The Instigator
alex1994
Con (against)
Winning
6 Points
The Contender
Robikan
Pro (for)
Losing
3 Points

Its better not to live in the matrix

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Vote Here
Con Tied Pro
Who did you agree with before the debate?
Who did you agree with after the debate?
Who had better conduct?
Who had better spelling and grammar?
Who made more convincing arguments?
Who used the most reliable sources?
Reasons for your voting decision
1,000 Characters Remaining
The voting period for this debate does not end.
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/15/2011 Category: Philosophy
Updated: 6 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 2,907 times Debate No: 14790
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (9)
Votes (3)

 

alex1994

Con

Ignorance is bliss. What we do not know cannot hurt us. Living in an altered, dream-like world that is hiding us from the harmful truth can be benificial to us then suffering and living in reality. The matrix is a safe place for our mind and body to not be harmed by what the real world has to offer---danger and tradgedy.
Robikan

Pro

My opponent argues that it is better to live in a matrix than in the real world. Two main reasons are offered: first, that ignorance is bliss, and second, that the real world offers danger and tragedy.

This is an interesting debate, as it really seems to come down to one of the ultimate existential questions: what is the point of our lives? I believe that for my opponent to argue that ignorance is bliss, they must also take the position that the only point to life is enjoyment. My position is that the main point to our lives is to better ourselves as a species, and thus, ignorance is most detrimental.

Now, to directly respond to my opponent's arguments:

"Ignorance is bliss. What we do not know cannot hurt us."

Untrue. What we don't know can and does hurt us. If we do not know we have a disease, we cannot treat it. If we do not know how to properly use something, we may injure ourselves with it. Even within a matix, we still have physical bodies that can be harmed if we do not know what is going on with them. Furthermore, intentional ignorance prevents us from gaining knowledge, which is detrimental to our intellects and to our descendants.

"Living in an altered, dream-like world that is hiding us from the harmful truth can be benificial to us then suffering and living in reality."

Beneficial, how? One may have more general fun in the matrix, but one will not learn how to live in reality or grow as a species.
Debate Round No. 1
alex1994

Con

Living in an altered dream-like world is not only benifical for our safety and well being, but our intellectual knowledge as well. How does one no they have finished dreaming? When they have awoken of course. If one was to be living in a dream forever and potentially never have to wake up, then this "dream" would be no different then reality as we know.

How do we know we are not living in a dream right now? A matrix of our own? We don't. We cannot trust our senses for they have deceived us in the past. Living in the matrix would be no different then living in reality, plus it would be a reality of what we want and need. Instead of living in a reality where our lives are in danger and we could potentially be harmed by what to real world is offering, why not live in a reality of our own? A safer reality on that matter, one where we do not know the other side of things, one where we do not ever need care.
Robikan

Pro

My opponent has failed to answer or address any of my points, and has merely repeated what was said originally. Because of this, I will use this round to ask my opponent a few questions and reiterate my points.

1. What do you believe the point of life is?

2. Do you agree that tragedy and pain is necessary for our growth?

3. Do you agree that ignorance can be harmful?

My main point here is that we cannot grow or thrive, as individuals or as a species, if we avoid reality.

My second point is that, even in a matrix, we have physical bodies that have physical needs and do not currently have the technology to assume these needs could be met within a matrix.

I believe that avoiding reality and living in ignorance is a great detriment to ourselves as individuals and as a species.
Debate Round No. 2
alex1994

Con

I am responding to the point my opponent says about "The main purpose to our lives is to better ourselves as a species". First I would like to point out the purpose to our creation is a very subjective matter and to come up with the theory "We cannot grow or thrive, as individuals or as a species, if we avoid reality" is an illegitimate argument for you cannot speak for everyone on the controversial matter of the purpose of life.

For arguments sake, I'm going to say the purpose of life is too form a connection with your family and friends and maybe a divine power. If one were to live in the Matrix where they are to believe that all these important factors are occurring around them (e.g) God, family, personal relations, then I can argue the purpose of life in the Matrix is being fulfilled.

To the point where my opponent mentions that we have physical needs that may not be met in the Matrix, I would like you to elaborate on these needs.

Hygiene?
Relations?
Motor Skills?
Please elaborate.
Robikan

Pro

You're right, I cannot say for certain what each individual's life purpose is, but I believe it is safe to say that, as a species, we are constantly trying to better ourselves. By creating individual realities and avoiding our mutual reality, we will fail to evolve as a species.

As for physical needs, all of the above and more. Unless you are proposing some sort of matrix that we can physically enter, our bodies will still be in the "real" world. There is, at this point, no technological way to care for our physical needs in an exclusively mental reality.
Debate Round No. 3
9 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 9 records.
Posted by Robikan 6 years ago
Robikan
You did not address how ignorance is bliss, you did not address our physical requirements, you did not address how this would better us as a species. Really, your argument came down to "it's better because it's better". Perhaps others found that convincing, but I did not.
Posted by alex1994 6 years ago
alex1994
I clearly addressed 2 of your points maybe you should reread what I wrote because clearly people think my arguments are done well hence them voting for me
Posted by Robikan 6 years ago
Robikan
I'm not convinced that CON made an argument at all, actually. Their argument seemed to come down to "it's better because it's better", and "ignorance is bliss". I kind of expected to be offered some reasons *why* it's better, or why ignorance is bliss, despite my reasons to the contrary. I'm disappointed both with this debate, and with losing to someone who refused to answer any of my points.
Posted by Sniperjake1994 6 years ago
Sniperjake1994
challenge me to a debate of the same topic
Posted by FREEDO 6 years ago
FREEDO
I want to be Con. haha
Posted by davidhancock 6 years ago
davidhancock
i could debate you considering my matrix kritic hmmmmmm
Posted by alex1994 6 years ago
alex1994
to be clear, my arguements were pro living in the matrix so you're argueing its better to live in reality
Posted by alex1994 6 years ago
alex1994
oh oops i mixed up the positions yeah ill take that position
Posted by Robikan 6 years ago
Robikan
Just to be clear, you are taking the position that it *is* better to live in a matrix, right? If so, I will accept this debate.
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by maninorange 6 years ago
maninorange
alex1994RobikanTied
Agreed with before the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:03 
Vote Placed by BillBonJovi 6 years ago
BillBonJovi
alex1994RobikanTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: All I can say is I think Con made better convincing arguments
Vote Placed by Cliff.Stamp 6 years ago
Cliff.Stamp
alex1994RobikanTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: "Living in the matrix would be no different then living in reality, plus it would be a reality of what we want and need. Instead of living in a reality where our lives are in danger and we could potentially be harmed by what to real world is offering, why not live in a reality of our own?" - This was not refuted.