The Instigator
Topher1989
Con (against)
Winning
7 Points
The Contender
Hurricane996
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points

Is the Christian God moral?

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Post Voting Period
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after 1 vote the winner is...
Topher1989
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/25/2015 Category: Religion
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 352 times Debate No: 80157
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (4)
Votes (1)

 

Topher1989

Con

The debate is on whether or not the Christian God is moral. I do not believe that the Christian God is moral. The first round is acceptance.
Hurricane996

Pro

I accept.
Debate Round No. 1
Topher1989

Con

First, I would like to thank you for accepting this debate and challenge.

I will judge the Christian God as a moral or immoral being based on whether his actions promote the well-being of humanity.

Here is a list of scriptural examples as evidence that the Christian God is not a moral being. A source will be provided.

1. God drowns the whole earth.
In Genesis 7:21-23, God drowns the entire population of the earth: men, women, children, fetuses, and perhaps unicorns. Only a single family survives. In Matthew 24:37-42, gentle Jesus approves of this genocide and plans to repeat it when he returns.
2. God kills half a million people.
In 2 Chronicles 13:15-18, God helps the men of Judah kill 500,000 of their fellow Israelites.
3. God slaughters all Egyptian firstborn.
In Exodus 12:29, God the baby-killer slaughters all Egyptian firstborn children and cattle because their king was stubborn.
4. God kills 14,000 people for complaining that God keeps killing them.
In Numbers 16:41-49, the Israelites complain that God is killing too many of them. So, God sends a plague that kills 14,000 more of them.
5. Genocide after genocide after genocide.
In Joshua 6:20-21, God helps the Israelites destroy Jericho, killing "men and women, young and old, cattle, sheep and donkeys." In Deuteronomy 2:32-35, God has the Israelites kill everyone in Heshbon, including children. In Deuteronomy 3:3-7, God has the Israelites do the same to the people of Bashan. In Numbers 31:7-18, the Israelites kill all the Midianites except for the virgins, whom they take as spoils of war. In 1 Samuel 15:1-9, God tells the Israelites to kill all the Amalekites " men, women, children, infants, and their cattle " for something the Amalekites" ancestors had done 400 years earlier.
6. God kills 50,000 people for curiosity.
In 1 Samuel 6:19, God kills 50,000 men for peeking into the ark of the covenant. (Newer cosmetic translations count only 70 deaths, but their text notes admit that the best and earliest manuscripts put the number at 50,070.)
7. 3,000 Israelites killed for inventing a god.
In Exodus 32, Moses has climbed Mount Sinai to get the Ten Commandments. The Israelites are bored, so they invent a golden calf god. Moses comes back and God commands him: "Each man strap a sword to his side. Go back and forth through the camp from one end to the other, each killing his brother and friend and neighbor." About 3,000 people died.
8. The Amorites destroyed by sword and by God"s rocks.
In Joshua 10:10-11, God helps the Israelites slaughter the Amorites by sword, then finishes them off with rocks from the sky.
9. God burns two cities to death.
In Genesis 19:24, God kills everyone in Sodom and Gomorrah with fire from the sky. Then God kills Lot"s wife for looking back at her burning home.
10. God has 42 children mauled by bears.
In 2 Kings 2:23-24, some kids tease the prophet Elisha, and God sends bears to dismember them. (Newer cosmetic translations say the bears "maul" the children, but the original Hebrew, baqa, means "to tear apart.")
11. A tribe slaughtered and their virgins raped for not showing up at roll call.
In Judges 21:1-23, a tribe of Israelites misses roll call, so the other Israelites kill them all except for the virgins, which they take for themselves. Still not happy, they hide in vineyards and pounce on dancing women from Shiloh to take them for themselves.
12. 3,000 crushed to death.
In Judges 16:27-30, God gives Samson strength to bring down a building to crush 3,000 members of a rival tribe.
13. A concubine raped and dismembered.
In Judges 19:22-29, a mob demands to rape a godly master"s guest. The master offers his daughter and a concubine to them instead. They take the concubine and gang-rape her all night. The master finds her on his doorstep in the morning, cuts her into 12 pieces, and ships the pieces around the country.
14. Child sacrifice.
In Judges 11:30-39, Jephthah burns his daughter alive as a sacrificial offering for God"s favor in killing the Ammonites.
15. God helps Samson kill 30 men because he lost a bet.
In Judges 14:11-19, Samson loses a bet for 30 sets of clothes. The spirit of God comes upon him and he kills 30 men to steal their clothes and pay off the debt.
16. God demands you kill your wife and children for worshiping other gods.
In Deuteronomy 13:6-10, God commands that you must kill your wife, children, brother, and friend if they worship other gods.
17. God incinerates 51 men to make a point.
In 2 Kings 1:9-10, Elijah gets God to burn 51 men with fire from heaven to prove he is God.
18. God kills a man for not impregnating his brother"s widow.
In Genesis 38:9-10, God kills a man for refusing to impregnate his brother"s widow.
19. God threatens forced cannibalism.
In Leviticus 26:27-29 and Jeremiah 19:9, God threatens to punish the Israelites by making them eat their own children.
20. The coming slaughter.
According to Revelation 9:7-19, God"s got more evil coming. God will make horse-like locusts with human heads and scorpion tails, who torture people for 5 months. Then some angels will kill a third of the earth"s population. If he came today, that would be 2 billion people.
http://commonsenseatheism.com......

Based on scripture, God is certainly immoral. These actions did not promote any well-being but brought death and suffering to many people. If these examples are not enough, the fundamental doctrines and beliefs of Christianity are just as appalling.

The atonement of Jesus Christ is a prime example. God required his son, Jesus Christ, to suffer and die as punishment for the sins of humanity, so that we may enter exaltation. Executing the innocent for the crimes of the guilty is wrong and is inexcusable. Many attest that Jesus paid the ultimate price for our sins. He somehow paid a debt we ourselves could not pay or were not allowed to pay. This is known as scapegoating. I attest that there is nothing redeemable about a scapegoat philosophy or theory. All ethics and morality must depend on personal responsibility and accountability.

The Christian God is unfair and an unjust God. According to Christian philosophy, eternity in hell is a fair punishment for sin no matter what that sin may be. Justice has to stop somewhere along the arrow of time in regards to whatever crime or sin that may be committed. Again, a God that would punish his children for eternity for sins or crimes is an immoral being and an unfair judge.

God's current behavior is inexcusable. Daily, children suffer and die as a result of starvation and other preventable ailments. If he is all-powerful and all knowing, he is responsible for the suffering and death of these children. But there"s more, not only are these children suffering and dying, the parents of these children also suffer and grieve as a result. God's plan is truly mysterious. Sam Harris stated, "God is either impotent or evil." I think he's evil.

The Christian God will eternally damn those that believe in other Gods. How can these people be responsible for their beliefs? Being born in a family and country that supports an Islamic faith or other is no fault of their own. And it's a fact, many people will not hear the good word. If it's not their fault, it is immoral to judge them based on their genealogy, origin, or missed opportunity. This doctrine is immoral and reprehensible.

I'm sure there are other examples proving that the Christian God is not moral, but I think these examples suffice. I fully agree with every adjective and description Richard Dawkins provides in his book The God Delusion. He said: "The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully."
http://commonsenseatheism.com......
Hurricane996

Pro

God does not like child sacrifice. Jepthah made a foolish vow
In revelation it states that people who haven't heard of god will have a chance to convert.
God thinks it's NOT a fair punishment for people to rot in hell, which is why Jesus exists: to save humanity.
Also, Jesus CHOSE to sacrifice himself for humanity because of love.
He's nothing worse than an 18th century parent.
Debate Round No. 2
Topher1989

Con

If god does not like child sacrifice, why did God allow Jepthah to fulfill his vow and conquer his enemy? And if that is case, please specify where, in the scriptures, god disavows child sacrifice.

You said:" In revelation it states that people who haven't heard of god will have a chance to convert." Please provide an exact scripture and explain. If that is the case, surely, those that commit serious sins of murder and adultery are to be eternally damned. Like I said before, a judge that eternally punishes for finite or temporal sins is immoral. A punishment has to end at some point along the arrow time.

You also said: "God thinks it's NOT a fair punishment for people to rot in hell, which is why Jesus exists: to save humanity." Why would God create a system that required Christ to suffer? Why can"t God simply forgive us? And you dodged my original dispute. If you don"t convert to Christianity and repent of your sins, you will rot in hell for eternity. Again, it is immoral to punish someone eternally for temporal or finite sins. A punishment has to end along the arrow of time for it to be considered just and moral punishment.

I don"t care if Jesus Christ chose to sacrifice himself. Essentially, God required a human sacrifice for the salvation of humanity. Without someone stepping up to the plate to be punished for our sins, we would all be damned. So someone had to do it.

Furthermore, I don"t think you addressed my original concerns thoroughly.
Hurricane996

Pro

Hurricane996 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by OnlineMissionary197 1 year ago
OnlineMissionary197
I'm gunna have to give Topher1989 a point for his evidence in round 2. Hurricane996, you need to give a better example of why God would do these terrible acts. Once again, you need to start your argument with, "What is moral?" And you also need to justify, why God did those acts of death upon mankind. What is morality? Why does God punish? Please research these topic and come up with a stronger refute.
Posted by MaxSterling 1 year ago
MaxSterling
That huge wall of text met with the simple reply "Nu uh"

CONSIDER YOURSELF DESTROYED, TOPHER, LOGIC
Posted by OnlineMissionary197 1 year ago
OnlineMissionary197
Well, someone decided to beat me to the punch of accepting. You both should start with the question, "What are Morals". You have to understand the basics to be able to get into detail. I will accompany you in this challenge. I am not here to just to diss anyone off, but to help give a better understanding of the issue. I may not have all the answers as I am a still growing person who is battling grades in his High School senior year, but I will stay on point and research the issue for you questions and conclusions. May you both have a good fight!
Posted by MizzEnigma 1 year ago
MizzEnigma
"God isn't bound by morals. He created morals and know what is right."

You're bound to get something like this in their answer or here in the comments lol.

Well, probably not now, but it usually happens.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by truthiskey 1 year ago
truthiskey
Topher1989Hurricane996Tied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: ff and pro didn't address con's args