The Instigator
PalinFan
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
FREEDO
Con (against)
Winning
69 Points

Liberal Movements Have Historically Been Vicious in Nature

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 11 votes the winner is...
FREEDO
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/21/2010 Category: Society
Updated: 6 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 3,309 times Debate No: 12589
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (23)
Votes (11)

 

PalinFan

Pro

I move to affirm the resolution that Liberal movements have historically been vicious in nature.

Definitions:

Liberal - someone who falls to the left in a political system, who believes in government programs (health care is a good example, as is welfare) and a larger scope of government, also favors monitoring of business.

Viciousness - The desire to cause harm to others; extreme cruelty

-----------------------------------------

As one will find that every movement that the liberals have been a part of historically has been vicious in nature.

During the Civil rights movement violent protests broke out all over the country in cities like Chicago, D.C. and Detroit; cars were burned and people died[1].

During the 2000 elections Liberal radicals were angered by the Florida recount and not only exposed themselves to small school children, but took elderly citizens hostage and demanded that Gore be declared the winner, or they would kill the senior citizens.[2]

A similar incident took place during 2008 election, where a man violently attacked a McCain supporter carving an B into her cheek.[3]

In closing these all evidence of how liberal movements have been historically vicious.

Thank You, and God Bless America
--------------------------------------------
Sources:

[1]http://www.thedctraveler.com...
[2]http://www.us-japan.org...
[3]http://www.telegraph.co.uk...
FREEDO

Con

=== DEFINITIONS ===

First off I do not think PRO has an entirely accurate definition of Liberal and has provided no source for the definition like what is proper.

So I will present the actual definition with a reliable source and ask that my opponent please concede to this.
Note that I am not pulling semantical trickery here, it is perfectly reasonable.

Liberal: (ADJECTIVE)
.Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry.
.Favoring proposals for reform, open to new ideas for progress, and tolerant of the ideas and behavior of others; broad-minded.
.Of, relating to, or characteristic of liberalism.
.Of, designating, or characteristic of a political party founded on or associated with principles of social and political .liberalism, especially in Great Britain, Canada, and the United States.
(NOUN)
.A person with liberal ideas or opinions.
.A member of a Liberal political party.
[1]

This is definition is further supported by the fact that there are many liberals, including myself, you do not favor big government as my opponent tried to claim.

I find his definition of vicious to be accurate.

Also, to avoid semantical shenanigans and to make the resolution more clear:
To say that Liberals have historically been vicious is making the presumed implication that they have been MOSTLY viscous as a combination of all points in history, not to say having been vicious at any individual point in history.

=== RESPONSES ===

"As one will find that every movement that the liberals have been a part of historically has been vicious in nature."

>> I'm sure Gandhi and MLK jr. would 100% agree. (sarcasm)

"During the Civil rights movement violent protests broke out all over the country in cities like Chicago, D.C. and Detroit; cars were burned and people died[1]."

>> This is correct.

"During the 2000 elections Liberal radicals were angered by the Florida recount and not only exposed themselves to small school children, but took elderly citizens hostage and demanded that Gore be declared the winner, or they would kill the senior citizens.[2]"

>> The link for the source of your information was broken so this contention currently stands void of meaning until a reliable source is provided that confirms it.

"A similar incident took place during 2008 election, where a man violently attacked a McCain supporter carving an B into her cheek.[3]"

>> This act was later proven to be a hoax. [2] That article you linked to should be taken down or edited.

"Thank You, and God Bless America"

>> Thank you as well. HAIL GLORIOUS SATAN!

=== ARGUMENT ===

When we look back on history over the many liberal movements we see in overall conjunction the exact opposite of what my opponent claims. The goal of the liberal has nearly always been the abolition of vicious acts on the part of conservatives and usually by peaceful means.

It has been the pursuit of freedom, equality and justice.

Lets take a look at America, it started with anti-monarchism(Liberal), then slavery abolitionism(Liberal), women's suffrage and gender equality(Liberal), anti-segregation and race equality(Liberal), workers rights(Liberal), peace movements(Liberal), now the Liberals are still pursuing all these things along many more such as homosexual equality and loads of individual rights. The Liberals have always been on the more humane said of history.

Freedom and equality, this is what we have pursued and what we have accomplished far more than any viciousness we have inflicted.

Take a look at the amazing non-violent civil-disobedience movement that happened in India with Gandhi. That then inspired MLK Jr. to have his non-violent civil-disobedience movement in America. This utterly changed the world and made it a much happier place. In-case you didn't know, Gandhi and MLK Jr. weren't JUST Liberals, they were SOCIALISTS[3,4] . Another Socialist by the name of Albert Einstein once wrote a paper titled "Why Socialism" in which he described Capitalism as the "predatory phase" of human society.[5]

===SOURCES===
1. http://education.yahoo.com...
2. http://en.wikipedia.org...
3. http://en.wikipedia.org....
4. http://en.wikipedia.org...
5. http://www.huppi.com...
Debate Round No. 1
PalinFan

Pro

Counter Arguments:
"Lets take a look at America, it started with anti-monarchism(Liberal), then slavery abolitionism(Liberal), women's suffrage and gender equality(Liberal), anti-segregation and race equality(Liberal), workers rights(Liberal), peace movements(Liberal), now the Liberals are still pursuing all these things along many more such as homosexual equality and loads of individual rights. The Liberals have always been on the more humane said of history."

>>The road to hell is full of good intentions, it is a fact that all the above listed movements led to the economic downturn of 2007, and as such can be considered vicious.

"The link for the source of your information was broken so this contention currently stands void of meaning until a reliable source is provided that confirms it."

>> All this proves is that my opponent has little to no sensory-motor skills, since he cannot see the highly detailed article on this incident he simply believes it never happened.

--------------
Arguments:

In the last round my opponent made an attempt to unfairly slander conservatives, painting them as oppressors, while he did little to prove that liberal movements have not been vicious. I would a this point like to remind him that he has the Burden of Proof in this debate.

Thank you
FREEDO

Con

I should consider instigating a debate on the assertion that PalinFan isn't really a Palin fan and is trolling the website to make fun of conservatives by pretending to be one that uses obvious logical blunders. I call a breach in conduct.

Nonetheless, I must continue this debate to sustain any dignity it still may contain.

=== RESPONSES ===

"The road to hell is full of good intentions, it is a fact that all the above listed movements led to the economic downturn of 2007, and as such can be considered vicious."

>> Proof sir, or no go.

"All this proves is that my opponent has little to no sensory-motor skills, since he cannot see the highly detailed article on this incident he simply believes it never happened."

>> Still waiting for a working link.

"In the last round my opponent made an attempt to unfairly slander conservatives, painting them as oppressors, while he did little to prove that liberal movements have not been vicious."

>> I showed evidence in support of my supposed "slander". I effectively countered my opponent's evidence for his claims and he has not addressed these. Quite an assured sign of defeat. So with evidence on my side and none on his, who is making the real slander here?

"I would a this point like to remind him that he has the Burden of Proof in this debate."

>> You're not fooling anyone. You have a heavy burden of proof in this debate far out weighing mine. Not only are you the Instigator but the title of the debate is a positive assertion and you are PRO, which means you are making it.

"Thank you"

>> You're welcome.
Debate Round No. 2
PalinFan

Pro

YOU WANTED PROOF?

here is your proof: http://cache2.asset-cache.net...

YOU HAVE THE BURDEN OF PROVE MY LIBERAL FRIEND!

And here is the proof about the economy:
FREEDO

Con

Another broken link and video that in no way confirms your allegation that the movements for gender, race and homosexual equality, as well as worker-rights and peace movements lead to the economic down-fall.

VOTE CON
Debate Round No. 3
23 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by lovelife 6 years ago
lovelife
Lol that 69 will be there forever.
Posted by lovelife 6 years ago
lovelife
What is the liberal correlation? I'm assuming non religious people tend to be smarter, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
Posted by FREEDO 6 years ago
FREEDO
Wow, this is my most landslide victory I've ever had.
Posted by FREEDO 6 years ago
FREEDO
There's actually a clear association between IQ scores and being Liberal. And an even more striking correlation between IQ and being nonreligious.
Posted by lovelife 6 years ago
lovelife
" I know many intelligent conservatives. I have, unfortunately, not seen the same amount of intelligence on the left, I'm afraid."

I think almost everyone on here is pretty liberal, and most members are pretty intelligent. Neither of those include everyone of course but its safe to say if you've seen most people on here you've seen some smart liberals.
Posted by Nick11 6 years ago
Nick11
This was a joke, right?

I don't think any explanation is necessary as to why I voted Con on all counts.
Posted by Spaztoid 6 years ago
Spaztoid
DylanAdale:

I think it's fair to say that PalinFan is not a representative of conservatives. However I think PalinFan's views are in line with conservative views. While saying that the death penalty is "FRIKEN AWESOME!" is not representative of the intellectual level of the majority of conservatives in the US, supporting the death penalty is representative of conservative ideals. I do think that it's odd that you state that you do not know any liberals of comparable intelligence to many conservatives that you know. Either you know few liberals, or you are insulting the liberal community as a whole.
Posted by DylanAsdale 6 years ago
DylanAsdale
Might I add, however, that I do not believe that "PalinFan" is an actual representation of Conservatives as a whole. With such immature statements as, "[Death Penalty]: 'Its FRICKEN AWESOME!'" and "[Environmental Protection]: 'I ain't no damn hippie!'", I believe it would be fair to say that PalinFan is simply a detractor of conservatives, attempting to make them look ignorant. As a conservative myself, I know many intelligent conservatives. I have, unfortunately, not seen the same amount of intelligence on the left, I'm afraid.
Posted by DylanAsdale 6 years ago
DylanAsdale
How my views match up with the participants:

[[ FREEDO ]]:
Agree: 33.33% (1/3)
Disagree: 66.67% (2/3)

[[ PalinFan ]]:
Agree: 83.33%
Disagree: 16.67%
Posted by DylanAsdale 6 years ago
DylanAsdale
I'd like to point out "an B", as well as the fact that Pro is attempting to use incredibly few examples to prove a sweeping statement meant to broadly encompass all of history.
11 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Vote Placed by Comrade_Ulyanov 6 years ago
Comrade_Ulyanov
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