The Instigator
Conspicuous_Conservative
Con (against)
Losing
9 Points
The Contender
Daddy_Warbux
Pro (for)
Winning
12 Points

Maternity leave should be granted to High School Students.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/15/2008 Category: Education
Updated: 9 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 3,153 times Debate No: 1805
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (7)
Votes (7)

 

Conspicuous_Conservative

Con

I was eating chow in the Mess Hall at Fort Hunter Ligget in a barren destination in California. As I sit there eating my breakfast I was shocked to see a Fox News story out of Colorado. The report was about children receiving Maternal leave from school. The lawyer stated that these young mothers need at the minimum 3 weeks off of school without penalty. This new law also permits the mother to skip all home schooling or internet classes. The lawyer stated that these un penalize 3 weeks are for bonding with mother and child and the lawyer stated that the most important thing is the mother's education.

We all must know already that the education system is one of the governments largest monopolized expenditure. So with so much money that runs the education system it is no surprise some dirt bag looks to exploit. I feel this is yet another example that our liberties are slowly fading away while government expands like the malignant cancerous tumor it is. I find this law if passed would be flawed for the following reasons:

- The alternatives to missing school.

- Problems with the young mothers and how they will prioritize life, education and their new family.

- The problem with granting more power to the government.

The report started of by stating that the most important thing that they want to come from this new legislation is the continued successful education of the child. So in this paragraph I will discuss the way in which the mother to be can continue her education while she mothers her child. In or in close proximity to almost every location in America there are centers where a child can be enrolled in a home schooling program. If education is truly important this is an extremely appropriate substitute for in school education. On dish network which is the provider of my television needs. Dish network offers a variety of home school classes over a satelite program that u can enroll for in which questions can be ask and classes can be held by watching the appropriate channel and calling in over the phone. So while the parent stays home to care for her child the mother is able to continue her edducation. An instead of a temporary fix for three weeks a mother is able to finish her school from home with out the inconvenience of finding baby sitter.

Prioritizing ones daily life is not as easy as it once was for the new mother. If this law passes it basically gives the government the power to tell you how to live your life. "If you give a person an inch they take a mile", is a very popular saying that always runs through my head when I think about government. I beg someone to tell me what governmental program is actually working and has not become a detriment to our society.

For the sake of a clear and shorten opening I will conclude my first argument by telling everyone that I think the young mothers out their are very tough and brave individuals I will never truly know how they feel and ever be able to empathize with them, but I know that any young girl that decides to have there child and continue their education is truly brave, but with so many educational options that can be done their is no need for another arbitrary law to be passed that will only cause problems and and yet another governmental choke on our already struggling wallets.
Daddy_Warbux

Pro

My first problem with your argument itself is that you have failed to explain how maternal leave for teenage mothers will "choke our already struggling wallets."

If you are referring to the fact that we will be paying property taxes for students to not attend school, then I am compelled to point out that students miss school every day. What is the difference between one student missing fifteen consecutive days of school and fifteen different students missing one day each? There clearly is none.

Secondly, giving maternity leave to teenage mothers will make them more likely to continue their schooling. Please allow me to explain. First of all, most, if not all, mothers in high school are going to take off from school right after their child is born, regardless of whether or not it is "allowed." Also, There are only a certain number of days that students can be absent from high school. If they exceed the set number of absences, they will not be allowed to come to school any more. So, if the students are going to take off from school anyway, why not keep some of those absences from counting against them? Otherwise, if the student remains out of school for three weeks, these fifteen days will count against her number of allowed absences.

I do not disagree that the student should be given work from school to work on (at least, I would not have disagreed, had you thought to mention this), but finding a home schooling class on Dish network (provided the mother HAS Dish network) that is at the same point in her class's curricula in school is highly unlikely.

Thank you.
Debate Round No. 1
Conspicuous_Conservative

Con

First of all I would like to thank you Mr. Warbux for your rapid response to this debate, I would like to first address the fact on how this problem will further stretch the wallets of many Americans. Just like any government run program this law will require money that will be redistributed from the rest of the public that most will not be able to benefit from the money that is being taken from them. The lack of government efficiency is seen through everything they have screwed up; health care, social security, welfare the list is endless. I am guessing that you have not taking economics classes or you haven't paid attention to the fact that the more you tax individuals the less revenue will be brought in.

Now the fact that many children are missing school what is 15 days going to hurt is the most childish argument I have heard. That is what children do when they want to justify defiant behavior blaming it on social pressures or peer pressure. I stated in my argument that the 3 weeks was going to be the minimum who knows what the courts will eventually settle for. Anytime a child misses school the school loses money for that child for the day. The money seems to go missing another sign of the inefficiencies.

Another thing that you haven't noticed is the incentive that this law would give to people to get pregnant. A month or two off would sound good to people that are not really school oriented, to you and I educated people the trade off a month off of school versus at least 18 years of child baring doesn't seem like a good trade off but children think in very interesting ways.

Sincerely,
Fred. Cheers!!
Daddy_Warbux

Pro

I never said "many children are missing school what is 15 days going to hurt". (If I had, it would have at least had a comma after "what" and a question mark at the end). I may have eluded to it, but only to prove my main point. I said that these teenagers will miss school whether or not they are given maternity leave, but why not avoid truancy and give them a chance to re-enter school? They are more likely to reach the limit of absences allowed if there are no exceptions made for them.

I may be incorrect, but I believe that when a child misses school, that just means slightly more money is spent on all of the students who did not miss school that day. The only way it turns out to be a loss is if a student drops out of school and does not use his or her education to benefit the economy and make it grow. Once again, this leads back to being kicked out of school for exceeding the legal limit of absences.

As far as stretching the wallets goes, repeating your opinion does not prove its validity. I do not see the connection between this type of law and Social Security, welfare or health care. All of those programs are transfer payments; the government receives nothing in return, it just gives money away. With Social Security, the government gives money to the elderly and disabled . With welfare, the government gives money to those in poverty. With health care, the government gives money to those without health insurance. To whom does the government give money when a child misses school? The government only gives money to a student if he or she attends school.

About the incentive to get pregnant: Are you serious? If a student is willing to go to that length to take off from school, they are more likely to just take off a few days. If someone wants to leave school for a month or two, they will probably do not care and will drop out. Additionally, I doubt most teenagers are patient enough to wait NINE MONTHS before they actually get off those few weeks they wanted and have probably already changed their mind about.

You have also ignored my point of teachers assigning work for the teenage mother outside of the classroom. They do the same thing when a student goes on vacation for a week. Maybe they could add into the law that the mother must visit their guidance counselor once a week to get new work and hand in the old work.

I got an A+ in economics.
Debate Round No. 2
Conspicuous_Conservative

Con

As I stated in my first argument I am at a base and I am reiterating the fact that I am at a base because I am doing my debates on my phone so as not to forfeit. I am glad that you feel the need to point out errors in punctuation, but if you spent as much time debating the issue instead of making personal attacks on me it would probably get you to a conclusion that is more detailed then we should simply allow them to work at home and continue their education. I made a poor comment early in regards to your education and i apologize but without proof of a report card all I can really do is take your word for it.

You seem to be a big advocate of the Education system bending over backwards to accommodate for these teen mothers that have made a mistake. The school system should allow excuse absences in order to save them from missing further school or dropping out. The problem with that is a month off is not going to solve the problem the child doesn't become self sufficient after one month. This mother needs to spend as much time as possible in the first 5 years in order to give their child the best shot at a successful future. It is so short sighted to think that this one month break is going to keep this child from missing any further school.

You have this idea that the government is some sort of efficient organization that handles money well and does things in the best interest of the people. The term "government gives money" and the "government receives nothing in return" is something you state. I beg to differ in this case, government has no money "to give" that is money that they take out of the income tax of working citizens and redistribute to the schools and many other social programs so spare the government giving as if they are some sort of humanitarian organization. In order to give something one must first own the something so when you state the government gives money you should probably say tax payers give but that is a different story all together. When a child misses school the individual costs that school receives is not redistributed amongst the remaining children it is just more money that the government is able to hold onto and squander in other means.

I was joking to a certain extent when I stated that children would get pregnant in order to miss school. When there is consequence from missing school children will be less likely to miss school, if you take this away this will give people that much more reason not to fear the consequences. Anytime a rule is brought up it leads to another than yet another, next thing you know we will be worrying about the fathers to be getting their paternal leave just as males receive paternal leave in the work place. I told you in the first argument that this break was one that would be homework free simply a three week chance for the parent and child to bond, my main argument that maternity is the wrong thing is because we are trying to provide another government run organization that would try and help parents get back into school after a long break. The problem in this is that the newborn is the most important thing now and we most ensure he/she is raised properly so he is not ending up making the same mistake of the mother and father. I wish you the best of luck but I suggest to stop the negativity before it detracts from the points you try to make.

Sincerely,

Fred R. Cheers!!!
Daddy_Warbux

Pro

I apologize for the sarcasm and for misreading your opening argument.

I do believe that this would serve well as time to bond for mother and child. Most importantly, I think the mother would get a chance to learn how to be a mother instead of just leaving the child with a parent or grandparent. It does not seem as if "another government run organization" would be necessary to help get mothers back into school after the break. Why can the school not tell them what they missed? Most teachers have a "late work" bin of some sort. The only ones bending over backwards will be the mothers.
Debate Round No. 3
7 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 7 records.
Posted by Daddy_Warbux 9 years ago
Daddy_Warbux
Awesome...saw them a little over a month ago with Anti-Flag.
Posted by ImAPanicBomb447 9 years ago
ImAPanicBomb447
Daddy, yes my name is a BTMI reference... i replied to you in my debate about righty's comments but realized theres a good chance you wouldn't see it. so here you go. lol.
Posted by reachingformore 9 years ago
reachingformore
I think it is rather silly that people are worried on whether or not girls will get pregnant. Most of the already know the risk--I'm thinking about the welfare of the child and the mother. The first few months as a mother is a living nightmare--staying up till late to feed the baby, and etc.

But thinking of this--why not give the teenage mothers the same amount of days off as a woman granted leave from work?

A mother goes back to work and the child is still being raised...
Posted by Daddy_Warbux 9 years ago
Daddy_Warbux
I apologize to you, Fred R., once again. I thought I could make points for a side I disagreed with, but I was proven wrong, at least in this case; I could only attempt to detract from your arguments instead of creating my own. I would enjoy debating you in something that I feel strongly about. Based on your views in the "Issues" chart, possibly flag burning or gay marriage? Maybe war in Iran or a religioius issue. Let me know, I would like to show you that I am not an immature moron that can only insult his opponents. To all others, vote for Conspicuous_Conservative in this debate. (I am not saying this as an excuse for poor arguments. I merely admitting my inferiority as a debator, in that I cannot yet argue for what I disagree with. But I am by no means humble or kind in asking that you vote for Conspicuous_Conservative; I am neither.)

To kage209: If they were not worried about going back to school or truancy, then why don't they just drop out? Then the debate would have been unnecessary.
Posted by kage209 9 years ago
kage209
So why should these girls be worried about going back to school or avoiding truency when there main concern is the baby. Answer that Mr. Daddy.
Posted by Jokes209 9 years ago
Jokes209
It is sad this law will most likely pass, Warbux you should spend more time talking about the debate at hand then make fun of the other participant
Posted by mrmatt505 9 years ago
mrmatt505
I would just like to make the analytical that it gives girls less incentive not to get pregnant.
7 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 7 records.
Vote Placed by Krazzy_Player 3 years ago
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