The Instigator
mostlogical
Pro (for)
The Contender
missbailey8
Con (against)

It's okay for women to be raped

Do you like this debate?NoYes+1
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Debate Round Forfeited
missbailey8 has forfeited round #3.
Our system has not yet updated this debate. Please check back in a few minutes for more options.
Time Remaining
00days00hours00minutes00seconds
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/26/2016 Category: Society
Updated: 4 days ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 207 times Debate No: 97369
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (4)
Votes (0)

 

mostlogical

Pro

I Pro will argue that it is okay for women to be raped by men

Con may use the first round to give arguments, all I ask is that the final conclusion round must not have any new sources, or any new arguments, and the last round i.e. round 4 must not quote the opponent

Also, no forfeits allowed. This is a serious debate, so accept if you have a serious argument

Thanks, and good luck Con!
missbailey8

Con

Framework

To set this up, I must first define what is morally good and what is morally bad. For this debate, good is a "benefit or advantage to someone or something" [1] and bad is "having a disastrous or detrimental effect, result, or tendency; unfavorable". [2] In short, if I can prove that rape has a damaging impact, I fulfill my part of the resolution.

(Note: because of the resolution, when it comes to the physical harm aspect, I will solely be discussing male-on-female rape. However, for the psychological harm, it will be universal. Nevertheless, I will use my last point to show the hypocrisy of the resolution itself.)

I. Physical Harm
II. Psychological Harm
III. The Resolution

Let us begin.

I. Physical Harm

First of all, rape (or "[Penetration] of the vagina or anus with any body part or object, or oral penetration by a sex organ of another person, without the consent of the victim", as defined by the FBI [3]) can cause anywhere from minor to immense physical harm, both short-term and long-term.

Not only can the rapist possibly hurt the victim if they were to be brandishing a weapon of some sort or with their own physical strength, but the act of forceful sex itself can cause urinary infections, uterine fibroids, unwanted pregnancy, and STDs. [4] Will these help the woman experiencing them? Absolutely not.

II. Psychological Harm

As one would expect, being raped can result in many emotional problems, including (but not limited to) posttraumatic stress disorder, nightmares, flashbacks, depression, substance abuse, eating disorders, dissociation identify disorder, difficulties trusting others, borderline personality disorder, and sleep disorders. [4] All of these can make life absolutely miserable.

Another common side effect is one that I wanted to address even further in terms of emotional harm because it might just be the most debilitating of all: self-blame. When raped, it is unfortunately very common for the victim to place the blame on themself for experiencing the abuse. This short of self-blame can lead to depression and in some cases, even suicide.

None of this can be seen as a benefit in the slightest.

III. The Resolution

The resolution of this debate states that "it is okay for women to be raped by men". However, I raise this question: why is it not okay for men to be raped if it is acceptable for women to be raped? Literally the only differences lie in anatomy. Rape is rape regardless of the sex of the victim or the offender. As such, the resolution has obvious flaws.

With this absurd logic proposed by my opponent, there are only two conclusions we can come to: a) "All rape regardless of sex is okay" or b) "All rape regardless of sex is bad".

Conclusion

In this round, I have proven that rape is wrong due to the physical and mental trauma that victims can experience, along with the flaws of the resolution set by my opponent. As such, I negate the resolution.

Thank you. I look forward to my opponent's arguments.

Citations
[1]http://tinyurl.com...
[2]http://www.dictionary.com...
[3]https://ucr.fbi.gov...
[4]http://www.healthyplace.com...
[5]http://tinyurl.com...
Debate Round No. 1
mostlogical

Pro

Con needlessly attempts to change the debate by defining what is morally good and bad instead of defining the word "okay". Allow me to define okay for you, the word okay if you do not know already simply means satisfactory, i.e. not especially good, nor bad. It is somewhere between good and bad. Simply put it is acceptable, or tolerable.

Con question's my logic before I have even begun, e.g. she says "this absurd logic proposed by my opponent". This makes me wonder whether she is just going to completely ignore reading my arguments when I post them, and I think there is a possibility Con will claim I have said things I haven't. However in the conclusion round this will backfire.

I accept Con's definition of rape, rape is sex without permission.

Con mistakenly believes that all she has to do to show that it's not okay to rape women and proceeds to state some negative aspects, however she has not challenged the good that can come from rape, or any of my arguments yet.

Let's look at Con's main arguments:

1. Physical harm - We both agree that rape is just sex without consent, so why does my opponent talk about illegal activities such as brandishing weapons, making threats, and physically hurting or assaulting women? Those are separate things.

Women expect men to kiss and touch them without asking if they can. It is no surprise that many women are sexually assaulted. However what is more surprising is the fact that the majority of women will say or do nothing when apparently they did not want the experience they got. See quote from source below. How can a man be expected to stop when he believes she is happy? And why would a man want to question her feelings and appear uninterested in her?

"The New Hampshire Coalition Against Sexual and Domestic Violence (NHCASDV) has cited a different statistic on freezing, saying that up to 50 percent of rape victims experience this type of paralysis. Other studies have shown that freezing is the response of 88 percent of rape victims. " [1]

Con's only real argument here is that forced sex can cause STD's. However, those problems are curable, and treatable. he also mentions unwanted pregnancy, ask yourself this; how many pregnancies are actually planned? You will find that 1 in 6 pregnancies among British women are planned [2]. There are probably more who don't wish to admit it. In America the figure is a whopping 40% [3]. This is a significant number of people, therefore unwanted pregnancy is quite normal and nothing to be ashamed of.

2. Psychological harm - I am guessing Con believes a rapist is entirely responsible for causing her list of psychological harms. However the list actually shows mental harm caused by a woman's own behavior which she can and should control. All a person can do is trigger a short term feeling e.g. happiness, but it is up to a woman to choose whether to be happy or sad etc. It is not possible to make a woman happy if she does not strive to be happy. Therefore it's easy to make a woman upset when she strives to be. But, who's fault is that? The answer is the woman's, obviously. Is it my fault I'm angry with other drivers on the road, or is it bad drivers? It would be my fault, I have a responsibility to control my behaviour, and goals, this is true for everyone. Nobody else is responsible for your behaviour!

3. the resolution - I am not going to share my thoughts on men being raped, that is not the debate!

I have read articles about women being raped and I do not care one bit. Why? Because I believe what happens to them is okay, e.g. there was a woman who went out to a place full of single men, late at night, on her own, dressed to attract males, didn't have any money for a bus home, expected strangers to pay for her so she doesn't get raped. She got raped. If she cared less about getting home for free and more about not getting raped she wouldn't have been raped. Many women accept drinks from complete strangers, despite alcohol being the most common date rape drug. What happens to them happens because of the choices they make, and the people they choose to associate with. Is it okay for women to kiss strangers, flirt with drunk men, and wake up in a hotel bed with no memory of who they slept with? Yes, that was the choice they made, I can't say it is a good choice, but it was their own decision, so it is okay.

"In the United States, the FBI Uniform Crime Report in 1996 and the United States Department of Justice in 1997 reported that 8% of the rape accusations had been through investigation determined to be false, a rate higher than that for any other indexed crime" - https://en.wikipedia.org...

The fact so many women falsely claim to be raped shows that rape isn't as serious to women as we are taught to believe, and you can actually find many feminists and anti-rape groups encourage rape e.g. by promoting anti-rape devices. If it was really that bad, they would encourage women to take responsibility e.g. say or do something, but of course the idea of taking responsibility is insulting to feminists.

Perhaps the best reason for why it is okay for women to be raped is it can produce another human being. Although the pregnancy may be unwanted the baby should always be wanted.

sources:

[1] http://www.fosters.com...
[2] https://wellcome.ac.uk...
[3] http://atlanta.cbslocal.com...
missbailey8

Con

My Opponent's Arguments

1. Women freeze when sexually assaulted.

My opponent argues that somewhere between 50-88% of rape victims freeze while being raped or assaulted. However, what he fails to realize is that this is part of a natural survival instinct present in other mammals known as fight-flight-freeze. While others may try to defend against their attacker or get out as quickly as possible, the more common reaction is to experience a sort of paralysis.

"'[F]reezing up' or 'numbing out'—in a word,dissociatingfrom the here and now—is about the only and (in various instances),bestthing you can do. Being physically, mentally, and emotionally immobilized by your consternation permits younotto feel the harrowing enormity of what’s happening to you, which in your hyperaroused state might threaten your very sanity. In such instances some of the chemicals (i.e., endorphins) you thereby secrete function as an analgesic, so the pain of any injury (to your body or psyche) is experienced with far less intensity." [1]

Even one of the sources my opponent cited stated something similar to this, [2] but he conveniently ignored that detail.

This attitude towards rape and sexual assault only perpetuates victim blaming. While the woman experiencing the assault might not have fought back, just stop and think: could she fight back? Did she really want this to happen to her? If cases of dissociation, the answer to both of those is obviously no.

Think about it this way: imagine that you were mugged and you didn't fight back because you were in paralysis. Would it be your fault? Did you want to get mugged? Absolutely not. Apply this same situation but to a rape victim and you will see an eerily similar story.

2. Women can control the physiological trauma of rape.

My opponent claims that the trauma of rape is "mental harm caused by a woman's own behavior which she can and control," but he never goes through my list to explain why. However, I will show why this isn't true when pertaining to the side effects of being raped.

Posttraumatic stress disorder - As the title suggests, posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD) is caused by an event that is seen as traumatic by a person either experiencing or witnessing it. These can include military combat, mugging, terrorist attacks, natural disasters, death of a family member, and of course, rape. [3] This isn't a condition which the victims can change, as the suggested causes of developing PTSD are as a survival mechanism to avoid experiencing another traumatic event which becomes unhelpful and hindering to daily life, abnormal adrenaline levels, and a hippocampus that becomes reduced in size after such event.

Nightmares, Flashbacks, and Sleep Disorders - I lumped these three together because they happen to commonly stem from PSTD as negative side effects. In nightmares and flashbacks, the victim is forced to relive the event (or in this case, rape) in vivid detail. One simply doesn't choose to have a flashback, either. It is commonly caused by PTSD triggers, which are sounds, places, people, behaviors, sights, and smells that make the repressed memories of an event flood back to them. [4] This can cause panic attacks or flashbacks.

Depression- Someone with depression doesn't just choose to be this way; they can't escape it. Depression is caused by "faulty mood regulation by the brain, genetic vulnerability, stressful life events, medications, and medical problems", [5] along with severe chemical imbalances. Again, one doesn't choose any of this.

Substance Abuse and Eating Disorders - Both of these are sadly common and inadequate methods of coping with the abuse. This can be prevented by seeking treatment, but due to fear of ridicule and self-blame, victims rarely do. All that can be solved here is limiting the stigma associated with rape victims so they can receive the proper help they need.

Difficulties trusting others - When your body is violated in the form of rape, it becomes increasingly difficult to trust other people, and with good reason. Like PTSD, it is a survival mechanism that becomes ineffective, as it interferes with your daily life. However, if they could, don't you think the rape victim would want to trust people again? Wouldn't they want to live a normal life again? Unfortunately, you can't just flip a switch and automatically trust again; it takes time.

Borderline Personality Disorder - Borderline Personality Disorder is yet another mental illness that can be caused by physical, verbal, or sexual abuse. [6] I have said it before and I will say it again, no one chooses to have a mental illness.

This is not the fault of the woman raped; it is the rapist's fault for doing this to her.

3. The woman is at fault for the choices she makes that lead to her getting raped.

My opponent argues that the choices women make lead to them being raped. Yes, in the scenario that my opponent presented, the woman made some irresponsible choices like accepting drinks and a ride home from strangers, but she didn't decided to be raped because of those choices. No one chooses to be raped. For example, with this same logic, if a wealthy old man who was home alone at night and left his door unlocked was robbed, it wouldn't be his fault.

Also, another flaw I found with this argument is that most rapists don't rape strangers, but people they know. In fact, 82% of rapes are committed by an acquaintance, relative, or friend, as opposed to the 18% committed by strangers. [7]

4. False rape accusationsshow that rape isn't as serious to women as we are taught to believe.

The fault I find with this argument is that it doesn't even prove a point as to why rape is okay, but just focuses on false rape accusations. Again, as the resolution states, my opponent is supposed to prove why rape is okay, so this argument is irrelevant and can be dropped entirely.

5. Women who are raped can produce another human being.

This is easily my opponent's most outrageous argument. He doesn't even give it any detail! Anyway, my opponent doesn't understand the harm of this. Not only is the woman raped, but she also has to carry her rapist's child, despite her unwillingness to have sex with him in the first place. This argument promotes the rapes of thousands of women each year because they have a potential to carry an unwanted child, and that might be the sickest part of all.

Conclusion

In this round, I refuted all of the arguments I could find that my opponent made. Thank you. Next round, I will address his various rebuttals against me. I look forward to it.

So long and goodnight.

Citations
[1]https://www.psychologytoday.com...
[2]http://www.fosters.com...
[3]http://www.nhs.uk...
[4]http://www.mentalhealthamerica.net...
[5]http://www.health.harvard.edu...
[6]http://www.borderlinepersonalitydisorder.com...
[7]http://www.911rape.org...
Debate Round No. 2
mostlogical

Pro

The freeze response is a last ditch effort to save ones self when it is not possible to fight or flight, there are some predators who ignore prey that do not move due to a fear of contracting a disease [1]. However Con tries to say that freezing helps a woman in some way and that they cannot fight back or run away. She says doing nothing helps preserve a rape victims sanity but honestly how on God's Green Earth can letting someone rape you be better for you mentally or physically than fighting back or making it very clear you want them to stop what they are doing? It makes no sense at all to allow someone to rape you and say afterwards you didn't like it, unless of course that is what you wanted to happen because you hate men so much or whatever reason. Feminists deny all responsibility for their actions, they are not interested in stopping rape, they actually want to be raped or want other women to be raped [2] because they hate men, and all they want to do is express hate. If women show that they want to be raped then it is okay to satisfy their wishes regardless of what they say, men have to listen and act on women's feelings e.g. they have to kiss a woman without asking her so the mood isn't spoilt, and just because she says no or she has a boyfriend it doesn't mean she's telling the truth. Women have to make their feelings clear, it's not a man's fault if they don't do that. Women who abuse their power should expect consequences.

Anyone can fight back, a tiny wasp can fight back and stop a person from causing harm. There is no excuse.

Con uses a statistic to make rape victims appear more responsible than they are, she doesn't account for the fact that most rape victims are children who are likely to know their rapist. Also, knowing your rapist doesn't necessarily make you any more responsible. The example I showed was just a typical example of why women are raped. If women sought to achieve a high goal and had their priorities straight then it is clear there is no reason to rape women, they'd be respected and treated well.

The number of rape accusations are extremely high, especially considering it is only men who can rape, it is clear that women do not really care about being raped (so they don't mind being raped) nor do they care about the affect on men, see link below for 12 reasons women lie:

http://thoughtcatalog.com...

Children are abused because the parents didn't want children, they want to have sex with strangers for the rest of their life or some other low goal. No child should be unwanted. Every woman should have a high goal and thus want children, and a father for their child. There are many women who do not know the father of their child despite not being raped, so it is much the same if women do not know their rapist. There are some instances where they know the father because he is a relative, but knowing who the father is is much better than not knowing. So it's not as bad to be raped than what women get by choice which includes sexual diseases which I've said before are curable and treatable.

Mental illnesses are also treatable, but having the right attitude in the first place prevents them.

sources:

[1] http://www.myshrink.com...
[2] http://mattforney.com...
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 3
This round has not been posted yet.
This round has not been posted yet.
Debate Round No. 4
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by mostlogical 1 day ago
mostlogical
Looks like I have won this debate as Con has forfeited
Posted by missbailey8 1 week ago
missbailey8
@GrimlyF, I addressed this point similarly in my argument about the resolution in round one.
Posted by GrimlyF 1 week ago
GrimlyF
Con and Pro.Why is this debate solely about raping women?.Are you both unaware that,including official prison data, more men are raped in the U.S.A. every year than women?.
Posted by Plato85 1 week ago
Plato85
Geez. Next you'll argue that we should set up a world wide caliphate.
This debate has 2 more rounds before the voting begins. If you want to receive email updates for this debate, click the Add to My Favorites link at the top of the page.