The Instigator
pierson73
Pro (for)
Losing
2 Points
The Contender
Peili
Con (against)
Winning
4 Points

Jesus wasn't a sacrifice for our sins.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
Peili
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/7/2014 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 676 times Debate No: 62806
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (1)
Votes (1)

 

pierson73

Pro

I am arguing the statement Jesus wasn't in any form a sacrifice, so therefore he never could have died for our sins in the first place.
Rules:
1. No trolling.
2.Round 1: is acceptance
3. Last round: no rebuttals and closing statements (No new arguments.)
Peili

Con

I accept and I will argue that, from a Christian perspective, Jesus was a sacrifice for our sins.
Debate Round No. 1
pierson73

Pro

I don't like having a very complex, elaborate, or long argument for the second round for the sole reason that people don't respond.

http://dictionary.reference.com...
1. The offering of animal, plant, or human life or of some material possession to a deity, as in propitiation or homage.
http://www.merriam-webster.com...
2.: an act of killing a person or animal in a religious ceremony as an offering to please a god

|Jesus (the son of god) supposedly died for sins committed by man so god would be able to forgive mankind for the atrocities they have done.| < Can the Con agree on this?

Jesus being sacrificed isn't even consistent to the term sacrifice. The people who killed Jesus clearly didn't intend for him to be a sacrifice ( this is very clear....) . Instead Jesus himself had to supposedly do it himself. If man willing gave up Jesus's life so god could forgive mankind then that would have at least some consistent logic ,this is still somewhat inconsistent too because why would some innocent person be held accountable for a guilty mans deeds?. But this is how it went down: Romans who weren't even christian arrested, tried, sentenced, and killed Jesus in one of the most painfullest ways possible
Crucifixion.

But then lets say Jesus was someway magically a sacrifice. Then it would still be the most illogical thing ever. Jesus or God sacrifices himself, to God (himself), in order to forgive mankind and protect it from God (himself). God is said to be all powerful but how can he not just forgive man for what he has done instead of have a innocent person die for mankind's actions. THIS DOESN'T MAKE any sort of sense. God is also omniscient ( all-knowing) so God should know man was built to sin and he should of fixed it on the spot.......
Peili

Con

The first definition Pro provided for sacrifice is: The offering of animal, plant, or human life or of some material possession to a deity, as in propitiation or homage. Notice that this definition explicitly includes offering a human life, and there is no mention of who does the offering. There is nothing in this definition which suggests that someone else must offer my life for me to be a sacrifice. According to the definition of sacrifice Pro provided there is no reason say that I could no offer my own life in self-sacrifice.

Then Pro openly admits that "Jesus himself had to supposedly do it himself." Pro has first established the definition of sacrifice, and then told us how Jesus sacrificed himself. By Pro"s own admission Jesus was a sacrifice.

Now, to address some of the other points Pro made.

Pro says it is "somewhat inconsistent" that an innocent person would sacrifice for a guilty person. However, there is nothing inconsistent about the idea. For instance, imagine that my friend hits a baseball through his neighbor's window, but he does not have the money to replace the window. I could pay for the damages. I could sacrifice my money to pay for what my friend has done. Obviously the cost of a life is a more extreme example, but it follows the same principle. We owed a debt we could not pay, so Jesus sacrificed himself for our debt.

In his second paragraph, Pro seems to move away from the topic of this debate, but I will address what he wrote. A perfectly just God cannot simply ignore sin. That would be a crime against justice. To ignore sin would not be an issue of power. To ignore sin would a violation of God"s nature, a self-contradiction, and that is something God cannot do. Justice must be satisfied. So to satisfy justice God took the punishment on Himself. He came to earth as a man, lived a life that in no way deserved death, and sacrificed his life to satisfy justice and provide mercy for us.

People are not built to sin. We are built to have moral freedom - the freedom to choose between good and evil. God cannot "fix" free will. He can remove free will - make it so that we cannot choose between good and evil - or He can deal with the results of poorly used free will. However, it is logically impossible for us to be both "free" and "not free" at the same time. Either we have moral freedom, which comes with the risk of doing evil, or we do not.

Finally, I would like to point out that the Bible repeatedly says that Jesus is a sacrifice for our sins.

Hebrews 7:27: Unlike the other high priests, he (Jesus) does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself.

Hebrews 9:26: But now he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself.

Matthew 20:28: The Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.

John 10:15: The Father knows me and I know the Father-- and I lay down my life for the sheep.
Debate Round No. 2
pierson73

Pro

pierson73 forfeited this round.
Peili

Con

Pro forfeited.
Debate Round No. 3
pierson73

Pro

pierson73 forfeited this round.
Peili

Con

Sigh. Pro forfeited again.
Debate Round No. 4
pierson73

Pro

pierson73 forfeited this round.
Peili

Con

Vote Con.
Debate Round No. 5
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by GoOrDin 2 years ago
GoOrDin
Con wins. Pro doesn't even know who Jesus is.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by lannan13 2 years ago
lannan13
pierson73PeiliTied
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Total points awarded:24 
Reasons for voting decision: Forfeiture