The Instigator
Karmarouge
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
MTGandP
Con (against)
Winning
14 Points

It is ok for men to marry multiple women. Women should only have 1 husband.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 3 votes the winner is...
MTGandP
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/18/2009 Category: Education
Updated: 7 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,295 times Debate No: 8333
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (0)
Votes (3)

 

Karmarouge

Pro

We are all animals. Throughout the animal kingdom, more often than not, we find males competing against one another for a group of females. The victor of this struggle takes all the females in the pride, school, ....etc.

If we are all part of the same animal kingdom then, it would seem ok if Men married as many women as they are able to win in through battles of testosterone.
What say you?
MTGandP

Con

I thank my opponent for starting this debate.

"Throughout the animal kingdom, more often than not, we find males competing against one another for a group of females."
"More often than not" is a key phrase here. Is this really true? Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. I don't know, because my opponent has not cited a source. This claim should not be accepted until a reliable source is provided.

"If we are all part of the same animal kingdom then, it would seem ok if Men married as many women as they are able to win in through battles of testosterone."
Since we're in the same animal kingdom as Black Widows, that makes it okay for women to eat their husbands[1]!

Simply because some other animal does it doesn't mean we should do it. Humans are very different from many animals.

***

Human mating rituals are not as applicable as they were twenty thousand years ago. Social evolutions have caused large changes in human mating habits. Our elaborate mating structures are much different from the ones of more primitive society. Because of this, my opponent's entire premise is flawed.

***

I will now provide my own contentions. I either have to prove that it is not okay for men to marry multiple women, or prove that it is okay for women to have more than one husband.

Marry: To engage in a lifelong commitment for purposes of mating.

Contention 1: Gender Equality
In today's society, men and women are much more equal than they used to be. Therefore, if men get certain marital rights, why should women not also receive these rights? There is no sound reason to restrict women that also does not restrict men.

Contention 2: Multiple Marriages Lead To Turmoil
If a man is allowed to marry multiple women, it is damaging to the lives of the women. To have this one man moving between them is harmful to each of their relationships with the man.

I may offer more contentions in the future. For now, I will leave it at these.

[1] http://www.pestproducts.com...
Debate Round No. 1
Karmarouge

Pro

More often than not.

It is true that this phrase leaves the door open for all sorts of abnormalities, however I will cast out the interpretation on the validity of this statement,toward the heavens and allow it to fall on to the domes of those who will vote on those things, I just hope more people agree with me, saves a bit of time. Sorry, I did believe in the system of citing a source; but I believe it is high time for more people to trust and believe in one another. There are some things that are so obscure that we need to cite the source, but in this case I think it would be a bit ridiculous and silly to pretend not to agree with my claim...."More often than not..."

"that makes it okay for women to eat their husbands"

This is okay with me and would and could possiblly be classified as an abnormality. In any case I would have no problem with this happening as long as we both agree on what it means "to be eaten".

"Simply because some other animal does it doesn't mean we should do it. Humans are very different from many animals."

We often cite the homosexual behaviors between dolphins to justify Human homosexuality so would this not fit within the ball park of that reasoning system?

"Human mating rituals are not as applicable as ......entire premise is flawed.

There is only one human mating ritual I know of this "tree" has hundreds maybe thousands of leaves. The flaw is my opponents perception of a leaf and not of the actual rooting system.

Marry: to combine, connect, or join so as to make more efficient, attractive, or profitable.

haveing more than one wife allows for lots of people doing lots of things all at once. Is'nt that close to our structure of labor. This efficincy could naturally turn into an attractive deal which would then become more profitable.

There can never be two Lion Kings, that is nature not me. However here is my perception of why this is so.

Men are by nature very protective, which is not to be confused with Mother Protection. This reqires a small explanation. Male type of proection is for either the individual or the group Mother protection is normally for her young ONLY. The male protection is constantly at guard over the home females are not expected to take this role. Men on the other hand are,"more likely than not" (me 2009) stronger than women and are better equiped to handle whatever the gaurd has to handle, better. This is also nature.
MTGandP

Con

"I think it would be a bit ridiculous and silly to pretend not to agree with my claim."
It depends on how you're counting. By phyla, most animals are hermaphrodites. Their competition structures are completely different. By species, because of insects you are correct.

"[For women to eat their husbands] is okay with me and would and could possiblly be classified as an abnormality."
So my opponent is saying that it is acceptable to commit murder? I fear I have misunderstood.

"We often cite the homosexual behaviors between dolphins to justify Human homosexuality so would this not fit within the ball park of that reasoning system?"
The logic in this quote is flawed for the same reason that my opponent's logic is flawed.

"There is only one human mating ritual I know of this "tree" has hundreds maybe thousands of leaves. The flaw is my opponents perception of a leaf and not of the actual rooting system."
This is a beautiful metaphor, but it doesn't actually prove anything.

"haveing more than one wife allows for lots of people doing lots of things all at once."
I see no reason why having multiple wives would increase productivity. Assuming it does for a minute, why would a woman having many husbands not also increase productivity?

"Men are by nature very protective"
Women are more protective. Women are the ones who take care of the children. They need to be protective. Men don't; traditionally, men are the ones who hunt and gather for food while women take care of and protect the children.

"Mother protection is normally for her young ONLY."
Protection for one's young spreads to protection for the community. And protection for one's young is much stronger than any other form of protection.

"The male protection is constantly at guard over the home females are not expected to take this role."
Tribal females are tough. They don't need protection.

***

Both my contentions stand unrefuted. My opponent has only tried to support his own case, which I have effectively attacked. In order to have a chance of winning, my opponent must attack my case.
Debate Round No. 2
Karmarouge

Pro

A wise man once said, "A great deal more is known than has been proved". That makes good sense.

Contention 1: Gender Equality
In today's society, men and women are much more equal than they used to be. Therefore, if men get certain marital rights, why should women not also receive these rights? There is no sound reason to restrict women that also does not restrict men.

Are men and women identically the same?
Of course not, there are certain things women can do that man can't and there are things men can do that women can't by our own essence we have been created with a set of restrictions and freedoms sometimes they don't match each other and a sometimes peculiar situation arises. However it is important to remember that we are all socialized to believe one thing and because a few people agree that restrictions have to be evenly spread does not make that person right. Perceived oppression creates panic, sometime we have to go through a process to understand which way is is forward and then try to become a plumb line.

My opponent seems a bit insensitive to alternative lifestyles.

Contention 2: Multiple Marriages Lead To Turmoil
If a man is allowed to marry multiple women, it is damaging to the lives of the women. To have this one man moving between them is harmful to each of their relationships with the man.

Show me the proof in this contention and I will argue against it. Contention one, although addressed once before, deserved a few words. Contention two ignores preference and seems to imply that all women are effected the same way, one in which the woman is left "damaged". This is a huge generalization.

Do you consider it murder when the widow kills the male?

Too many men in the room with only one woman creates war. multiple women and one man is less volital, as the man is able to share himself with the community and create a new tribe loyal to him, it is almost impossible for a woman to provide this function.
MTGandP

Con

My opponent has ignored my first contention. He has only argued that men and women are not equal, but has not properly applied this logic to the specific case of polygamy. He has effectively forfeited this point.

"My opponent seems a bit insensitive to alternative lifestyles."
I am not insensitive. I have no problem with alternative lifestyles in general; but I do have a problem with ones that are harmful.

Contention 2
"Show me the proof in this contention and I will argue against it."
There is no such thing as proof; I assume that my opponent means "evidence". For really good evidence, we'd need a study, and I do not thing there have been any studies on the relationship between marriage and turmoil. But I will provide some logic to support it.

In this day and age, when Sally is in love with Tom, she wants to spend her life with him. She wants them to form a deep relationship between herself and him. But when she finds out that Tom is seeing another woman, her deep sadness is only matched by her anger.

And this is exactly what happens when polygamy is in place. What is the difference between an affair and polygamy? Only that an affair is secretive. But how bad is a secret, really? Polygamy is the worst part of it.

Faithfulness is seen as a wonderful and respectable trait. But polygamy encourages a break of faithfulness by a man having multiple wives. Society cannot accept this.

"Do you consider it murder when the [black] widow kills the male?"
No. It's normal for their species. It is not murder. If this quote is my opponent's only attempt at a refutation to that point, then the point is conceded.

"Too many men in the room with only one woman creates war."
So does too many women with only one man. Look at the Iroquois: they were very warlike, and the women were in charge.

"the man is able to share himself with the community and create a new tribe loyal to him"
This is inappropriate for the reasons mentioned in my second contention.

***

My opponent has responded to my contentions, but has not responded to my rebuttals of his own points except for a single question. Consider his arguments conceded.

Since my opponent has conceded his points and I have adequately defended my own points, vote CON!
Debate Round No. 3
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Vote Placed by Lexicaholic 7 years ago
Lexicaholic
KarmarougeMTGandPTied
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Vote Placed by sherlockmethod 7 years ago
sherlockmethod
KarmarougeMTGandPTied
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Vote Placed by MTGandP 7 years ago
MTGandP
KarmarougeMTGandPTied
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