The Instigator
lenorenomore
Pro (for)
Losing
7 Points
The Contender
brittwaller
Con (against)
Winning
19 Points

McCain is not fit to be president.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/17/2008 Category: Politics
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 1,762 times Debate No: 5739
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (13)
Votes (5)

 

lenorenomore

Pro

I will post my argument after my challenge is accepted.
brittwaller

Con

Thank you to my opponent for posting this. I see that this is her first debate, so I will try to make it a good one.

I have accepted your challenge and eagerly await your opening argument.
Debate Round No. 1
lenorenomore

Pro

lenorenomore forfeited this round.
brittwaller

Con

Due to the restraints placed upon my opponent by studying, we will simply make this a one-round debate. Please ignore rounds 1 and 2.

Thanks
Britt
Debate Round No. 2
lenorenomore

Pro

So, first off, thanks to Britt for accepting my debate, and again for being patient and considerate as I was forced to forfeit a round due to SAT studies.

My statement is as follows: Senator John McCain is not fit to be President of the United States of America.
My opponent is against this statement, and in the next and final round will provide evidence of his own, along with rebuking my own arguments.

My first argument: VOTING FOR MCCAIN IS ASKING FOR ANOTHER FOUR YEARS OF BUSH
First, I will provide my evidence, and then explain:
"...when George W. Bush announced the deployment of five more combat brigades to Iraq. This escalation of an unpopular war ran counter to the advice of Bush's senior military leadership, ignored the recommendations made by the bipartisan Iraq Study Group, and sidestepped the objections of the Iraqi government it was ostensibly intended to assist. But the plan was nearly identical to what the Republican senior senator from Arizona, nearly alone among his Capitol Hill colleagues, had been advocating for months: boost troop levels by at least 20,000, give coalition forces the authority to impose security in every corner of Baghdad, and increase the size of America's overburdened standing military by around 100,000 during the next five years."

"By enthusiastically endorsing McCain's approach, the lame duck president all but finished the job of anointing the senator his political successor... The sheer unpopularity of Bush's move did knock the previously front-running McCain a notch or two behind Rudy Giuliani in the polls."

Nearly all of Senator McCain's ideas, plans, and morals are identical to those of President Bush. Bush and McCain both agree we should 'stay the course', correct? Well, remember what happened last time?

"29,395: Number of U.S. service members that have been wounded in hostile action since the start of U.S. military operations in Iraq. [AP, 3/11/08]"

"3,990: American troops who have died in Iraq since the start of the war. [icasualties.org, 3/17/08]"

"60,000: Number of troops that have been subjected to controversial stop-loss measures--meaning those who have completed service commitments but are forbidden to leave the military until their units return from war. [US News and World Report, 2/25/08]"

"2,100: Number of troops who tried to commit suicide or injure themselves increased from 350 in 2002 to 2,100 last year. [US News and World Report, 2/25/08]"

"11.9: Percent of noncommissioned Army officers who reported mental health problems during their first Iraq tour [Los Angeles Times, 3/7/08]"

"27.2: Percent of noncommissioned Army officers who reported mental health problems during their third or fourth Iraq tour [Los Angeles Times, 3/7/08]"

"94: Percent of Army recruits who had high school diplomas in Fiscal Year 2003 [Larry Korb, The Guardian, 10/12/07]"

"1,188: Number of global terrorist incidents from January - September 11th, 2001. [American Security Project, "Are We Winning?," September 2007]"

"5,188: Number of global terrorist incidents in from January- September 11th, 2006. [American Security Project, "Are We Winning?," September 2007]:

"30: Percent increase in violence in Afghanistan from 2006 to 2007. [Reuters, 10/15/07]"

"21: Number of suicide bombings in Afghanistan in 2001. [Center for American Progress, "The Forgotten Front," 11/07]"

"139: Number of suicide bombings in Afghanistan in 2006, with an additional increase of 69 percent as of November 2007. [Center for American Progress, "The Forgotten Front," 11/07]"

"30: Percent of Afghanistan controlled by the Afghan Government according to DNI Mike McConnell. [Associated Press, 2/27/08]"

"2,380: Days since September 11th, 2001 that Osama Bin Laden has been at-large."

Hmmm... and this is just what it has cost us metaphorically speaking. As for the actual cost:

"$50-60 Billion: Bush Administration's pre-war estimates of the cost of the war. [New York Times, 12/31/02]

$12 Billion: Direct cost per month of the Iraq War. [Washington Post, Bilmes and Stiglitz Op-Ed, 3/9/08]

$526 Billion: Amount of money already appropriated by Congress for the War in Iraq. [CRS, 2/22/08]

$3 Trillion: Total estimated cost of the Iraq War. [Washington Post, Bilmes and Stiglitz Op-Ed, 3/9/08]

$5 Trillion - $7 Trillion: Total cost of wars in Iraq and Afghanistan accounting for continued military operations, growing debt and interest payments and continuing health care and counseling costs for veterans. [McClatchy, 2/27/08]

160: Percent that the cost of the Iraq War has increased from 2004 to 2008. [CRS Report, 2/22/08]"

My guess is this does not help the economy. You think McCain would learn from his friend's mistakes, but apparently not. Let's not go there again. The people of our country need help now more than ever.

"(The future senator graduated 894th out of a Naval Academy class of 899, but that was only marginally worse than his father, who was 423rd out of 441.) One reason for the poor academic performance was that each McCain was a five-star binge drinker and carouser. Grandpa "smoked, swore, drank, and gambled at every opportunity he had... John spent his teens and 20s constantly flirting with disciplinary disaster by breaking every drinking and curfew rule on the books, concentrating more on Brazilian heiresses and Florida strippers than on his aviating skills."

Graduated next to last in his class, and spent his school years partying. Hmm... Good role model for America? Maybe not. Reminiscent of a certain someone I know. http://www.huffingtonpost.com... . http://img.metro.co.uk... . http://www.hogwild.net... . http://www.remote-dba.net... . http://blogs.guardian.co.uk... .

Additional info from:
http://www.reason.com...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
brittwaller

Con

Thanks again to my opponent for this debate. Readers, please disregard the first two rounds.

To the debate!

I negate: McCain is not fit to be president.

"VOTING FOR MCCAIN IS ASKING FOR ANOTHER FOUR YEARS OF BUSH"

- This is a common talking point - you might as well say a campaign-driving catchphrase said as often as "Change!" and "Hope!" - of the Obama camp. Unfortunately, my opponent provides no support for this assertion in her argument, except a vague reference of how Bush and McCain have similar viewpoints on "the Surge" in Iraq and the military in general. Also unfortunate for her is that "the Surge" worked, at least ostensibly.

http://www.washingtonpost.com...
http://online.wsj.com...

I hasten to bring out the contrast of the politics of the newspapers The Wall Street Journal, known in the mainstream corporate media to be generally "on the right," and The Washington Post, known to stand on the left of things. (Amazingly, both papers are able to have these slants and still be bastions of objectivity in the journalism world.)

"Nearly all of Senator McCain's ideas, plans, and morals are identical to those of President Bush."

-Really? I see one plan, about the direction the country should take in the Iraq War, and no ideas or morals of any kind to compare. Because they agree on military strategy does not make them identical, no matter how many times the Obama campaign says it.

As far as the wonderful statistics that you go on to cite are concerned, none of this makes McCain unfit to be president. Bush *is* the president, and he is responsible for the things in the first place. So there is the precedent that none of these things disqualifies one from being president, as Bush is still president, even after the fact.

(As a sidenote: Shame on the Huffington Post. They totally ripped off Harper's magazine with the format that they presented their statistics in. Harper's should sue.)

"My guess is this does not help the economy. You think McCain would learn from his friend's mistakes, but apparently not. Let's not go there again. The people of our country need help now more than ever."

- I assure you, Bush and McCain are not friends. Bush is simply a plain moron. McCain is actually an ok guy, in my opinion, that happened to get stuck with the legacy of Bush as the Republican nominee.

"Graduated next to last in his class, and spent his school years partying. Hmm... Good role model for America? Maybe not."

- We are not electing a role-model, we are electing a president. Ergo, irrelevant.

Funny pictures of Bush, vague statements with no factual backing, and irrelevant statistics do not make McCain unfit for office.

Thanks to lenorenomore for posting, again. I wish time had been more readily available to you:) See you around the site.

VOTE CON

Britt

-
Debate Round No. 3
13 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by lenorenomore 8 years ago
lenorenomore
Dear readers: thanks for checking out our debate! Please vote, and if possible explain so my opponent and myself can better our debating skills. Thanks.
Posted by lenorenomore 8 years ago
lenorenomore
Let's make it a good one!
Posted by lenorenomore 8 years ago
lenorenomore
Due to the restraints placed upon my opponent by studying, we will simply make this a one-round debate. Please ignore rounds 1 and 2.

-Thanks
Posted by lenorenomore 8 years ago
lenorenomore
Also, I deeply apologize to brittwaller and any readers for my forfeited round. It's not a very good excuse, but I've got my hands full with the SAT's. Sorry. Stick it out for my next argument; hopefully it's worth it.
Posted by lenorenomore 8 years ago
lenorenomore
Seriously? That's horrible! Why do people do that?
Posted by brittwaller 8 years ago
brittwaller
See what I mean?

Forum Moderator
10/19/2008 11:26:02 PMPosted: 1 hour ago
These were all the same person, and have officially been closed:

bigdogg
catdaddy13
dnbry
dvulmn
hellocity
joshandr30
rapcity
sthil99
stonrick
Posted by lenorenomore 8 years ago
lenorenomore
haha, I guess so.
Posted by brittwaller 8 years ago
brittwaller
Appearances can be deceiving;)
Posted by lenorenomore 8 years ago
lenorenomore
He seems friendly enough...
Posted by brittwaller 8 years ago
brittwaller
Everyone, including my opponent lenorenomore: please ignore the troll below. He has been harassing me and making unfounded accusations for the past few weeks now.

Let the debate continue.
5 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Vote Placed by mongeese 7 years ago
mongeese
lenorenomorebrittwallerTied
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Vote Placed by theitalianstallion 8 years ago
theitalianstallion
lenorenomorebrittwallerTied
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Vote Placed by lenorenomore 8 years ago
lenorenomore
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Vote Placed by JBlake 8 years ago
JBlake
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Vote Placed by Mr.Alex 8 years ago
Mr.Alex
lenorenomorebrittwallerTied
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