that you may be proved wrong in such debates?

What proves your quran is the most inspired by god when the Latter Day Saints teachings was revealed by John Smith directly inside a cave?

I could claim to have a revelation from GOD today in what to do and everything.... But that doesn't prove it is truthful, or does it according to your explanation of what is the true faith as being *your-only-texts-to-read*? And not to mention you need to be careful how much you read, for it may alter how you think and believe in your faith right? Is that why you leave the rest of the context out as you make single or double verse claims to make a complete faith absolutely false?


I told you what we believe or don't believe about Jesus by quoting the Quran. Since you don't trust it as the last revelation of God, I will use your Scriptures and other evidence to prove my claims.

I start with the crucifixion of Jesus:
The Quran reveals that the Romans devised a plot to crucify and kill Jesus. However, they have failed:
"And the disbelievers planned, but Allah planned. And Allah is the best of planners." (3:54)

They plotted and moved to kill Jesus. However, their plot failed and they ended up killing someone resembling Jesus. During this event, God raised Jesus up to His presence:

"Rather, Allah raised him to Himself. And ever is Allah Exalted in Might and Wise." (4:158)

And as I mentioned earlier, the person who was crucified wasn't Jesus but, by the will of God, someone resembling him was crucified and Jesus escaped the trap. However, the four gospels insist that it was Jesus who was crucified. But can we trust the Bible? Was Jesus really crucified? The answer to both questions is NO!


1. The Bible itself says that God would protect and save Jesus:

a) "The righteous person may have many troubles,"but the Lord delivers him from them all;" (Psalms 34:19)

2) We read in the Bible about the Last Supper:" For I tell you I will not drink again from the fruit of the vine until the kingdom of God comes." (Luke 22:17-18)

He clearly stated that he wouldn't drink from the fruit of vine (wine, vinegar, etc). Have you ever thought about it? Why did Jesus make such prediction? What did he want to tell us? Can it be a sign that another one is going to be crucified?

"I speak not of you all... He that eateth bread with me hath lifted up his heel against me."Now I tell you before it come, that, when it is come to pass, ye may believe that I am he." (John 13;18-19)

What does "I am he" mean? Does it mean "I am who I am" as NIV says? Or does "he" refer to Judas, the one betrayed Jesus? If so, does Jesus says, "I am Judas"?

Jesus predicted that he wouldn't drink wine again. Let's see what happened after his arrestment!

"Jesus, seeing that everything had been completed so that the Scripture record might also be complete, then said, 'I'm thirsty.' A jug of sour wine was standing by. Someone put a sponge soaked with the wine on a javelin and lifted it to his mouth. After he took the wine, Jesus said, 'It"s done... complete.' Bowing his head, he offered up his spirit." (Luke 19:28-30)

There are three possibilities regarding this verse:
1. It's a clear contradiction.
2. Jesus didn't know how to predict the future correctly!
3. Another one drank sour wine before his death!

I never claim that it's a contradiction. However, I checked some websites to see how Christians deny that Jesus violated his words. They interpreted the Bible as they liked to defend their claims. And it made their excuses contradict one another's and it made no sense. But I cannot understand why no one claims that it was not Jesus who drank vinegar on the cross! It was another, resembling him!

2. The 1500-year-old Bible claims that Jesus was not crucified and confirms the statement of the Quran. The reports show that this Bible is original and authentic. [1]

3. Paul says that Jesus is cursed." Can you believe it? If so, then you probably don't know what "curse" means. When we says someone is cursed, it means he's deprived from the mercy of God. And when we curse someone, we ask God not to have mercy upon him. But is Jesus really deprived from the mercy of God?
As Muslim, we believe Judas was cursed. He betrayed Jesus and was punished for that when the Romans crucified him.

4. Christians claim that Jesus sacrificed his life willingly for our sins. However, after Jesus was crucified, he cried out, quoting the Scripture:" My God, why have you forsaken me?" Can you believe it's the word of Jesus who saceificed himself willingly? I think a fearful and weak person spoke such words, a person like Judas who was shocked when the Roman arrested him...

5. And can you believe God forsake Jesus, the God whom we read about: "For the"Lord"loves the just and will not forsake his faithful ones. Wrongdoers will be completely destroyed,"the offspring of the wicked will perish." (Psalm 37:28)?

6. The Romans neither know nor met Jesus. So if someone else resembled Jesus, they couldn't recognize him.

7. The Romans wanted to arrest Jesus at night. We know that it was easy for Jesus to run away at night and Romans mistook Judas for Jesus.

8. And finally, if Judas was not crucified, then exactly how did he die? Did he hang himself (Matthew 27:3-8) or fall headlong (Acts 1:17-18)?

You can also read this.

Did Jesus wanted to sacrifice himself willingly?
"Then he said to them,"'My soul is overwhelmed with sorrow"to the point of death. Stay here and keep watch with me.'"Going a little farther, he fell with his face to the ground and prayed 'My Father, if it is possible, may this cup"be taken from me. Yet not as I will, but as you will.' (Matthew 26:38-39)
Before the arrestment, Jesus Christ repeated this prayer three times. He strongly asked God to remove death from him. It shows that sacrifice was not his purpose. And God answered his prayer. "During the days of Jesus" life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions"with fervent cries and tears"to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission." (Hebrews 5:7)

We can prove logically that Jesus was not killed. It's really simple and makes sense. But we fail to prove the claims of the Bible. The Bible is beautiful. It has been beautified with lies. If a person reads it blindly, he may be conviced. But the more he reseaches on the Bible, the more he finds its reality.

"O People of the Scripture, why do you confuse the truth with falsehood and conceal the truth while you know it?" (3:71)

But why can we not trust the Bible?
1. There is only one Quran. You cannot find two copies of it which are not similar. But how many scriptures are there? Do they all say the same things and confirms one another? On the contrary, they contradicts one another!
2. The contradictions in the Bible shows us that it's not authentic. But Christians ignore them!
The Jehovah's Witnesses in their "Awake" Magazine dated 8th September 1957 published the following headline: "50,000 Errors in the Bible" wherein they say "..there are probably 50,000 errors in the Bible...errors which have crept into the Bible text...50,000 such serious errors..." After all of this, however, they go on to say: " a whole the Bible is accurate.
3. The authors of the Bible are unknown. However, some people attribute the Gospel of Matthew to St. Matthew or attribute the Gospel of John to St. John. But the Bible is written in third person. It means other persons wrote it.
"And as Jesus passed forth from thence, he saw a man, named Matthew, sitting at the receipt of custom: and he said to him, Follow me. And he arose, and followed him." (Matthew 9:9)

The author of the Book of Hebrews is unknown. Martin Luther suggested that Apollos was the author...Tertullian said that Hebrews was a letter of Barnabas. Adolf Harnack and J. Rendel Harris speculated that it was written by Priscilla (or Prisca). William Ramsey suggested that it was done by Philip. However, the traditional position is that the Apostle Paul wrote Hebrews. Eusebius believed that Paul wrote it, but Origen was not positive of Pauline authorship.

If the authors of the Bible are unknown, how can we attribute it to God? How can we prove they were inspired?

Paul and his church were responsible of making wholesale changes to the religion of Jesus after his departure and were further responsible for mounting a massive campaign of death and torture of all Christians who refused to renounce the teachings of the apostles in favor of the Pauline doctrines. All but the Gospels acceptable to the Pauline faith were then systematically destroyed or re-written. Rev. Charles Anderson Scott says"
"It is highly probable that not one of the Synoptic Gospels (Matthew, Mark, and Luke) was in existence in the form which we have it, prior to the death of Paul. And were the documents to be taken in strict order of chronology, the Pauline Epistles would come before the synoptic Gospels.""[2]

Prof. Brandon confirms this statement: "The earliest Christian writings that have been preserved for us are the letters of the apostle Paul" [3]

In the latter part of the second century, Dionysius, Bishop of Corinth says: "As the brethren desired me to write epistles, I did so, and these the apostles of the devil have filled with tares ", exchanging some things and adding others, for whom there is a woe reserved. It is not therefore, a matter of wonder if some have also attempted to adulterate the sacred writings of the Lord, since they have attempted the same in other works that are not to be compared with these."

You ask us if we believe in true Jesus. But first you should ask yourself this question. Most things you know about Jesus are the lies you read in the Bible. You should question your own faith, not mine.

I don't believe Jesus can heal the ill today. Because I haven't seen anyone healed by him. And if I do, I can't trust them. Because after the coming of Muhammad, the relationship of non-Muslims with God was severed.

And I believe every pious and righteous man can cast out the Jinn from humans by reciting the Quran and Dhikr. And I'll mention what they are in my comments.
I have more evidence to prove my claims. But I want you to disprove them and convince me that you believe in true Jesus.
Don't say your faith is true.
Prove it.


[2] History of Christianity in the Light of Modern Knowledge, Rev. Charles Anderson Scott, p.338

[3] Religions in Ancient History, S.G.F. Brandon, p. 228.
Debate Round No. 3


I believe we will need to have more rounds of debates after the 5th round, because I am constantly being flooded by your one and two verse quotations NEVER FLOODING THE ENTIRE VERSES YOU MENTION FOR FULL CONTEXT OF WHAT IS SPOKEN.

And I think it is rather entertaining how you seem to think that sending me a personal message verses posting everything in the debate directly (two separate times mind you if anyone's curious how many) about how I may be confused or get further direct clarification from you but not directly posted on here.

I still stick to my original questions:

Prove to me the importance of mary in the old testament prophecies verses the old testament prophecies about the Savior JESUS CHRIST.

It is not the Christian faith, but the catholic faith who claim such high importance (catholic faith to a point can be actually pagan and idolatrous in nature) which is not of the true faith that I believe according to my scriptures.

If you are to make a claim of mary's importance, ensure you clarify the importance spoken of in the OLD TESTAMENT PROPHESIES.

IF IT IS NOT THERE THEN IT MEANS IT IS MEANINGLESS other than a female, a name, and GOD's Chosen time-frame.

If you make a claim of JESUS CHRIST making claims and statements and making rebuttals, tell me in what part of scripture you see that JESUS did not heal the roman soldier's ear after it being cut off?


I will continue to refuse any further discussion of debate until you can OPENLY AND NOT PRIVATELY CLARIFY THESE IN FULL CONTEXT, EVEN IF THAT MEANS A WHOLE CHAPTER (Does your faith forbid actually reading into it in full context? I'm sure you will have to say many confessions or something if it does for reading another religious text in such full detail if you even dare quoting the entire chapter on here.)

AGAIN ONE VERSE TWO VERSES full of twisting capabilities and ignorance.

Can you please be more upfront and truthful in full clarifications of your stance?

I still repeat my initial question about the LATTER DAY SAINTS (LDS), why don't all muslims convert to LDS since it is the most recent revelations from someone claiming to be god?


Are you not answering the LDS question because I am being ignorant on the question, being a kafir, or because I'm an infidel? Prove to me I'm a kafir, or an infidel according to your faith because I am persistently asking you to be truthful and all I am getting are lies?


Seems like the only evidence you have for your claims is the prophecies of Old Testament. Ok, I will do my best to disprove this one as well.

And you asked me to prove the importance of Mary by quoting the Old Testament.. Hmm, don't you think it is a bit hard? Because the Old Testament slanders the holy Prophets and even belittles God. So how can it respect and glorify Mary?!

"And [We cursed them] for their disbelief and their saying against Mary a great slander," (4:156)

But if you see the genealogy of Jesus, you will see his forefathers were impure. I just mention two of them:

a) Lot and His Daughters
30 Lot and his two daughters left Zoar and settled in the mountains, for he was afraid to stay in Zoar. He and his two daughters lived in a cave.
31 One day the older daughter said to the younger, "Our father is old, and there is no man around here to give us children"as is the custom all over the earth.
32 Let's get our father to drink wine and then sleep with him and preserve our family line through our father.
33 That night they got their father to drink wine, and the older daughter went in and slept with him. He was not aware of it when she lay down or when she got up.
34 The next day the older daughter said to the younger, "Last night I slept with my father. Let's get him to drink wine again tonight, and you go in and sleep with him so we can preserve our family line through our father
35 So they got their father to drink wine that night also, and the younger daughter went in and slept with him. Again he was not aware of it when she lay down or when she got up.
36 So both of Lot's daughters became pregnant by their father.
37 The older daughter had a son, and she named him Moab he is the father of the Moabites of today.
38 The younger daughter also had a son, and she named him Ben-Ammi; he is the father of the Ammonites of today. (Genesis 19:30-38)

And Jesus were from the progeny of Ben-Ammi:

"Solomon the father of Rehoboam." (Matthew 1:7)

"His [Rehoboam's] mother"s name was Naamah; she was an Ammonite." (1 Kings 14:21)

b) Judah slept with his daughter-in-law, Tamar, and she gave birth to twin boys, named Perez and Zerah. (see Genesis 38:15-30).

And Perez is the forefather of Prophet David, Solomon and Jesus. Can you believe that these prophets were the descendants of an illegitimate child who was the result of forbidden relations?!

"Do not have sexual relations with your daughter-in-law. She is your son's wife; do not have relations with her." (Leviticus 18:15)

But the New Testament says that Mary was chaste. Her chastity may not be an important thing. But we shouldn't expect the Bible to glorify or praise Mary more than this! At least it has not slandered her.

Ok. Let's see how the Old Testament proves that Jesus was not crucified:

- Psalm 91
1 Whoever dwells in the shelter"of the Most High will rest in the shadow of the Almighty.
2 I will say of the"Lord, 'He is my refuge and my fortress,' my God, in whom I trust.
3 Surely he will save you from the fowler's snare and from the deadly pestilence.
4 He will cover you with his feathers, and under his wings you will find refuge; his faithfulness will be your shield and rampart.
5 You will not fear the terror of night, nor the arrow that flies by day,
6 nor the pestilence that stalks in the darkness, nor the plague that destroys at midday.
7 A thousand may fall at your side, ten thousand at your right hand, but it will not come near you.
8 You will only observe with your eyes"and see the punishment of the wicked.
9"If you say, "The Lord is my refuge," and you make the Most High your dwelling,
10 no harm"will overtake you, no disaster will come near your tent.
11 For he will command his angels concerning you to guard you in all your ways;
12"they will lift you up in their hands,"so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.
13 You will tread on the lion and the cobra; you will trample the great lion and the serpent.
14 "Because he"loves me," says the Lord, "I will rescue him;"I will protect him, for he acknowledges my name.
15 He will call on me, and I will answer him;"I will be with him in trouble, I will deliver him and honor him.
16 With long life I will satisfy him and show him my salvation."

When Satan tempted Jesus, he quoted the Scripture:

Jesus Is Tested in the Wilderness
4 Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit left the Jordan and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness,
2 where for forty days he was tempted by the devil. He ate nothing during those days, and at the end of them he was hungry.
3 The devil said to him, "If you are the Son of God, tell this stone to become bread.
4 Jesus answered,""It is written:' Man shall not live on bread alone.'"
5 The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world.
6 And he said to him, "I will give you all their authority and splendor; it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to."
7"If you worship me, it will all be yours.
8 Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.'"
9 The devil led him to Jerusalem and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down from here.
10 For it is written:' He will command his angels concerning you to guard you carefully;
11 they will lift you up in their hands, so that you will not strike
your foot against a stone.'"
12 Jesus answered, "It is said:' Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'
13 When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time."

Satan was tempting Jesus to throw himself off of a mountain to test God. Because in that prophecy, God told Jesus that he would protect him from death in all the way. So Satan quoted the Scripture to tempt Jesus. He wanted him to test God and see if God would save him or not.
In his response, Jesus confirmed that this prophecy is about himself. That's why he said:
"It is said: "Do not put the Lord your God to the test.""

Psalm clearly says that Jesus was not crucified and God has saved him from death.

- Isaiah 52
"See, my servant"will act wisely;
he will be raised and lifted up and highly exalted." (Isaiah 52:12-13)

The above verse simply says that Jesus will be rised to heaven. It doesn't say that he would be sacrificed, resurrected and then would be rised to heaven. And thr Quran confirms it.

"Rather, Allah raised him to Himself. And ever is Allah Exalted in Might and Wise." (4:158)

There are more prophecies which proves Jesus was not crucified. But if you find a prophecy saying Jesus would sacrifice himself, it's because that prophecy is re-written based on the New Testament. Those who corrupted the Bible wrote that Jesus died for our sins. Then, they re-wrote the prophecies to correct the changes, so that Christians cannot easily realize that the Old Testament contradicts the New Testament.

And I believe that God heals Christians. But I don't say Jesus did so. I also don't say God is just the Lord of Muslims. God is the Lord of the worlds. He heals and helps his obedient servants who are non-Muslims. He will grant them what they want in this world. But they may not have a share in the Hereafter. And I cannot deny that the relationship of non-Muslims with heavens is severed. Because:

"Therefore I tell you that the kingdom of God will be taken away from you"and given to a people who will produce its fruit." (Matthew 21:48)

After, the coming of Jesus, the Kingdom of God was taken away from Jews and given to those who believed in Jesus. Likewise, after the coming of Prophet Muhammad, the kingdom of God was taken from Christian and given to Muslims.

To your mind, a real believer is someone who believes the ill are healed and demons are cast out in the name of Jesus. But are you sure that you know the true Jesus? He was just a prophet. However everything related to him was miracle. Don't you think that you are exaggerating about him?

"The excess and exaggeration on the part of religious leaders and saints has always been a cause of deviation from the truth; and losing the right way to Allah. On this account, Islam strictly warns and forbids such exaggerations, because people's excesses in their religion lead them to blasphemy.
Jews show a lot of vain zeal and arrogance, mingled with vanity, in the direction of racialism, exclusiveness, and their saying that they are the elects of God; and that the fire of Hell will burn them not but for a few days, and such false and unreasonable claims. On the other hand, we see the Christians having raised the prophet Jesus to a deity, and in a rank of equality with God! And surely this is because they know not who the God is! They venerate Mary almost to idolatry. They attribute a physical son to God, and have falsely forged their trinity, which is the union of three hypostases (FATHER, SON, AND HOLY GHOST) in one Godhead so that all the three are one God as to substance, but three persons as to individuality!" [1]

Some Christians say that Jesus is God, because only God can revive the dead. Firstly according to the Bible, other prophets revived the dead and they were not God or the Son of God. Secondly, Jesus revived the dead by the permission of Allah to show those who disbelieved in Afterlife that the Resurrection Day is true. God may heal Christians through Jesus but no one can heal them in the name of Jeaus. You cannot heal whom you wants, but God heals whom he wills.
You don't know who God is.
You don't know who Jesus is.
You don't know who a true believer is.
If someone doesn't believe in healing in Jesus' name, you can't say that he doesn't believe in the real Jesus.
Maybe, it's you who don't know who Jesus really is.

Debate Round No. 4


If Mary was of significance, Mary would have been spoken of in the old testament. (Agree or disagree?)

Mind you, if the specific name was mentioned how many females would have been given the name Mary?
Consider it, almost everyone would have been naming their daughter's Mary in the desire that their daughter would give birth to the Savior.
(Agree or disagree?)

Placing specific name, and a specific lineage saying that lineage who gave birth to the Savior should be praised, worshipped or other specific manner in the same as
GOD would have been directly mentioned . (Agree or disagree?)

Mind you the Old testament only specifies the coming of the SAVIOR OF THE WORLD due to the significant impact he will provide and do on this world.

If you are to use scriptures in the lineage of JESuS CHRIST to implicate that the lineage of JESUS CHRIST should have been impeccably perfect, wouldn't that have been significant
to JESUS CHRIST being with or without the sinners of this World?

And you are to claim that your quran is perfect in its claimed *dictation of your spoken directly by your god* due to the implication that the Old Testament slanders Mary due to your
own belief's explanation of Mary's importance without considering the complete whole and perfect will of GOD in the Old and New Testament of the Holy Bible? And that due to the
Old Testament Laws that you quoted from does not signify GOD's perfect and loving GRACE AND MERCY GOD bestowed upon MANKIND with JESuS CHRIST's appearance on the Earth in the
Manner of how He had His Only Begotten SON be born on this EARTH to die for MANKIND's sins, sicknesses and diseases the implications of why GOD would send his Son is endless.

This does not defile or talk less of anything the Old testament talks, and if anything implicates, accuses and explains why the Quran and hadiths are not scripturally by GOD's HOLY SPIRIT.

Matthew 7
True and False Disciples

21 "Not everyone who says to me, "Lord, Lord," will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day,
"Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?" 23 Then I will tell them plainly, "I never knew you. Away from me,
you evildoers!"

Do all the verses in the comment portion not portray that understanding of what a true and false disciple, let alone what a true and false apostle and follower would be?

Psalms 91 if you were to memorize it verbatim, and apply it to your own lives, in asking JESUS CHRIST to protect you and believe it, I challenge you to quote it over yourself spiritually
tell me it has no power and no control over what spirits, demons, and physical situations have over you today. Tell me that it means nothing in terms of terrorism and fear mongering
spirits in your life.

The above verse simply says that Jesus will be rised to heaven. It doesn't say that he would be sacrificed, resurrected and then would be rised to heaven. And thr Quran confirms it.
You're saying JESUS will be risen to heaven, but it doesn't state the manner of how or when he would be rose to heaven now does it? How could JESUS be the Ultimate Sacrifice if he was not
able to be killed for all of mankind's sin. If this is false, and all the old testament prophecied he was what would have happened? Was Jesus going to offer 40 female virgins for every sin?

Realistically speaking this isn't understood unless we are talking of a Super-Natural Being (able to heal, deliver, and cast out to start out with) willing to sacrifice himself for Others.

Your dictated verses of allah raising states nothing more than another accuracy which is unable to be proven or verified by your own obvservers of your faith in studies.

How many verses were re-written, when were they re-written and how were they re-written if there would not have been an outcry from both the Jewish People of that time, and the Followers
of Jesus Christ who saw this happen and were given the Great Commission to do the same and more abilities of the nature that JESUS CHRIST performed and Commanded them to display outwardly?

Where did you find this Verse Matthew 21:48, for I cannot find it anywhere in bible-hub, mine ends at 46. Or is it that you found an apocrapha version that has additional verses and books
which has been disapproved by the churches because of its inaccuracies and lies written inside of it that cannot be proven to be true or consistent and have been found in certain locations
but not everywhere proving it was added afterwards making it not the true verses?

I am firm that a real believer is someone who believes the ill are healed and demons are cast out in the name of JESUS because that is what the scriptures speak of first hand verbatim.

If JESUS was just a prophet, then the biggest discrepancies would be all the old and new testament being fulfilled about him, which they were. Or are you accusing the Old testament
Cultural traditions, which if you checked the comments about the traditions (or you do your own traditions about the transcribing of the old and new testaments and how or why the importance
was there later) maybe you'd better understand the reason for the faith itself and the confirmation of which is

If there is an excess and exaggeration, then one of two things must be true.



2. JESUS CHRIST was falsified, there's something mystical, magical, and mysterious about the name for Healing, Delivering, and Saving Human Kind today from spirits, demons, illnesses,
and comas and any ill health affect that your allah and prophets are unable to consistently reproduce and explain properly without giving dedictation to JESUS CHRIST as their LORD and
SAVIOR today themselves. Leading them to lie, accuse, falsify and kill to prevent the spread of such knowledge of that NAME JESUS CHRIST SAVIOR AND LORD SON OF GOD.

Which is it for you, Number 1 or Number 2?


Julia5678 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
67 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by waterscalming 2 years ago
Acts 2:1-47 ESV / 4 helpful votes

When the day of Pentecost arrived, they were all together in one place. And suddenly there came from heaven a sound like a mighty rushing wind, and it filled the entire house where they were sitting. And divided tongues as of fire appeared to them and rested on each one of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance. Now there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men from every nation under heaven. ...

John 4:24 ESV / 4 helpful votes

God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth."

Matthew 5:17-18 ESV / 4 helpful votes

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.

Acts 2:38 ESV / 3 helpful votes

And Peter said to them, "Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Isaiah 9:6 ESV / 2 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful

For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government shall be upon his shoulder, and his name shall be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
Posted by waterscalming 2 years ago
Revelation 13:1-18 ESV / 4 helpful votes

And I saw a beast rising out of the sea, with ten horns and seven heads, with ten diadems on its horns and blasphemous names on its heads. And the beast that I saw was like a leopard; its feet were like a bear's, and its mouth was like a lion's mouth. And to it the dragon gave his power and his throne and great authority. One of its heads seemed to have a mortal wound, but its mortal wound was healed, and the whole earth marveled as they followed the beast. And they worshiped the dragon, for he had given his authority to the beast, and they worshiped the beast, saying, "Who is like the beast, and who can fight against it?" And the beast was given a mouth uttering haughty and blasphemous words, and it was allowed to exercise authority for forty-two months. ...

1 Timothy 3:16 ESV / 4 helpful votes

Great indeed, we confess, is the mystery of godliness: He was manifested in the flesh, vindicated by the Spirit, seen by angels, proclaimed among the nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory.

1 Corinthians 6:20 ESV / 4 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful

For you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body.
Posted by waterscalming 2 years ago
Isaiah 1:1-31 ESV / 5 helpful votes

The vision of Isaiah the son of Amoz, which he saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem in the days of Uzziah, Jotham, Ahaz, and Hezekiah, kings of Judah. Hear, O heavens, and give ear, O earth; for the Lord has spoken: "Children have I reared and brought up, but they have rebelled against me. The ox knows its owner, and the donkey its master's crib, but Israel does not know, my people do not understand." Ah, sinful nation, a people laden with iniquity, offspring of evildoers, children who deal corruptly! They have forsaken the Lord, they have despised the Holy One of Israel, they are utterly estranged. Why will you still be struck down? Why will you continue to rebel? The whole head is sick, and the whole heart faint. ...

Psalm 119:105 ESV / 5 helpful votes

Your word is a lamp to my feet and a light to my path.

Genesis 3:1-24 ESV / 5 helpful votes

Now the serpent was more crafty than any other beast of the field that the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God actually say, "You shall not eat of any tree in the garden"?" And the woman said to the serpent, "We may eat of the fruit of the trees in the garden, but God said, "You shall not eat of the fruit of the tree that is in the midst of the garden, neither shall you touch it, lest you die."" But the serpent said to the woman, "You will not surely die. For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." ...

Genesis 2:17 ESV / 5 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful

But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die."
Posted by waterscalming 2 years ago
Ezekiel 44:1-31 ESV / 5 helpful votes

Then he brought me back to the outer gate of the sanctuary, which faces east. And it was shut. And the Lord said to me, "This gate shall remain shut; it shall not be opened, and no one shall enter by it, for the Lord, the God of Israel, has entered by it. Therefore it shall remain shut. Only the prince may sit in it to eat bread before the Lord. He shall enter by way of the vestibule of the gate, and shall go out by the same way." Then he brought me by way of the north gate to the front of the temple, and I looked, and behold, the glory of the Lord filled the temple of the Lord. And I fell on my face. And the Lord said to me, "Son of man, mark well, see with your eyes, and hear with your ears all that I shall tell you concerning all the statutes of the temple of the Lord and all its laws. And mark well the entrance to the temple and all the exits from the sanctuary. ...

Isaiah 28:1-29 ESV / 5 helpful votes

Ah, the proud crown of the drunkards of Ephraim, and the fading flower of its glorious beauty, which is on the head of the rich valley of those overcome with wine! Behold, the Lord has one who is mighty and strong; like a storm of hail, a destroying tempest, like a storm of mighty, overflowing waters, he casts down to the earth with his hand. The proud crown of the drunkards of Ephraim will be trodden underfoot; and the fading flower of its glorious beauty, which is on the head of the rich valley, will be like a first-ripe fig before the summer: when someone sees it, he swallows it as soon as it is in his hand. In that day the Lord of hosts will be a crown of glory, and a diadem of beauty, to the remnant of his people, ...
Posted by waterscalming 2 years ago
1 Corinthians 11:3 ESV / 5 helpful votes

But I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a wife is her husband, and the head of Christ is God.

Romans 8:1 ESV / 5 helpful votes

There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.

Romans 4:1-25 ESV / 5 helpful votes

What then shall we say was gained by Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh? For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? "Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness." Now to the one who works, his wages are not counted as a gift but as his due. And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness, ...

John 14:26 ESV / 5 helpful votes

But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.

Matthew 13:41-42 ESV / 5 helpful votes

The Son of Man will send his angels, and they will gather out of his kingdom all causes of sin and all law-breakers, and throw them into the fiery furnace. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Matthew 7:22 ESV / 5 helpful votes

On that day many will say to me, "Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?"

Matthew 5:28 ESV / 5 helpful votes

But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

Malachi 3:6 ESV / 5 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful

"For I the Lord do not change; therefore you, O children of Jacob, are not consumed.
Posted by waterscalming 2 years ago
1 Peter 3:18 ESV / 5 helpful votes

For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit,

Ephesians 2:8-9 ESV / 5 helpful votes

For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

Ephesians 1:13 ESV / 5 helpful votes

In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,

2 Corinthians 11:13 ESV / 5 helpful votes

For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ.

2 Corinthians 10:5 ESV / 5 helpful votes

We destroy arguments and every lofty opinion raised against the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ,

1 Corinthians 14:1-40 ESV / 5 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful

Pursue love, and earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, especially that you may prophesy. For one who speaks in a tongue speaks not to men but to God; for no one understands him, but he utters mysteries in the Spirit. On the other hand, the one who prophesies speaks to people for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation. The one who speaks in a tongue builds up himself, but the one who prophesies builds up the church. Now I want you all to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be built up. ...
Posted by waterscalming 2 years ago
Jeremiah 14:14 ESV / 6 helpful votes

And the Lord said to me: "The prophets are prophesying lies in my name. I did not send them, nor did I command them or speak to them. They are prophesying to you a lying vision, worthless divination, and the deceit of their own minds.

Revelation 20:13 ESV / 5 helpful votes

And the sea gave up the dead who were in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead who were in them, and they were judged, each one of them, according to what they had done.

Revelation 18:4 ESV / 5 helpful votes

Then I heard another voice from heaven saying, "Come out of her, my people, lest you take part in her sins, lest you share in her plagues;

Revelation 12:4 ESV / 5 helpful votes

His tail swept down a third of the stars of heaven and cast them to the earth. And the dragon stood before the woman who was about to give birth, so that when she bore her child he might devour it.

Revelation 5:9 ESV / 5 helpful votes

And they sang a new song, saying, "Worthy are you to take the scroll and to open its seals, for you were slain, and by your blood you ransomed people for God from every tribe and language and people and nation,

1 John 5:13 ESV / 5 helpful votes

I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.

1 John 5:7 ESV / 5 helpful votes

For there are three that testify:

2 Peter 1:21 ESV / 5 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful

For no prophecy was ever produced by the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.
Posted by waterscalming 2 years ago
Matthew 23:13-15 ESV / 6 helpful votes

"But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you shut the kingdom of heaven in people's faces. For you neither enter yourselves nor allow those who would enter to go in. Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you travel across sea and land to make a single proselyte, and when he becomes a proselyte, you make him twice as much a child of hell as yourselves.

Matthew 16:18 ESV / 6 helpful votes

And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Matthew 13:1-58 ESV / 6 helpful votes

That same day Jesus went out of the house and sat beside the sea. And great crowds gathered about him, so that he got into a boat and sat down. And the whole crowd stood on the beach. And he told them many things in parables, saying: "A sower went out to sow. And as he sowed, some seeds fell along the path, and the birds came and devoured them. Other seeds fell on rocky ground, where they did not have much soil, and immediately they sprang up, since they had no depth of soil, ...

Matthew 7:23 ESV / 6 helpful votes

And then will I declare to them, "I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness."

Matthew 7:15-20 ESV / 6 helpful votes

"Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? So, every healthy tree bears good fruit, but the diseased tree bears bad fruit. A healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a diseased tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. ...

Jeremiah 14:14 ESV / 6 helpful votes

And the Lord said to me: "The prophets are prophesying lies in my name. I did not send them, nor did I command them or speak to them. They are prophesying to you a lying vision, worthless divina
Posted by waterscalming 2 years ago
Galatians 5:1-26 ESV / 6 helpful votes

For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore, and do not submit again to a yoke of slavery. Look: I, Paul, say to you that if you accept circumcision, Christ will be of no advantage to you. I testify again to every man who accepts circumcision that he is obligated to keep the whole law. You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace. For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness. ...

Galatians 2:4 ESV / 6 helpful votes

Yet because of false brothers secretly brought in"who slipped in to spy out our freedom that we have in Christ Jesus, so that they might bring us into slavery"

2 Corinthians 6:17 ESV / 6 helpful votes

Therefore go out from their midst, and be separate from them, says the Lord, and touch no unclean thing; then I will welcome you,

1 Corinthians 15:47 ESV / 6 helpful votes

The first man was from the earth, a man of dust; the second man is from heaven.

Romans 6:9 ESV / 6 helpful votes

We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him.

Acts 20:29 ESV / 6 helpful votes

I know that after my departure fierce wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock;

John 1:1 ESV / 6 helpful votes

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by dsjpk5 2 years ago
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Total points awarded:10 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro ff a round so I award conduct to con.