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Is the Earth flat?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/31/2016 Category: Science
Updated: 8 months ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 540 times Debate No: 85827
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (5)
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If I am not mistaken, it is traditional for Pro to go first, so that is what shall happen.


Thanks con for the challenge, I hope both of us gain insight. I want to point out a few flaws with the heliocentric model of the universe, and also prove that the earth is flat.


If the sun were going over the curve of the earth during a sunset, (I know your model says the earth rotates, and the sun doesn't move, but in perspective, the sun goes over the curve of the earth at sunset) the properties of the spherical earth imply that from one standing at the top of the earth, the sun would be at approximately a 90" angle from the observer and the center of the earth to go out of site,(if the earth rotates 360° every day) meaning that the sun would be below the observer's feet some 4,000 miles. I've never had the impression that the sun is under my feet at sunset or sunrise, and in almost positive no one else has either,

furthermore, while observing sunsets the reflection from the Sun upon the ocean always forms a straight line between the sun and the observer. Never a curved line or partial line as a curved mirror would produce.
The sun, if it were 93 Brazilian miles away or whatever modern astronomers claim nowadays, would be casting only parallel or very near parallel rays of light, this is how errortosthenes figured out how the earth was a sphere, and measured it. However, if you've ever seen a cloudy sunset, been in a forest on a sunny day, or the like, you will notice they are not parallel, proving his method wrong, and the whole sphere idea with it.

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The Sun is eclipsed by the moon perfectly, but this is said to be because the sun is about 400 Times bigger than the moon, but 400 Times further away. Right. The odds? Next to impossible.

This video is shot from both a fish eye lens, which curves any line that is not centered, and a regular camera, which you can see, doesn't. It's important to see the difference because most high altitude launches use this lens. Such as this one.

Gofast rocket launch.

This is a video proving the earth is flat in two ways. First we take the camera they use and evaluate. You see the horizon's shape warping and rolling. This is due to the gopro's fish eye lens. The lens will bend any line not centered. When the horizon line is too high the earth will appear to be concave, convex if it is too low, perfectly flat when it is centered. Most videos from high altitude launches use this lens, and you can compare them to ones shot without the lens. The irrefutable proof though, is at the peak of the launch, when the rocket starts it's descent. We see a very far away, but familiar face. Now, with a little investigation, we can find out exactly where on the globe the moon is supposed to be. The time and date of the launch is listed in the description, we only have to enter it into this handy little website.

The go fast team is based in Nevada, and the launch is from this state's desert. How is the moon so high in the sky, when it is over Australia?
Debate Round No. 1


1: During sunsets, the sun is in fact below our feet (So to speak), however the air in the atmosphere "bends" the sun upwards, so when we look at the sun during sunset, it is actually below the horizon (Interestingly enough, the curvature due to the atmosphere causes a difference of about the same length as we perceive the sun), hence why the sun doesn't appear to be below our feet.

2: There are one of two reasons for this, it could be both, a mix or just one
One: You can only see roughly 20km into the horizon, provided you are on a hill, because of this short distance and the size of the Earth (And its curvature), you would be unlikely to see any noticeable bending on light reflection

Two: When you look at the suns reflection, you can always see the sun by looking in a straight line to it, this combined with how small the curvature is (Relative to us), makes it appear like the reflection is straight (When you look at satellite pictures of Earth and the Sun you can see some curvature).

3: Firstly, the Sun and the Moon rarely appear to be the same size, secondly it isn't known what the odds of this happening are because we haven't observed the moons of any Earth like planets

4: The "Timeanddate" website you sent me to is set for 2/4/2016, at the actual time of the launch, it is much closer to Nevada, hence why it can be seen in the video.


1. The Earth must be spherical in order for satellites to be capable of orbiting it, we know satellites are orbiting because of GPS is reliant on them, without satelittes, GPS would not be able to work.

2. During Lunar eclipses, the shadow on the Moon is round, indicating that this is due to the Sun being on the opposite side of Earth, casting its shadow on the moon.

3. When standing on a higher point, you can see further into the horizon, this is due to the nature of Earths curvature.

4. You can circle the entire Earth in a plane, there are plenty of people who have done this (Unless of course every single one of them is a liar, which I highly doubt) and none of them have gone off the edge of the planet yet


1. During sunset, if the sun were in fact below our feet, we would no be able to see it. As refraction does indeed bend light, it cannot bend the sun, it can only bend it's light, and if it indeed bends this light upward, this shows that we cannot see it if it were below our feet as the light would have to bend down to our eyes over the 90" angle, refraction has any where from 15" to 30", if it were bending up, it would be lost in space, almost reflecting it, as explained here. It is for this reason, I haven't ruled out a concave earth.

2. At 12 km there would be 90ft of curvature if the earth is spherical, this would definitely produce a noticeable curve in the water or mirror. Especially if you were on a hill. As shown in the bedford experiments, a boat 6 miles (9.7km) away would be over the curve of water (which is impossible anyway as the natural physics of water is to settle flat) over 24 feet. And no, refraction cannot be used to debunk this experiment because it can only be accounted for when the viewer and the object being viewed are in different mediums, like when you see a quarter in the pool from the outside of the pool, it is not where it appears, but when viewed underwater, or in the same medium, the coin can be located exactly.

Calculating curvature
If the earth is a globe, and is 25,000 English statute miles in circumference, the surface of all standing water must have a certain degree of convexity--every part must be an arc of a circle. From the summit of any such arc there will exist a curvature or declination of 8 inches in the first statute mile. In the second mile the fall will be 32 inches; in the third mile, 72 inches, or 6 feet, as shown in the following diagram:

Earth's rate of curvature
"Let the distance from T to figure 1 represent 1 mile, and the fall from 1 to A, 8 inches; then the fall from 2 to B will be 32 inches, and from 3 to C, 72 inches. In every mile after the first, the curvature downwards from the point T increases as the square of the distance multiplied by 8 inches. The rule, however, requires to be modified after the first thousand miles.
"The following table will show at a glance the amount of curvature, in round numbers, in different distances up to 100 miles.
Statute Miles Away Math = Drop
1 1 x 1 x 8 = 8 Inches
2 2 x 2 x 8 = 32 Inches
3 3 x 3 x 8 / 12 = 6 Feet
4 4 x 4 x 8 / 12 = 10 Feet
5 5 x 5 x 8 / 12 = 16 Feet
6 6 x 6 x 8 / 12 = 24 Feet
7 7 x 7 x 8 / 12 = 32 Feet
8 8 x 8 x 8 / 12 = 42 Feet
9 9 x 9 x 8 / 12 = 54 Feet
10 10 x 10 x 8 / 12 = 66 Feet
"To find the curvature in any number of miles not given in the table, simply square the number, multiply that by 8, and divide by 12. The quotient is the curvation required."

3. The sun May appear to be a bit larger at different distances from the viewer, but this is due to the glare, I will reinstate, as the moon goes perfectly in front of the sun, they are exactly the same size. Just because we haven't observed other moons orbiting other earth like planets, doesn't make this occurrence any less rare, as suns are rarely the same size, but the distance must remain consistent for possible life. (I do not believe other planets exist in this way, neither do I believe other planets in our solar system, the only ones we can prove exist, or as they have been called "wandering stars" in that they differ from other stars in their relative motion only, are physical places)
Distance to the sun: dropped

4. My mistake, the time and date is corrected, and the moon is very close to Australia, if it were visible at all, it would be setting, and closer to the horizon.

The GPS system was developed by the U.S. Department of Defense. All GPS systems around the earth are being ran by the U.S. Department of Defense. This means that they control all the visible data displayed on these devices. In other words, they remapped the entire earth in order to conform to the global model invented by them. No wonder that I"ve navigated with a GPS before displaying the data that I am somewhere that I clearly know I am not at.

Having said that, this is why there are no flights that go around the southern hemisphere, instead these flights are being re-routed via GPS giving the planes and ships the illusion of being in a place (that they are not at) but which conforms to the made up global map.

Lunar eclipses
There have been numerous reports that during several lunar eclipses, both the sun and moon are visible above the horizon, this would be impossible if the earth were exactly without a degree of error between the moon and sun. As they can both appear in the sky, it can logically deduced that the earth does not block the light of the sun on the moon. It also would not produce a blood moon or red shadow either.

If you stand at a higher point, you can see farther, this is due to the atmosphere, at lower altitude, the atmosphere is thicker, and visibility is lower, this in no way proves that the earth is spherical. Besides the fact that you can see over waves, considering you were looking over the ocean, and trees, hills, etc. on land. If you were looking over a curve, the trees, buildings etc. Would be leaning over away from the observer, furthermore, the same could be said about an extended plane.

The flat earth model is disc shaped with north being dead center of the disc, and the universe for that matter, going from this point in any direction will take you south, taking a left or right will take you east or west respectively. Taking the path of the sun moon and stars as shown here..

Debate Round No. 2


Axonly forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by Edlvsjd 8 months ago
Since you forgot about the debate you started about the shape of the earth.
Posted by Edlvsjd 8 months ago
You are welcome to refute any claims I made in the comments section.
Posted by Edlvsjd 8 months ago
Or you couldn't do anything with it
Posted by Axonly 8 months ago
Whoops, totally forget about this....
Posted by Edlvsjd 8 months ago
I try to only handle one debate at a time as I have started another one give me a day or two to accept
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