The Instigator
Smerdyakov
Pro (for)
The Contender
thelonelymoutain
Con (against)

Is the New Testament theologically immoral?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/8/2017 Category: Philosophy
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 490 times Debate No: 99721
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (8)
Votes (0)

 

Smerdyakov

Pro

Okay, I'm going to keep this short and sweet. If I had to write a book where I expose a unique hole in doctrine for each religion, Christianity would get the following: "Pathological inability to accept the adherent good nature of man and utter incapability of an idea that dictates love can only come from god to man and NOT vice versa. To sum it up, Christianity demonises human nature in its very foundations. It CAN'T accept the fact that not every human needs a higher power to be morally good." Or as Friedrich Nietzsche puts it:

"Christianity was from the beginning, essentially and fundamentally, life's nausea and disgust with life, merely concealed behind, masked by, dressed up as, faith in "another" or "better" life."

As an Agnostic and a humanist I adore almost every moral standpoint of Jesus of Nazareth. I have no intention to slander him personally (he truly was a great man), but I DO however seek to logically destroy the pathological ideology that has grown around him. Let's make a quick supposition:

There is a man that is "blessed". He can see angels in everyday life, he can interact with higher beings, see god on his throne (we'll take the christian theology for our matrix) etc. He KNOWS that christian faith is the one true faith. He can also see how Jesus Christ suffered for the sins of all men. Because he is good in his heart, he chooses not to cowardly burden Jesus (which he loves so dearly) with HIS sins. This is a sign of true morality and bravery, isn't it? When he dies, he is judged for all his sins he chose to bear himself by God the Father. Because of christian doctrine, NO ONE CAN GO TO HEAVEN WITHOUT CLEANING HIS SINS WITH CHRIST'S SACRIFICE (John 14:6). Well, theologically speaking, that means that the most loving and good man would be damned to hell by God the Father himself, only because his love was so great that he refused to torture his god (Jesus) with handing his sins to the suffering get in heaven. In other words, HE DELIBERATELY CHOSE HELL BECAUSE OF HIS LOVE FOR CHRIST. Such a person is deemed wicked and worthless in the christian retrospect. That is the great filth lying in christian theology. In certain aspects, it is even more horrifying than the gruesome violence of the Old testament.

And there is another catch. Such man's love WOULD CHOOSE to suffer in hell for eternity for Christ. I ask you honestly, dear opponent, IS THAT KIND OF LOVE GREATER THAN GOD'S? Not to just die, to suffer endlessly, what is greater than that. To abandon the hope of bliss to come, to envelop in darkness forever to comfort the loved one, what is greater than that?

As you can see, the New testament has a handful of holes. Even so, I have nothing against Christians that have enough morality to interpret (or ignore) the rather disgusting parts of their dogma and do good in the world.

I'm waiting for your response.
thelonelymoutain

Con

or religion is just a way for people to push their problems on I a atheist so I really don't believe in this crap mic drop
Debate Round No. 1
Smerdyakov

Pro

So why exactly did you assume the position of my opponent? I agree with you, though I am not an atheist rather an agnostic.
thelonelymoutain

Con

I got bored so I started this
Debate Round No. 2
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Debate Round No. 3
8 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 8 records.
Posted by canis 1 year ago
canis
What is moral / immoral can never be defined in finite terms..Its relative.
Posted by Fletch290 1 year ago
Fletch290
That is all I am going to say on that subject, as I do not want to hijack this comment section regarding eternal punishment any further.
Posted by Fletch290 1 year ago
Fletch290
@AmericanDeist

Well sir, that is an impressive resume, and you have probably studied the Bible more than I, but that doesn't mean you can simply waive off what the Bible says. The Bible (which I believe to be infallible) states that there is eternal life for those who believe in Jesus. And eternal punishment for those who do not. Matthew 25 deals with eternity almost entirely, especially 31-46. Here is verse 46
Matthew 25:46 "And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."

You can argue that the original texts may have been different than the ones we have today, (it is impossible to know for sure since the originals have not been found) but that is another argument for another time.
Posted by AmericanDeist 1 year ago
AmericanDeist
@Fletch290

I'm good. I graduated seminary with a Th.D. and serve as a chaplain for a P.D. I pretty much know the Bible backwards and forwards, to include the context of the Hebrew and Greek.
Posted by Fletch290 1 year ago
Fletch290
Deist* spell check got me
Posted by Fletch290 1 year ago
Fletch290
As for the American desire second point, here is a small peice of scripture for you read. Mark 9:42-50 If you wish for more, read Revelation.
Posted by Fletch290 1 year ago
Fletch290
Pro your entite argument is flawed because you do not understand the scripture, you claim that is out of love for Jesus that your metaphorical man does not burden Jesus with his sins. As if every time someone believed in Jesus their sins were thrown in Jesus's spiritual backpack for him to carry around. Christ died for all men and the sins of everyone has already been paid for.

1 John 2:2 "He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world" NIV
1 Timothy 4:10 "That is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe."

John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."

I am not arguing for universal salvation here, as it is clear that you will not be saved unless you believe in Jesus Christ as the son of God. But what I am arguing is that he already paid the price. It's as if you went to jail, and your parents/wife/etc paid your way out, but you thought you would show them love by finishing your sentence out, even though they paid. That is not love
Posted by AmericanDeist 1 year ago
AmericanDeist
I might accept, but I have to ask a couple of questions first:

1. Do you want to debate the NT in English with all of its bad translations and misrepresentations courtesy of the KJV, or in the original Koine Greek with the proper context?

2. What is this eternal torment in Hell you speak of? The Bible does not teach that.
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