The Instigator
baseballfan1
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
EvanK
Con (against)
Winning
7 Points

Is the change-up the most effective pitch in baseball

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
EvanK
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/18/2012 Category: Sports
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,765 times Debate No: 22970
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (3)
Votes (2)

 

baseballfan1

Pro

I feel that the most effective pitch in baseball is the change-up. When thrown correctly the change-up is the most effective pitch. It catches the batter off guard and has just enough movement to appear as a strike and then end up as a ball. Many pitcher make their career last longer when throwing this pitch. Johan Santana's career has been so great because he learned how to throw the pitch correctly and effectively. When a fast ball goes flying by the batter and the batter is expecting to have heat thrown at him, the change-up catches him off quard and throws him off. Making the change-up the most effective pitch in baseball.
EvanK

Con

While the change up can be effective, you have to have a good fastball for it to work. Far too many pitchers cannot execute your standard four seam fastball, rendering other pitches nearly useless. There is one pitch though, that is an exception, and that is the split finger fastball. It can go at various speeds, and it moves more than a change up. Imagine standing in the batters box, and you see what looks like a fastball, similar speeds and all, but all of a sudden it bottoms out. Swing and a miss. It has saved the careers of pitchers like Roger Clemens (despite PEDs), Bruce Sutter, and David Cone.

The change up is good, but without a good fastball, it is useless. A good splitter, on the other hand, can be throw almost exclusively, and still be very effective.
Debate Round No. 1
baseballfan1

Pro

baseballfan1 forfeited this round.
EvanK

Con

EvanK forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
baseballfan1

Pro

I missed the last round due to the fact that I was unable to login to Debate.org.
The Fastball, if effective, helps the change up work better. Yes i would agree to that statement. But have you've ever seen a fastball not work? A fastball, four seam/two seam, is a pitch thrown straight with little to no movement. A fastball is one of the only pitches that works consistently. The only variable is the speed.
A change-up moves more effectively than a splitter. If you are going to throw a splitter, why not just throw a curve ball? A change-up catches the batter off guard greater than a splitter due to the fact the change-up bottoms out and moves while decreasing in speed.
This makes the change-up the most effective pitch. Even if there is no fastball thrown, the change-up (with proper placement) can still be very effective towards getting outs by strike out or ground balls.
EvanK

Con

The Split finger fastball also moves, bottoms out, and decreases in speed, like a change up. The reason I choose a splitter over a changeup, or curveball, is that there isn't as much of a chance of hanging one. It is possible to hang one, yes, but pitchers are more likely to get burned hanging a changeup than a splitter.

It also has similar movements to a fastball, making it hard to discern between a fastball and a splitter. A changeup does the same, but I argue that splitters have more movement than a changeup.

This is why I say the splitter is the more effective pitch.
Debate Round No. 3
baseballfan1

Pro

baseballfan1 forfeited this round.
EvanK

Con

EvanK forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
baseballfan1

Pro

"The Split finger fastball also moves, bottoms out, and decreases in speed, like a change up. The reason I choose a splitter over a changeup, or curveball, is that there isn't as much of a chance of hanging one. It is possible to hang one, yes, but pitchers are more likely to get burned hanging a changeup than a splitter."

Wouldn't a high splitter be considered as hanging? You can hang any pitch. And you say how a change up is just like a splitter, yes it is. But while the splitter moves downward, the change up bottoms out and moves left or right and it drops. The change up is more effective than any other pitch when it comes to speed, movement, and catching the batter off guard.
EvanK

Con

You can hang any pitch, yes, but because a change up is so slow, it isn't effective without a good fastball. On the other hand, the splitter is such an effective pitch, it can be used on it's own. [1] Roger Clemens, for example, survived off this pitch for the later parts of his career. It is much easier to hang a change up, and because of it's speed, it can be very easy to hit, and hit far. If you miss your location with a splitter, it will usually go in the dirt, and if you do hang it, it is still faster than a change up. [1] Bruce Sutter is another pitcher who lived off of it. You don't hear too often about pitchers living off of their change up. It just isn't as effective without a fastball.

So, concluding this debate, I argue that the splitter is a much more effective pitch than a change up, because of it's similarities to a fastball. It can catch batters off guard when used with a fastball, or it can be used exclusively. A change up is just too slow and usually lacks movement when hung, and makes for a very hittable pitch.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org...
Debate Round No. 5
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by 16kadams 5 years ago
16kadams
XD use at least on source.
Posted by EvanK 5 years ago
EvanK
Wasn't planning on FF, just doing some things while writing out my argument. XD
Posted by 16kadams 5 years ago
16kadams
evan dont FF, finish strong
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by 16kadams 5 years ago
16kadams
baseballfan1EvanKTied
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Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: CONS last round was the winner (sources b/c he had one). PRO and CON had poor arguments until the end, CON used the same arguments but gave them a little more of a push. That sealed the deal, so really CONS last round was a winner. as simple as that. @con, if someone FF's first, DO NOT FF TOO, write "extend arguments", good way to get conduct points ;D
Vote Placed by 1dustpelt 5 years ago
1dustpelt
baseballfan1EvanKTied
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Total points awarded:02 
Reasons for voting decision: Con had a source