The Instigator
jmlima08
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
rodmaster
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Messi is better than Maradona

Do you like this debate?NoYes+2
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 0 votes the winner is...
It's a Tie!
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/11/2012 Category: Sports
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,871 times Debate No: 22771
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (0)
Votes (0)

 

jmlima08

Pro

Lionel Messi has come out from the realms of Argentina and impressed the football (soccer) world with his impressive skills. The call him the "New Diego Maradon" but to me he is more than that. He is his own individual and is way out of the shadow of the once famous Maradona.

At 17 years old he was already playing in Spain with the world famous club, FC Barcelona. He became the youngest person to score a goal in La Liga. He also won the U-20 World Cup with Argentina and was the lead scorer of the tournament and also voted best player in the tournament. He continued to astonish the soccer world and progress with FC Barcelona.

Diego Maradon was also born in Argentina and surprisngly was signed at 15 to play proffesioanl soccer. He was his international debut at the age of 16. After showing the world his skills he is also signed with BArcelona but then goes to play for Napoli in Italy. He was a phenomenal player but his party habits and abuse of drugs limited his career. He was also very short tempered and was kicked out of many games due to fighting etc. He was banned from international football for doping and even after given another chance he is still tested positive for doping. He ended his own career early because he probably didnt appreciate his gift. He was a great player, but could have been greater if he wasnt so iresponsible.

Messi on the other hand is all about football, that is his drug. Chipping a keeper or taking on six players is what he loves to do. He is the most respected and sometimes feared players. His quickness and agility is what helps him get past the defenders and untimately the goalie. There is always comparison between Messi and Maradona because they are similar players. They both come from Argentina, and they are both very small for soccer players. Some of Messis goals have been compared to be like Maradona. People are saying that Messi is in the shadow of Maradona but he is way past Maradona. No player has won the Golden Ball 3 times, not even Maradona.

I am not taking away anything from Maradona because he was a very great player as well. But when you compare them together, Messi is all about soccer. He still hasnt forgetten why he is playing. Maradona lost sight of that and it was his irresponsibility of fame that ultimately got him into drugs, partying and in the end kicked out of soccer. If it wasnt for that then who knows, maybe Maradona would have done greater things and when being compared to Messi people would say that Maradona is better. But thats not the case here, he had many chances to get his life back together but he chose drugs over soccer. Messi chooses soccer over everything.

In the end people can throw in that there are other players now like C.Ronaldo or Ribery that are up there with Messi. Some people will say one is better than Messi, but when it comes to Maradona vs. Messi. Messi is obviously better and looks to be greater in the future than he already is now. Please argue.
rodmaster

Con

Thanks for this interesting debate of past vs present.

1.Maradona is a natural born leader. As a 17-year-old, he captained Argentina's Juniors and went on to captain every side he ever played on, including the Argentina Under 20 Team, Boca Juniors, Barcelona, Napoli, Argentina, Sevilla, Newell's Old Boys and then Boca again at the very end. When it comes to comparing players at this level the ability to lead is integral. Former Argentina goalkeeper Roberto "El Pato" Abbondonzieri once said: "Messi can never be captain of the national team because he never talks to anyone."
2.At the end of the day the pinnacle of football is the World Cup. I doubt any player on earth would rather win the domestic trophy or Champions league rather than the World cup except for possibly the Spanish Real Madrid players. Maradona won it in 1986 in one of the most impressive world cup performances of all time securing the golden ball for best player in the tournament and also led Argentina to another final in 1990 being given the bronze ball for being the third best player of the tournament. Messi on the other hand has failed to even go past the quarter finals with Argentina in his two attempts. They both played for the same country with Messi having the likes of Higuain, Aguero, Tevez, Milito and Riquelme whilst Maradona had only 4 other players on his team which had won a world cup before. International is the measure of success and Maradona has done much better in that regard.
3. Messi not only is playing on a better international team than Maradona but also domestic. When you have a team where the world's third and fourth best players are on your side it isn't exactly hard to win. In fact 5 of UEFA's team of the year are from Barcelona alone. Maradona on the other hand joined a Barcelona team which hadn't won a trophy in 10 years and Real Madrid was not Barcelona's only rival. Athletic Bilbao and Real Sociedad were riding high at the time. The Spanish League crown actually remained in Basque Country from 1983-84. Infact Maradona took Napoli hat had never won a trophy before and was on the brink of relegation to their first double in Serie A history. This at a time when Serie A was the best league in the world and teams like Inter were stacked with the likes of Lothar Mathaus and Andres Brehme, while Juventus had Michel Platini, and AC Milan had Gulit, Van Basten and Rijkaard along with Itlalian superstars Baresi, Donadoni and Maldini. Even small teams such as Odin's and Fronting were able to employ all-time greats such as Zack and Socrates. The idea of players such as those involved with small provincial teams today is laughable. None of this phased Maradona who went on to lift the UEFA Cup beating Juventus and Bayer Munich along the way in 1989, followed by the Scudded and Italian Super Cup in 1990.

If Michael Owen and the Original Ronaldo prove anything its to not take assume greatness. Messi may get injured tomorrow. At 24 he's not Maradona level
Debate Round No. 1
jmlima08

Pro

There were some good points in that but I still disagree. Being a good leader doesn't make you a good soccer player. It is an important factor and it is something that many coaches look for in a player. Maradona was captain for several teams but that doesn't make him a good leader to me. Being a leader means being an example on and off the field. Maradona was very irresponsible both on and off the field. He was a hot head and many times participated in fights on the pitch. To me that is unacceptable especially as a so called "leader". Messi has never been in a fight on the field, when he gets mad he will take it out on the pitch wether its chipping the goalie or break someone's ankles. He might not be a leader but he is a neccesity to his team.

Also you can't compare the game from back then to right now. I am not taking anything away from Maradona and the players that played during his time, but since then soccer has changed so much, it's faster, more aggressive, and the competition is more fierce. You say Maradona played on Barcelona when they weren't the super power they are today, you are correct but Messi at 17 came right to Barcelona from Argentina. They already had players like ronaldinho, eto. He had to really step his game up to play on the field with them.

Of course a World Cup is important and definitely the most important tournament but when you when your whole team is awarded. Of course it's awesome winning a trophy for your whole country but being recognized individually is just as good. Messi is recognized individually when being awarded player of the year. Maradona has scored wOnderful goals like the goal against England in the 1986 World Cup but Messi has scored goals like that and even Excatly like maradonas goal against England.

Like I said Messi is all about soccer, the only socializing he does really is commercials and things about soccer. Of course he goes out but he is not as wreck less as Maradona was. Being kicked out of a world cup is nothing good, that's not what a leader does. Maradona could have been greater if he was more responsible. Even after being given another chance he still messed it up.

A great thing about Messi is that he is trained physically and mentally to take pain. Players go at him just to hurt him, thats how much he is feared. Maybe internationally his team hasn't done well, it's not just because of him, it takes awhile for a team to develop chemistry, Argentina has players from so many different leagues, where as Barcelona is basically half the squad from the Spanish national team. There chemistry is so good but they need Messi to fill in the blanks and make something happen. Overall Messi is by far the greatest player ever. Maradona wouldn't stand a chance if he was playing in today's era of soccer. Back then soccer wasn't as fast and physical as it was now. Everyone played simple and went with the basics and Maradona was more about technique and he had flair which is why he dominated the game.
rodmaster

Con

At the moment Messi has the workrate, attitude and talent to be right up there with the likes of Pele, Maradna and Cruff when talking about all time greates years from now. But the key phrase is years from now. 24 is a a bit off that

"Maradona was captain for several teams but that doesn't make him a good leader to me."
The fact that he was picked to be captain for every team he played for from a young age shows that he was viewed as a great leader. Maradona's skill, tenacity and playmaking made him a leader from the right start. Being a leader is about taking control of games and being the centre of everything. For better or worse Messi has never tried to make himself stand out as a leader.

"it's faster, more aggressive, and the competition is more fierce."
How would Messi do in a time of pitches in worse condition or where players were allowed to be more physical? How would Maradona do if he had increased nutrition and training or if he had been found by Barcelona scouts at a young age? It's impossible to know how each would fair in the other's era and you can only compare how well they have done compared to the time. In the late 70's there were no Barcelona scouts in Argentina and Messi may never have had Barcelona pay to treat his hormone growth deficientcy and he may never have become a great player. At the end of the day when a poll by FIFA was taken for player of the century in 2000 Maradona won the Internet based poll by wide margins, garnering 53.6% of the votes against 18.53% for Pele. By some margin people recognize Maradona as the greatest of all time. Which is the highest induvidual accolade one can recieve.

"Messi has scored goals like that and even Excatly like maradonas goal against England."
Messi's wonder goal was against Getafe who finished that year 14th in La Liga that seson. Maradona scored against a strong England team in the world cup quarter finals. In his career, Messi has scored just three free kick goals, while Maradona had scored three free kicks in a single game when he was 20. El Diego is arguably the greatest free kick-taker of all time, while Messi is third or fourth in line at Barcelona to take them. Maradona has also scored goals from the half-way line and direct from a corner kick: Messi has yet to even attempt two such goals.

"He might not be a leader but he is a neccesity to his team"
4 of UEFA's team of the year and the voted third and fourth best players on the planet need Messi more than Barcelona did for their sole La Liga title of twenty years or Argentina did to get to two world cup finals or Napoli did to win the only Serie A championships in its history or for its historic UEFA cup? Maradona never played on any dream teams but he always was able to win against the odds. The last time Napoli won a trophy was with Maradona in 1991. Argentina has gone 22 years since a World cup final. I don't think there is much debate that no one was more of a neccesity to their team's success than Diego Maradona.
Debate Round No. 2
jmlima08

Pro

You say "years from now" so let me give you a bit of statistics. As of right now at 24 years old Messi had has 8 seasons with Barcelona. In those 8 seasons he has had 234 official goals with Barcelona. At this stage these specific players had this many goals. Maradona 196, Ronaldo 153, Henry 226, Cruyff 229, and Charlton 133. Also at this stage in their career no one has had as many trophies as Messi, with 18 total. He is the first player to score five goals in Champions League match. To continue he scored another hat trick Tuesday night, making it the 18th hat-trick in his career which is also another record. So Mess is way past other great players right now, obviously unless a traumatic injury happens, which I doubt, Messi will continue to score goals and win trophies. Just those statistics right there completely dismiss everything you said. Of course he is a neccesity because the point of soccer is to score goals and where he is now even the great Maradona wasn't at his level.

Ossie Ardiles who played seven seasons with Maradona also joined the Messi bandwagon. He says " I even thought that there would never be a player like Maradona, but I have to admit that Messi is better." The only point that you have that is good is the fact that Maradona has done better internationally than Messi. Lucky for Messi he is still young and there is no doubt that he will give Argentina results, Ardiles even agrees with this as well. If you want more proof and don't believe me look up videos and articles yourself about what Maradona says about Messi. He says Messi is the greatest player of all time. Coming from Maradona himself, that pretty much sets it clear. You quoted me about how I don't think Maradona is a good leader, but you didn't bring up my reasons. Like I said being a good leader is setting an example for your time ON and OFF the pitch. Even if Mardona set a good example on the pitch he definitely didn't set a good example off the pitch. The debate isn't "Who is better Maradona or Pele?" its Messi vs. Maradona. So the fact that you brought up that poll from 2000 on who is better between Maradona or Pele is irrelevant.

Messi has played in pitches with bad conditions, I mean he does play around the world against teams that don't have the money to keep their pitch in good condition. It still doesn't stop him from scoring goals. Now you have stronger players and the game is way more physical. With that being said, some players look to just try and hurt Messi, so I think physically Messi would be just fine in the times of Maradona. Another thing you mention is free-kicks, yes Maradona has scored more free kicks than Messi, but the argument isn't who has scored more free-kicks. The argument is who is better overall. Again I am not taking anything away from Maradona because he was a phenomenal player and no matter what team he was on he did great things, but overall Messi is still the best and has yet to prove what else he can do outside of Barcelona.
rodmaster

Con

rodmaster forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
jmlima08

Pro

jmlima08 forfeited this round.
rodmaster

Con

rodmaster forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
jmlima08

Pro

jmlima08 forfeited this round.
rodmaster

Con

rodmaster forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
No comments have been posted on this debate.
No votes have been placed for this debate.