The Instigator
utahjoker
Pro (for)
Winning
7 Points
The Contender
jh1234l
Con (against)
Losing
3 Points

Marijuana legalization

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 3 votes the winner is...
utahjoker
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/30/2012 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 6,529 times Debate No: 28779
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (0)
Votes (3)

 

utahjoker

Pro

First round is acceptance followed by debate about marijuana legalization. I must prove that it should be legal while my opponent must prove that it shouldn't.

Good Luck
jh1234l

Con

I accept this debate and I assume that the BOP is split and that I also have to refute your claims at the same time.
Debate Round No. 1
utahjoker

Pro

I stand in favor for marijuana legalization for three main reasons first the liberty, the cost, and the facts.

If the United States legalizes marijuana liberty would increase. Why should the United State government control with what the American citizens does with their body. The government shouldn't say what is good for us or not and at the very lest not control what he do. If marijuana becomes legal with opens liberty to everyone who wants to smoke it. It is the principle of it becoming legal which is the most important. The principle of liberty.

I ask is marijuana being illegal worth the cost and more specifically the cost of money and lives. The war on drugs or more like the War on Marijuana has estimated to cost the United States 1 trillion dollars, I thought the United States was in a 16 trillion dollar debt and people call for cuts in the budget I think I have found one. The lives that have lost are incredible in the last 5 years 45,000 people have died in the War on Marijuana, while not one case as shown that directly smoking Marijuana has never killed anyone. While death is one way to end a life prison can do the same. The United States population is 5% of the world's population, while this is a small number the United State's prison population is 25% of the World's prison population, and one of the main reasons that people are in prison are for Marijuana charges and to be more specifically 12.7% of all prisoners are in prison for Marijuana. Is that fair to keep letting people go to prison and let their families suffer without their mom or dad or just letting people keep on dieing in war to keep something harmless illegal I think not.

Time to end the misconception of Marijuana. It is not addictive physically unlike Nicotine or Alcohol it is addictive mentally much like if someone wanted to eat something unhealthy all it takes is will power to stop using Marijuana.
Marijuana is the largest cash crop in the United States which means that the laws are doing nothing to stop it if it was legal it could have a retail tax put on it giving money back to the United States instead of it going prevent it. Tobacco killed 445,000people per year and alcohol has killed 75,000 people per year in the United States while Marijuana has never proven to kill anyone.

Marijuana should be legal just for the principle at hand and it will help America.

Sources
http://www.drugscience.org...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com...
http://norml.org...
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com...
http://www.lung.org...
jh1234l

Con

I'll start by refuting my opponent's arguments.

"If the United States legalizes marijuana liberty would increase. Why should the United State government control with what the American citizens does with their body. The government shouldn't say what is good for us or not and at the very lest not control what he do. If marijuana becomes legal with open liberty to everyone who wants to smoke it. It is the principle of it becoming legal which is the most important. The principle of liberty."

This assumes that liberty always=good. However, with every right comes responsibilities. If we legalize marijuana, we will likely see an increase of car crashes and other accidents caused by impaired concentration, because cannabis causes impaired memory, phychomotor coordination and concentration.[1] Therefore, in this case, liberty does not necessarily equal good, as people are smoking it irresponsibly. In fact, Around 80 to 90 per cent of crime is related to alcohol and drug misuse, according to one of New Zealand's top judges. [2]

"The War on Marijuana has estimated to cost the United States 1 trillion dollars, I thought the United States was in a 16 trillion dollar debt and people call for cuts in the budget I think I have found one. The lives that have lost are incredible in the last 5 years 45,000 people have died in the War on Marijuana, while not one case as shown that directly smoking Marijuana has never killed anyone."

Many deaths caused by marijuana are actually reported as "accidents"[3] Therefore, marijuana has actually killed people. Plus, your source points towards the death toll of the Mexican drug war,(4) but then blames it on American drug banning.

"Is it fair to keep letting people go to prison and let their families suffer without their mom or dad or just letting people keep on dieing in war to keep something harmless illegal I think not."

Is it fair to make such a dangerous drug, as dangerous as other drugs[3] and kills[3] to be legal?

"It is not addictive physically unlike Nicotine or Alcohol it is addictive mentally much like if someone wanted to eat something unhealthy all it takes is will power to stop using Marijuana."

Cannabis can cause damage to the brain if taken before age 18.[5] And its damage to the neurological system is still under discussion. [5] Therefore it also harms mentally. Plus, this is not bout the legalization of it, either.

My Arguments:

Marijuana's long term impacts are less clear[1], thus making it potentially more dangerous than Pro says it is. As I have proved that Marijuana does kill and is dangerous, if the drug is legalized, it will possibly cause medicaid prices to rise. Plus, shops are also going to sell them. Let's see what happens:

Higher medicaid costs---> Higher taxes----> The tax that the new marijuana industry pays fills in the blank---> Industry expands----> More people smoke----> The loop goes all over again. (see how this causes the industry to expand indefinitely until the bubble pops?)

This will cause a bubble that eventually explodes and sends the economy into a chaotic state.

[1]http://en.wikipedia.org...
[2]http://www.stuff.co.nz...
[3]http://alcoholism.about.com...
(4)http://latimesblogs.latimes.com...
[5]http://en.wikipedia.org...
Debate Round No. 2
utahjoker

Pro

First I'll refute my opponents arguments

If we legalize marijuana, we will likely see an increase of car crashes.Liberty does not necessarily equal good. Around 80 to 90 per cent of crime is related to alcohol and drug misuse

Currently Marijuana is linked to 1% of fatal car crashes {1}, while Alcohol is the reason for around 50% of fatal car crashes {3}. With my opponents reasoning we should make Alcohol illegal again, but why don't we it's because the United States has already gone down this path with Prohibition and the mob killed people and people still found ways to get alcohol in an unsafe way. This path sounds very similar with what the United States is going through right now with drug dealers giving it to people in an unsafe way, people still finding ways to get it and Gangs killing people like the mob, make it legal because he know the history {4}. Liberty is great like what Benjamin Franklin said "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."{2} My opponent is afraid that giving someone extra liberty will equal more death and crime, while the opposite would be true. Most crime related to Marijuana is because someone is smoking it, not actually doing anything that would hurt another. That 45,000 people die in the War against Marijuana {5} while no cases of someone dieing because directly in taking Marijuana {6}. So, In this case liberty does equal good.

Many deaths caused by marijuana are actually reported as "accidents." Therefore, marijuana has actually killed people. Plus, your source points towards the death toll of the Mexican drug war,but then blames it on American drug banning.

Accidents is not the fault of Marijuana, but the fault of people. Like someone can't blame the weapon for killing someone, or if the car merges and crashes, or if Marijuana was smoked and an accident happened, accidents are caused by people not non-living objects, because things can be prevented before the accident happens. War in Mexico is because of America drug banning. Most of the drug lords are fighting with each other trying to get into America to sell their drugs. If it becomes legal the drug lords will have to adapt to the supply and demand that happens in the United States. Because if it becomes legal it will become like a business much like the beer industry and safety and regulations will be put on it causing a safer product of the people who will already smoke it, compared to buying it from a shady character in a dark alley. The deaths will severely go down because no longer do the drug lords fight because it is illegal they have to compete with American companies in a legal way and it will be easier to find those who are bad because making it legal takes of the blanket of confusion.

Is it fair to make such a dangerous drug, as dangerous as other drugs and kills to be legal

It is not dangerous like I stated earlier.{6}

Cannabis can cause damage to the brain if taken before age 18.And its damage to the neurological system is still under discussion.Therefore it also harms mentally.

If it becomes legal it will have restrictions on it like tobacco it can't be smoked before the age of 18. If someone wants to do damage to their brain that is their brain not mine, watching TV is not good for the brain or playing video games but no one is going to stop that and it shouldn't be stopped.{7}

I have refuted by opponent's arguments and I have shown and explained that Marijuana unlike what my opponent is trying to allude to that it is some mega drug that will kill is false. Vote Pro and end the over stocked prisons, the unnecessary debt, and the restricted liberty.

Sources
{1} http://wiki.answers.com...
{2} http://en.wikiquote.org...
{3} http://www.druglibrary.org...
{4} http://wiki.answers.com...
{5} http://latimesblogs.latimes.com...
{6} http://www.facebook.com...
{7} http://serendip.brynmawr.edu...
jh1234l

Con

Currently Marijuana is linked to 1% of fatal car crashes {1}, while Alcohol is the reason for around 50% of fatal car crashes {3}. With my opponents reasoning we should make Alcohol illegal again, but why don't we it's because the United States has already gone down this path with Prohibition and the mob killed people and people still found ways to get alcohol in an unsafe way. This path sounds very similar with what the United States is going through right now with drug dealers giving it to people in an unsafe way, people still finding ways to get it and Gangs killing people like the mob, make it legal because he know the history {4}. Liberty is great like what Benjamin Franklin said "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."{2} My opponent is afraid that giving someone extra liberty will equal more death and crime, while the opposite would be true. Most crime related to Marijuana is because someone is smoking it, not actually doing anything that would hurt another. That 45,000 people die in the War against Marijuana {5} while no cases of someone dieing because directly in taking Marijuana {6}. So, In this case liberty does equal good.

Your assumption that I want to ban alcolhol is a strawman statement, as I never said that anywhere. Marijuana is right now illegal, and thus that explains how the marijuana linked accidents are low. It will potentially rise if it is legalized.

It is not dangerous like I stated earlier.{6}

It is as dangerous as other drugs and does kill, according to Hamish Turner, the president of the Coroners' Society. [1]

If it becomes legal it will have restrictions on it like tobacco it can't be smoked before the age of 18. If someone wants to do damage to their brain that is their brain not mine, watching TV is not good for the brain or playing video games but no one is going to stop that and it shouldn't be stopped.{7}

Pro has not refuted this adequately, he never said that it will have restrictions in the first round.


I have refuted by opponent's arguments and I have shown and explained that Marijuana unlike what my opponent is trying to allude to that it is some mega drug that will kill is false. Vote Pro and end the over stocked prisons, the unnecessary debt, and the restricted liberty.

My opponent has not refuted my argument on the economy.

"Marijuana's long term impacts are less clear[1], thus making it potentially more dangerous than Pro says it is. As I have proved that Marijuana does kill and is dangerous, if the drug is legalized, it will possibly cause medicaid prices to rise. Plus, shops are also going to sell them. Let's see what happens:

Higher medicaid costs---> Higher taxes----> The tax that the new marijuana industry pays fills in the blank---> Industry expands----> More people smoke----> The loop goes all over again. (see how this causes the industry to expand indefinitely until the bubble pops?)

This will cause a bubble that eventually explodes and sends the economy into a chaotic state."

Therefore he has not refuted my arguments.
He has also strawmanned my argument, claiming that I think that marijuana is a mega drug, when I only stated that it is as dangerous as any oher drug. Finally, he asks people to vote bomb. "Vote Pro and end the over stocked prisons, the unnecessary debt, and the restricted liberty." Because he is asking people to vote for him for the side he stands on, not for how good theguments are.


[1]http://alcoholism.about.com...
Debate Round No. 3
No comments have been posted on this debate.
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by Axiom 3 years ago
Axiom
utahjokerjh1234lTied
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Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: Interesting, albeit short, debate. I felt as if Pro made a pretty foundational case from the get-go and jh1 ended up passively defending his position rather than trying to raise arguments aggresively to counter act Pro's points. In the end I really had no context for this debate. Are we supposed to judge this based on whatever provides most liberty, saves most lives, provides the most gumdrops to the world? I, as potential judge, was given no reason to prefer and no lens through which to judge this debate. In the end I had to settle on my own lens since none was provided and this is how it ranked: 1. Car crashes. Pro wins this because Con provides a very silly correlation (which was a new argument in the last round btw) stating that car deaths are low because marijuana is illegal. We know it is still prevalantly used, therefore this doesn't hold up. 2. It is as dangerous as other drugs. Pro wins this as well because it is simply not true that marijuana is as dangerous.
Vote Placed by TUF 3 years ago
TUF
utahjokerjh1234lTied
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Reasons for voting decision: I thought the debate as pretty evenly debated on both sides. Pro did have a better support analysis for his case, and used more effective sources however.
Vote Placed by Muted 3 years ago
Muted
utahjokerjh1234lTied
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Total points awarded:23 
Reasons for voting decision: Debaters should not copy whole chunks of their opponent's debate arguments just to write a point-by-point rebuttal. There are other better ways of doing it. As such, Pro did not make much of an argument, but had better sources.