The Instigator
th3pr3tz3l
Pro (for)
Winning
9 Points
The Contender
WarMonger
Con (against)
Losing
6 Points

Marijuana:Illegilization was Unjust, and it should be Legalized Now

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 8/12/2008 Category: Society
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 3,060 times Debate No: 4986
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (6)
Votes (5)

 

th3pr3tz3l

Pro

As Pro, I will be arguing that Marijuana was unjustly Illegalized, and it should be Legalized Now. Please vote on the debate, not your own opinion. Please Note, this is not just about Legilization in America.

In my opening statement I will argue specifically about the illegilization of Marijuana. As I am sure in my opponents first statement he will move the topic directly to legilization now.

Now let's look at the events of Marijuana's illegilization, and its past.

- The El Paso Ordinance of 1914 was the first law against Cannabis passed in the United States, its primarily purposed was to control the Mexican minority in the area. Similar laws were passed elsewhere to control the marijuana smoking African American minorities in the south.

- During the prohibition the Treasury Department of United States established the Federal Bureau of Narcotics (FBN) to fight the war on drugs and alcohol (Grass). Soon after in the 1930s two major innovations in paper making was discovered coincidentally around the same time, the first was a newly developed machine that collected the fibers and pulps from hemp more efficiently when ever before. The second advance was DuPont´┐Ż??s patented sulfate/sulfite process for making paper from wood pulp.

- The newly developed paper making process using hemp was much more efficient and cheaper than making paper out of wood pulp; this posed an enormous threat to Du Pont and its financial backers. During this period of time Mellon Bank of Pittsburg, Pennsylvania owned by Andrew Mellon was Du Pontas chief financial backer.

- In 1931, Mellon, in his role as Hoover's Secretary of the Treasury, appointed his future nephew-in-law, Harry J. Anslinger, to be head of the newly reorganized Federal Bureau of Narcotics and Dangerous Drugs (FBNDD), a post he held for the next 31 years(The Emperor Wears No Clothes Ch4).

- Determined to criminalize Cannabis, Anslinger directed the all of the focus of the FBNDD towards marijuana; he then used the same scare tactics that the Christians used in the Inquisition. Anslinger launched a nationwide media campaign against marijuana. This campaign included radiobroadcasts, television commercials and various other media outlets; the Federal Bureau of Narcotics claimed that marijuana caused murder, insanity and death (Grass). All of these claims were not back by any scientific research or evidence.

- The FBNDD also related marijuana with dangerous drugs such as heroine and opium, instilling even more fear of the plant on Americans.

-Although in the 1930s only approximately sixty thousand Americans used marijuana, almost all other Americans knew of the marijuana due to Anslingers media campaign. Harry Anslingers propaganda succeed beyond his wildest dreams, Americans now fear the plant so much they demanded stricter laws against marijuana from the government.

-Without any public debate, scientific inquiry or political objection, the Marijuana Tax Act was signed into law by President Roosevelt in 1937 (The History of Marijuana).

-The Marijuana Tax Act required anyone in possession of marijuana to have a tax stamp from the Treasury Department and none was ever produced successfully making Cannabis illegal.

- Countless countries around the global have started to decriminalize Cannabis, their economies are flourishing due to the production of hemp and its products, many of their citizens enjoy the medicinal benefits of this plant. The countries that have legalized Cannabis saw the old laws against the plant unjust and since its legalization these nations experiencing exceptional growth in all areas of society directly due to Cannabis (The Magic Weed).

-Even though America imports copious amounts of hemp annually, she produces none of it herself; this nation pays handsomely to import plant products that can easily be grown and made in the United States. It is the beginning of a new millennium and there has never been a better time to put the arbitrary prejudices and fears past us. Knowledge of the Cannabis and its benefits are now widespread thanks to technological advances such as the internet and the truth about the prohibition of Cannabis is now gaining light.

-If Americans fail to extinguish these fears and start using Cannabis to all of its advantages. Then America herself will be in danger of falling behind in the Cannabis revolution of the new millennia.

I await an opponent, and I await his arguments about health affects, and how decriminilization will cause an increase in crime rates. Wich I will easily refute.

But if you've got an argument other than the two I just stated, I await the challenge of disassembling it. You can use those two points, if you want, but know I already have my argument against them planned out. :)
WarMonger

Con

Alright, lets start this.
- You started off with the history of prohibition on marijuana and and make it clear that the illegalization was unjust at the time, but make no arguement in that section as to why it should be legalized now, which brings me to the more arguementive part of your debate.

--"Countless countries around the global have started to decriminalize Cannabis, their economies are flourishing due to the production of hemp and its products,"(your arguement). -This Has been shown to do good in the short run, but what your missing is the clear strain it will have on the long run for a developed/industrialized nation.
"Smoking of cannabis is the most harmful method of consumption, since combustion of material and inhalation of smoke in itself from organic materials such as tobacco, wood, gasoline and cannabis causes various health problems. By using a vaporizer or orally consuming cannabis, many health problems and many objections to using cannabis as medicine can be eliminated."-

^^-The effects of cannabis on the youth of the nation would dramitcally alter the demographics of this nation, causing a increase in death among teens and young adult. With less Teens and young adults there would be a decrease in the workforce, and if you look towards the THe Theory of Keynesian economics, you will see that concumer spending account for 2/3 of our economy and less people alive to spend money would wreak havoc on our economy and ultimately becuase we are the dominant economic and diplomatic hegemony, it would have repercussion on the rest of the world.
*********************my sources are harmreductionjournal.com,www.aids.org,www.haworthpress.com. ***************

-"the beginning of a new millennium and there has never been a better time to put the arbitrary prejudices and fears past us. Knowledge of the Cannabis and its benefits are now widespread thanks to technological advances such as the internet and the truth about the prohibition of Cannabis is now gaining light"
----Can you specify any of these benefits? You say we import hemp and we should produce it oursleves. we have a moderate amount of oil but we do not produce it simply becuase of the effects it has wreaked upon various nations in the middle east and africa. Until you can a comprehensiveand specific arguement this area is completely useless.
******************Foreign Affairs: The Oil Boon. Coming oil WArs*******
-
"If Americans fail to extinguish these fears and start using Cannabis to all of its advantages. Then America herself will be in danger of falling behind in the Cannabis revolution of the new millennia."
-----What cannabis Revolution? What are we falling behind? We CUrrently HAVE THE LARGEST ECONOMY ON EARTH. OUR GLOBAL DEFENSE SPENDING IS MORE THAN THE NEXT 14 COUNTRIES COMBINED, WE HAVE A SEAT IN THE SECURITY COUNCIL OF THE U.N, WE ARE THE ONLY NATION WITH 5TH GENERATION JETS AND STEALTH BOMBERS. it seems that the rest of the world is actuially behind us if anything.
*******************Cia World FactBook***************

please include sources and be more specific about these trends and benfits.

"I await the challenge of disassembling it." get ready for a challenge
Debate Round No. 1
th3pr3tz3l

Pro

Actually, the unjust illegalization is 50% of the debate to me, and if you wish to concede defeat in that area, then I have won 50% of the debate already.

You have stated that the effects of cannabis on youth would i"ncrease death among teens and young adults." And you have stated sources, partially, you have given me websites, but not a specific article or piece of reasearch from those websites.

I stated in my first post:"Knowledge of the Cannabis and its benefits are now widespread thanks to technological advances such as the internet and the truth about the prohibition of Cannabis is now gaining light." You ask me to specify these benefits and I will. And there are quite a few.

Why are these resources being used to stop Marijuana when thousands of people die each year from alcohol and tobacco related accidents, disorders, and illnesses. Every thirty minutes, one person loses their life because of alcohol.

It's even higher for tobacco, with 35 million people now living with a chronic lung disease and 342,000 people dying from lung disease each year.

These numbers don't even include the number of people dying form cancer!

Let's compare illegal and legal drugs now.

http://www.erowid.org...

Here is a webstie that compares the smoke of marijuana and tobacco, they are virtually the same, and most of their detriments to ones health come from the smoke. Wich could be eliminated from the equation.

http://www.77seeds.com...

This website refutes evidence of marijuana causing damage to the reproductive system, the gateway drug theory, brain damage, and damage to the immune system.

Now lets look at issues caused by alcohol, and tobacco.

Gum Disease?

http://www.perio.org...
http://www.sdm.buffalo.edu...

both alcohol and tobacco cause that.

Heart Problems?

http://www.cdc.gov...
http://www.webmd.com...

Tobacco again? And alcohol doesn't cause heart problems, but don't be dirnkign if you've got them.

Fertility?

http://www.cnn.com...
http://www.fertilityexpert.co.uk...

Both alcohol and tobacco.

Brain Damage?

http://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au...
http://archives.cnn.com...

There's alcohol and tobacco again!

Now let's come to the lowering of crime rates, and economic benefits of legalizing marijuana.

http://www.prohibitioncosts.org...

This website shows the economic benefits of legalizing and taxing marijuana.

$10-$14 billion a year?!?

And you speak of our seat on the security council in the U.n, and our immense global defense spending. well the money saved + produced from legalization and taxation of Marijuana would be enough to secure "loose nukes" left over by the former Soviet Union, in just three years.

Now let's come to lowering crime rates again, and money saved by the taxpayer.

http://www.rawstory.com...

This shows the resources wasted by the criminal justice system on a drug that many countries deem legal. In 1999 60,000 individuals were behind bars for marijuana use. Costing taxpayers $1.2 billion. And this was 1999,

In total, in prosecuting and policing individuals with regards to marijuana, between $7 billion and $10 billion was spent. 90% of these cases were only for possesion.

There are more arrests made on marijuana charges than violent crimes combined. These violent crimes include assault, rape, robbery and murder

A state-commission Drug Advisory Group in New Mexico supports the decriminalization of marijuana because it would free up already exhausted resources and save the state millions of dollars.

Oh and I'm too lazy at the moment to integrate this into my post, but here are two websites that show that Marijuana lowers risk for lung cancer, and decreases the size of tumors.

http://www.webmd.com...

http://www.washingtonpost.com...

You asked for evidence? Evidence Galore.
WarMonger

Con

Ok so first you stated:
--"Why are these resources being used to stop Marijuana when thousands of people die each year from alcohol and tobacco related accidents, disorders, and illnesses. Every thirty minutes, one person loses their life because of alcohol."
--- You seem to think that if we should stop using so many resources to fight marijuana and use it to fight Alcohol and Tobacco. You Should probably Take a look at this http://www.marijuanaaddiction.info...
--It clearly states that according to the Journal of The American Medical Organization, MArijuana is a gateway drug that leads to Cocaine,Heroin,Opium and other fatal substances. Over half the people under the age of 17 that use marijuana go on to use harder and potentially life threatining substances.
--You also seem to think that we need to invest more money into these anti alcohol and tobbaco programs, as you clearly see we have more than enough programs to handle these attrocites,According to NewsMax of August 2nd 2005 "Traffic deaths declined and fewer people were killed in alcohol-related crashes on U.S. highways for a second straight year, the government said Monday" More Over here are just some of the anti alcohol and drug programs: http://findarticles.com... , http://www.dare.com... , www.stopalcoholabuse.gov/educators.aspx , http://www.medicalnewstoday.com....
-----------This clearly shows how funds are being evenly distributed to fight both marijuana and alcohol use, and marijuana should remain outlawed.----------

Going back to the economy
-There would be loss of law enforcement jobs all the way from Federal to local agencies.
These same agencies would lose millions? billions of dollars from confiscated money and property no longer able to be confiscated.
These adverse effect on our federal govermenent and consumer spending would reverberate throughtout the nation and international communtity
-According to the economist of August 9th, unemplyment has gone .12% this year.
--showing that marijuana would only exacerbate the growing unemployment rate in america.
- Moreso,Teenager car crashes cost America $34 Billion according to AAA(http://www.wsls.com...)
--With People using marijuana, the number of people on the road with lack of control or judgement would rastically increase.
------------So the increase in unemployment, which would lead to less consumer spending(2/3s of our econ.), combined with an increase in car crashes from lack of control/judgement off set the beneficial attributes of legalizing marijuana for thr sake of our economy------------------------------------------

You Talked About SIde Effects..
-Increased likelihood for accidents is also one of the marijuana side effects.
-Studies show that 6 to 11 percent of fatal accidents are contributed to by marijuana side effects
-Marijuana side effects from an overdose include toxic psychosis including hallucinations, delusions and a loss of self-identification
-side effects include physical problems like breathing difficulties and deteriorating physical abilities
-The ability to learn, remember and adapt quickly to changes is impaired by marijuana use.
-Marijuana addiction is a progressive disease and marijuana side effects include withdrawal and obsessive thought with the drug when it is not made available. Addiction is identified as a compulsive, uncontrollable craving for the drug even pending negative consequences.
-^^http://www.marijuana-addiction.net... with-^^
-^^ Spencer Recovery Center-^^
----So what you mean to tell me is that even though the side effects might not be as prevalent as other items legal in america, you still lobby FOr the legalization of a drug that can and will kill people, stifle the education of our youth, and Alter the course of history for the current Generation? The Legalization of this drug would cause harm. Period. There is no justifiable reason to risk more american lives despite the benefits that it may or may not bring to this nation.----------------------------------------------------------
Finally about the Illegalization of the substance...
--The United States Supreme Court has ruled in United States v. Oakland Cannabis Buyers' Coop and Gonzales v. Raich that the federal government has a right to regulate and criminalize marijuana, even for medical purposes.
--^^"American Hemp History". www.nnytimes.com--^^
-- The Government outlawed a substance that was considered Harmful and undesirbale. What You are saying is that When Government acted to protect it citizens from a substance that could Damage them and the future of the nation, it was "unjust".
--The Highest Court In the land, The Supreme Court of The United States Of America, has ruled in numerous cases that the federal government has the right to regulate, ban and punish marijuna and marijuana users.
--- To call the Supreme Court Rulings, That have kept our civil rights intact, Unjust...That is calling the Fabric of Our constitution and stadard of living Unjust.
-------The Word "Unjust" is defined as "Violating principles of justice or fairness" according to http://www.thefreedictionary.com..., And to this day there has been no law voilated by the government in terms of regulating and outlawing Drug Use, more specifically marijuana, Making your Headline for this debate complete and utterly Wrong in connotation.-------------------------
I Await your response...
Debate Round No. 2
th3pr3tz3l

Pro

Let's eliminate some of your points right off the bat.

The idea of a gateway drug is idiocy. I am taking this directly from a debate on this website, where it was deemed there was no such thing as a gateway drug. If Marijuana was a gateway drug:

"Alcohol is a legal drug and is one of the substances that has been labelled as a gateway drug. But a brief look at the numbers will show that something is clearly wrong with the gateway theory. There are a huge number of people that drink. There are plenty of bars throughout this country that people flock to every night. The number of people that drink is clearly a very large one.

But then look at the amount of people that do heroin. The number is significantly lower than the amount of people that drink. If one leads to another, then there should be a much higher amount of heroin addicts.

Because one event follows another does not mean that these events are linked by any causality. There are plenty of circumstances under which one event can follow another, but have no causal connection."

Here is a study that proves Marijuana has no connection to car accidents, in fact it could lower them. Marijuana smokers are more cautious, and drive slower because of altered time perception.

This website has information on multiple studies of Marijuana and car accidents:

http://www.norml.org.nz...

You speak of the symptoms of a Marijuana overdose, this is the most unlikely thing that could happen to someone. In the United Kingdom, over 700,000 people die from alcohol overdoes, while no one, yes, not one person has EVER died from a Marijuana overdose.

http://blogs.salon.com...

You talk of Marijuana addiciton. Above is a study that not only shows, Marijuana use does not increase when prohibition is lifted, but it also shows that escalation of use over time, was only shown by 6% of respondants. This refutes the idea of addiction, where you slowly become resistant to the drugs affects, so you need more of that drug to get the same high.

I'm now going to skip to your criticism of my title, because of the definition of unjust, using the very same website. I see the defenition unjust - marked by injustice or partiality or deception. I stated their illegalization of Marijuana was marked by deception. Wich it was, as I stated in my first post the campaign against Marijuana was marred by lies, and deception.

Now you say that I am against the very constitution, that is another debate. This point is mute.

Now when you say I am against the constitution because I disagree with the Supreme Court, that is a strange statement. Laws can be changed, decisions in the Supreme Court in the past, can be changed in the future. All I want is a change. And once again, this debate is not only about America, so you continue to throw at me reasons that it should not be legalized in AMERICA. Supreme court this, constitution that.

"harmful and undesirable."

I dont evenw ant to get into this statement but it appears I have lots of space left in my post, so here we go.

"The goverment outlawwed a substance that WAS considered harmful."

Was is a very important word there, past tense.

And you also stated:

"The Government outlawed a substance that was considered...undesirable."

Yes, it was undesirable, read my first post.

I havee refuted all your points but the loss of jobs in law enforcement agencies, this is becuase it will happen. The world runs on change, and when change happens sacrifices must be made. That is the sacrifice, although all these jobs WILL be replaced in the birth of the Marijuana industry, they will not be law enforcement jobs, but in the end legalization will create more jobs than it would destroy.

After all the destruction of a single branch of the alw enforcement tree vs. the creation of a new tree. I choose a new tree.

I await a response.
WarMonger

Con

WarMonger forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
6 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Posted by bthr004 8 years ago
bthr004
"But then look at the amount of people that do heroin. The number is significantly lower than the amount of people that drink. If one leads to another, then there should be a much higher amount of heroin addicts"

- Because heroin is illegal,..that is why not as many people do it,..
Posted by ndasa 8 years ago
ndasa
As long as cigarettes are legal marajuana should be legal
Posted by Ragnar_Rahl 8 years ago
Ragnar_Rahl
Silly Keynesian, reality is Austrian.
Posted by th3pr3tz3l 8 years ago
th3pr3tz3l
Ah, is this my opponents way of conceding defeat?
Posted by WarMonger 8 years ago
WarMonger
I forgot to add in THe Harvard International Reveiw's report on failed nations as a source, goes under the demographic part.
Posted by stand4something 8 years ago
stand4something
This we can agree on :D!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Only_Gus
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Captain.America
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