The Instigator
IsaacBigEars
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Preston
Con (against)
Winning
4 Points

Minecraft sucks 6

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
Preston
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/25/2015 Category: Games
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 543 times Debate No: 76935
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (4)
Votes (1)

 

IsaacBigEars

Pro

First round is acceptance(just say i accept)
And when i say suck it means the game is bad
Preston

Con

I accept, also spamming debates will get you banned
Debate Round No. 1
IsaacBigEars

Pro

I actually sent you a private debate but since you are here in going to do these:
So minecraft sucks bacause:
Laggy
Bad graphics
Lame combat
Wrong kind of music during the wrong time(minor)
Glitchy
Unfinshed product as there are TOO many bug fixes which seemed like they planned it from the start to keep it fresh.
Addictive
Minecraft merchandise and handbooks are also expensive scams.
I will save my words and will debate more later.
Preston

Con

Alright first in order to judge today's debate we will be judging its impacts, if something is bad, then it will have a negative impact, Thus if this game is either, neutral, or OK, we will see no negative impact.

Now I will address each point moving down:
Laggy -

Minecraft is actually not laggy at all, you see a game does not lag, hardware does. What you will see throughout this debate is that minecraft is not laggy, it runs optimised with java, and even if you dont believe this fact you will see that it doesnt make a game bad. Remember, we are looking at this games impacts. So we have to look at it on an impactual level, so what impact does lag give to society and consumers, absolutely nothing! Lag does not lower the quality of a product, instead it would come out neutral.


Bad graphics -

Now this is simply a vague and unapplied argument, something that is intended to hover is not a failure simply because it does not fly 50 feet in the air. Minecraft was not intended to be in depth in graphics so it doesn't have bad graphics, it actually has perfect graphics. Minecraft came from a game called Dwarf Fortresses, This games graphics were exactly on par with minecrafts, so minecraft has achieved its graphical goal. [1] Thus this impact is neutral if not positive.


Lame combat -

Combat in this game matches that of every other game, In call of duty you shoot guns, in Skyrim you can cast spells and swing swords, in minecraft you swing swords, shoot bows, teleport behind enemies to attack. In some custom game modes they can add anything from custom weapons and classes to magical spells. The server I run uses plugins that allow you to act as though you were in Avatar the last airbender. Without minecraft these plugins and mods do not exist and thus it provides us with higher quality combat than many other games. (Have you seen sonic boom?) The impact this leaves is positive.

Wrong kind of music during the wrong time(minor) -

Music is not something you can judge, and if anything this is minecrafts best quality. You enter a dark dungeon and luminous and eerie music plays. You are exploring the plains in the day and happy bright music plays. The impact of this music is exactly what it needs to be and can be seen as beneficial.

Glitchy -
Nothing is glitchy in minecraft at all, because its hitbox detection is so basic you are not getting stuck half in and half out of a wall, you aren't jumping and then flying up and falling really fast, its basic and rudimentary in logic and thus you see there are no glitches. when people complain about things freaking out it is a client issue and not a game issue, this impact in neutral.

Unfinished product as there are TOO many bug fixes which seemed like they planned it from the start to keep it fresh. -

- bug fixes occur in games that are good and bad, they occur in professional products and thus you can ignore this point entirely.

Addictive -

This is actually a good quality in a game, people want to play it, they want to secede and when they do they feel like they have benefited, this boosts self esteem, increases creative outlets, ect. overall positive impact.

Minecraft merchandise and handbooks are also expensive scams. -
- Merchandise outside the game does not make the game low quality, if anything it shows people enjoy the game and see it as a quality product. this impact in neutral.

Overall we see a positive outcome with positive impacts, thus this game is good and not bad.

- -Remember my opponent must fufill BOP to win or else votes will default neg- -

[1] http://www.wired.com...
Debate Round No. 2
IsaacBigEars

Pro

Rebuttals:
Laggy- while its true that singleplayer is affected thanks to hardware, multiplayer is a different story. Now its both the company and hardware's fault.Usually i see that servers(playing areas) only have one server(a place where to store information). Spend money on servers and more people worldwide will be happier. More servers, less lag. Mannually lag are also impossible to beat as you simply blow a million TNT. Now pro may not admit this but there were sometimes when everyone got hangged and then everybody said lag in cubecraft. And sometimes i just get kicked out. But anyway lag DOES affect a game. Lag is something that slows the game down, imagine getting a hang when doing pvp.
Bad graphics-
Con claims that minecraft does not have bad graphics. While its okay for modern pixel games, minecraft has done a bad job on it. Also the graphics can hurt peoples eyes like in water (animation in swimming is zero) will be darker if you swim deeper
And the floor is visible. I would rather see nothing but light (when swimming deep) then physically hurting my eyes
Lame combat-
in minecraft the way you swing the sword is always the same,there is something about the fact that you are only using one hand. Minecraft has a low variety of weapons whom is only different from its material. There is only one type of bow and only one way to craft it. The weapons do not get specific and can prevent kids to learn more about it. They just have a regular sword and bow. Perhaps they can make a more detailed thrusting sword which will knockback with no enchancements or a hunter bow which would make a higher chance for animals to drop their stuff. More interesting... Instead of too much enchancements. Or make special armour which will give you a chance for the attacker to fail hitting you. Microsoft should be creative instead of relying totally on enchancements. Skyrim also has a bow and arrow, and different styles of armour even though there is enchanting. Minecraft is also into too much of the skyrim enchance and alchemy. The throwables are only splash potions. Nothing like a bait to attract animals exist...now you also talk something about the unoriginal mods, well heres a catch, mods can contain a virus.
Wrong music in wrong time(minor)-
Well music will be seen as benefical but in minecraft is like they play relaxing music in fighting, exploring dungeons, and building. Music makes the atmosphere.
Glitchy-
Saying nothing is glitchy in minecraft at all is too exggerated. The most common and not perpously glitch is when you blow up a chunk of TNT and can see a x ray of caves, which is like an unatural cheat move not solved in years. When flying to new areas in the world, you can see void instead of a faint sight of whats coming. And when flying you can see chunks of air besides chunks of land which gives you an unatural feel too. When i fly upwards my creations just disappear in a split second instead of it gradually becoming a faint sight. Also there is a few times in multiplayer that when i land on a server, a block is in between my body or i fall to nowhere. There was also when i can break blocks for a very long time before the blocks came back to their position(in a multiplayer lobby where we cant freebuild). In minecraft you can clip through players which makes cornering less inportant and can place your leg through a minecart. Glitches also can result in annoying camping. When playing cops n robbers in ubercraft, i can craft a boat and place it on the floor, then someone breaks the boat im sitting and i fall into the prison's redstone chamber whom the cops cant go since they cant craft.
Addictive-
Plenty of people misunderstood about addiction, especially games.
Its actually quite unproductive to give yourself entertainment instead of doing work.
This are signs of being addicted to Minecraft
Throwing tantrums when stopped
Talking, thinking and doing minecraft
And the consequences are
Lack of sleep
Affect on studies(distraction maybe like writing a book about it?
Fevers
Worst of all you can just die of exhuastion
Luckily im not addicted so this is a seriously negative impact
I have done my rebuttals and also prefer my farcry 4 game than minecraft(duplo?).
I also would like con show his support on why he like Minecraft
Ps:minecraft storyline is weak and you could debate this.

Sources: http://minemum.com...

Extra video that shows lag, the ugliness of the explosion and the x ray glitch, compared to farcry 4

Whew i spent an hour and half into this. MIDNIGHT.
Preston

Con


Rebuttals:

Laggy-
Here my opponent admits the following - "while its true that singleplayer is affected thanks to hardware"
Now this means the game its self is not causing lag, now he argues that multiplayer is different, What you are going to see is this isnt due to the game, many other factors such as Server RAM, Internet Connection, ect. play into your latency rate with servers. None of which you can attribute to the game, servers lag no matter what is running depending on how the memory is allocated this is not unique to MC, and lots of servers (mine is one) run lag free. "Mannually lag are also impossible to beat as you simply blow a million TNT." This again is due to memory allocation issues, by activating 1 million tnt, you create a million entities and upon explosions initiate collision with hundreds of blocks all of which cause memory allocation issues. This isnt the games fault however because a server/client with enough ram will not experience these issues.
Thus I win this point.


Bad graphics-
My opponent states
"Con claims that minecraft does not have bad graphics. While its okay for modern pixel games, minecraft has done a bad job on it. Also the graphics can hurt peoples eyes like in water (animation in swimming is zero) will be darker if you swim deeper."
this literally describes how graphicly it is superior to its goal, my opponent admits it has realistic lighting and thus good graphics.
Thus I win this point as well.
Lame combat-
My opponent doesnt counter the fact that the combat system is par and doesnt counter the point on modded combat, he says:
"you also talk something about the unoriginal mods, well heres a catch, mods can contain a virus."
however this does not show the game is bad, instead it shows people can have malicious intent. And guess what, the vast majority does not have to deal with viruses that have been injected into their mods. Clients that run minecraft with custom mods such as Minecraft Forge, allow for a risk free experience with awesome combat.
Thus I win this point.

Wrong music in wrong time(minor)-
I think this is a concession:
"Well music will be seen as benefical but in minecraft is like they play relaxing music in fighting, exploring dungeons, and building. Music makes the atmosphere."

seeing as music changes based off location we see it is beneficial, and thus I win this point.

Glitchy-
My opponent states
"The most common and not perpously glitch is when you blow up a chunk of TNT and can see a x ray of caves" This is a java issue not a minecraft issue, when playing console you wont experience this because it isnt written in java, thus this is not a game issue.

Then my opponent continues:
"Which is like an unatural cheat move not solved in years. When flying to new areas in the world, you can see void instead of a faint sight of whats coming. And when flying you can see chunks of air besides chunks of land which gives you an unatural feel too. When i fly upwards my creations just disappear in a split second instead of it gradually becoming a faint sight. Also there is a few times in multiplayer that when i land on a server, a block is in between my body or i fall to nowhere. There was also when i can break blocks for a very long time before the blocks came back to their position(in a multiplayer lobby where we cant freebuild). In minecraft you can clip through players which makes cornering less inportant and can place your leg through a minecart."

My opponent is complaining about issues with servers, servers that have set the render distance low to optimise run speed and also about another server that is lagging, this isnt an issue with the game, it is an issue with hardware and memory allocation.

"Glitches also can result in annoying camping. When playing cops n robbers in ubercraft, i can craft a boat and place it on the floor, then someone breaks the boat i'm sitting and i fall into the prison's redstone chamber whom the cops cant go since they cant craft."
This again is not an issue with the game but with someone's modification to the game, this does not show the game is bad.
Thus I win this argument.


Addictive-
"Plenty of people misunderstood about addiction, especially games.
Its actually quite unproductive to give yourself entertainment instead of doing work.
This are signs of being addicted to Minecraft
Throwing tantrums when stopped
Talking, thinking and doing minecraft
And the consequences are
Lack of sleep
Affect on studies(distraction maybe like writing a book about it?
Fevers
Worst of all you can just die of exhuastion
Luckily im not addicted so this is a seriously negative impact
I have done my rebuttals and also prefer my farcry 4 game than minecraft(duplo?).
I also would like con show his support on why he like Minecraft
Ps:minecraft storyline is weak and you could debate this."
None of this is grounded in fact and all of this can occur with any game, thus it is not an original issue with MC, it also doesn't show MC is lower quality than anything.


I have won on every point, all places have been addressed as beneficial or neutral thus there is no negative, what we see is that my opponent hasn't fulfilled BOP.
Debate Round No. 3
IsaacBigEars

Pro

Rebuttals of your rebuttals:
Multiplayer-
Con says the RAM, connection etc. play into the latency rate. He also says that servers lag no matter what is running depending on how the memory is allocated. But then he says about the "lag free" servers.
For the connection, it is that a server is the place where you can connect, and if there is only one, plenty of players would take a slower time than others. So imagine a server in every country, that would be great. I normally play mineplex which is the most popular server in minecraft.
For the million TNT part, this is not actually a serious support but then try for 20 TNT instead.
Bad graphics-
Ever since realistic lighting makes good graphics? In farcry 4, i swim in shallow waters, the waters are normally polluted so i cannot see whats going on but the ground. Minecraft water is actually water from a swimming pool. Now the earth is facing a pollution issue and most likely when i swim beside the sea unlike swimming pools. But its not only that, the waters are dirty in beaches. So the dirty water would make things blur. But it is not included in Minecraft.
Combat-
Combat system is bad because:
Firstly minecraft mostly uses mlee weapons to attack. So this is expected to be including two handed combat, especially in need of a shield, even though dual weilding mobs already exists. Then when you hit a mob you arent actually getting close to it and the mob cant attack you just by standing right there and using the badly animated sword rather than running around. There is no mechanics to do when you are hiding in a small wall except crouch, which is more like hunching then squatting, you dont slide on the floor when you shift straft crouch, you cannot lean into one side when shooting behind a small wall.
Now for the mods, i did not only debate because the game is bad, i also debated the problems players can have in minecraft. Im debating overall of the negative parts of the game. Then con says the majority does not have to deal with viruses that has been injected into their mods. But how do you even know that there is an virus in your computer? A hacker would not sent a pop up msssage saying that you have been infected. Because mods are free, it seems too good to be true. but not everyone works on the mods for free. Money talks. And so that is why plenty of hackers target minecraft.
Wrong music in the wrong point(minior)-
You had not argued about the atmosphere part yet
Glitchy-
The most common glitch- that is why microsoft should remove java, they chosed the wrong writer, microsoft can pay java to fix the glitch.
My complaining issue- this is an issue with the server, the server is realted to the game because microsoft paid for them!
Its not because of the hardware but its because of the company, including single player.
For the further ubercraft glitches, its the company that failed to chose a right server.
Addictive-
Now minecraft is adddictive as you cant stop, there are so many things to download that you will only be playing the same game for 4 years. And for 4 years for a game means its addictive.

Con also chosed not debate about minecraft's storyline.

Sources: http://www.thetoptens.com...
Preston

Con

Again to re-address my opponent's arguments:
Lag -
This is dropped, I win this point

Multiplayer-
I win this point, no refutation is made

Bad graphics-
Ever since realistic lighting makes good graphics? In farcry 4, i swim in shallow waters, the waters are normally polluted so i cannot see whats going on but the ground. Minecraft water is actually water from a swimming pool. Now the earth is facing a pollution issue and most likely when i swim beside the sea unlike swimming pools. But its not only that, the waters are dirty in beaches. So the dirty water would make things blur. But it is not included in Minecraft.

This doesn't mean the graphics are bad, in fact my opponent compares farcry to minecraft and never shows how minecraft is inferior in graphics, thus I win this point.

Combat-
Combat system is bad because:
Firstly minecraft mostly uses mlee weapons to attack. So this is expected to be including two handed combat, especially in need of a shield, even though dual weilding mobs already exists. Then when you hit a mob you arent actually getting close to it and the mob cant attack you just by standing right there and using the badly animated sword rather than running around. There is no mechanics to do when you are hiding in a small wall except crouch, which is more like hunching then squatting, you dont slide on the floor when you shift straft crouch, you cannot lean into one side when shooting behind a small wall.

This is all solved by mods.

Now for the mods, i did not only debate because the game is bad, i also debated the problems players can have in minecraft. Im debating overall of the negative parts of the game. Then con says the majority does not have to deal with viruses that has been injected into their mods. But how do you even know that there is an virus in your computer? A hacker would not sent a pop up msssage saying that you have been infected. Because mods are free, it seems too good to be true. but not everyone works on the mods for free. Money talks. And so that is why plenty of hackers target minecraft.

My opponent does not provide evidence for this claim, and thus it is unwarranted. BTW you know if your computer is infected if you run a cleaning software and it returns with infected files. I win this point as well.

Wrong music in the wrong point(minior)-
You had not argued about the atmosphere part yet

I actually did, I stated the music plays and adapts making the music good not bad. The atmosphere is affected by what's playing and thus if it is adapting it is affecting the atmosphere.

Glitchy-
The most common glitch- that is why microsoft should remove java, they chosed the wrong writer, microsoft can pay java to fix the glitch.

Java isn't owned by Microsoft, its owned by Oracle Corporations, and MC was developed by an indie developer before Microsoft bought it.

My complaining issue- this is an issue with the server, the server is realted to the game because microsoft paid for them!
Its not because of the hardware but its because of the company, including single player.

A server related issue is caused because of the server. This doesn't affect single player, and thus shows the game is not the issue.

For the further ubercraft glitches, its the company that failed to chose a right server.
Exactly, this is caused by the server and not the game, thus you have failed to show the game causes the glitches, and thus I win this point.

Addictive-
Now minecraft is adddictive as you cant stop, there are so many things to download that you will only be playing the same game for 4 years. And for 4 years for a game means its addictive.

If you are refering to me, I play many games, and Minecraft hasn't inhibited my ability to live.

Con also chosed not debate about minecraft's storyline.

You never showed this made the game bad, Also, Minecraft isn't story driven, thus any story is a bonus.

Because my opponent has failed the BOP and for the reasons above you vote NEG
Debate Round No. 4
IsaacBigEars

Pro

Rebuttals:
Con actually merged multiplayer, and lag. Multiplayer lag. And we are debating about the LAG in the MULTIPLAYER. But he just end up claiming a point. He hasnt debated on the connection issue nor the 20 TNT part. Nothing is rebutted at all.
Bad graphics-
Minecraft has big pixels and then the blocks, minecraft is ment to be blocky but it actually ends up making the game boring and slow paced(it says you have to jump to climb up a mountain). Minecraft needs more shapes.
Combat-
Con seemed to have trouble on supporting his arguement on the minecraft combat system and end up using mods as an excuse.
Con accuses me i had not provided enough evidence, but con did not address my source about the problems kids can have with minecraft( http://minemum.com... ). Not everybody has a cleaning software, and a cleaning software can be judgedd from lousy to good.
Wrong music in the wrong time-
This is not a support to say the music is bad., no evidence says the music "adapts"
Glitchy-
I know java is from oracle cooperations, microsoft paid java to write minecraft but they should re think. The indie developers marcus persson (aka notch) and jeb. Fact: i had minecraft and was a fanboy for 3 years.
No evidence also had been shown that glitches only affect servers.
Once again con claims its caused by the server, but do you know there is a goofy job if a video game tester. The source mainly say its about the company .
Addictive-
For you, it should seem that minecraft is not the main game you play, but for others, it can be a differet story.
Lousy storyline-
Now minecraft has a storyline, now while i risk admitting it. Microsoft is actually taking risks for the game to be criticised by critics. You kill the enderdragon with no given purpose, no other quests to support your reason. Soon the offical credits roll in. Too bad my underated farcry 4 game was criticized for its main storylines, but it actually has 7 storylines of different characters. Last time, games was like a gamebook, now, they mainly focus on action.

Sources: https://en.m.wikipedia.org...
Preston

Con

Ok so im going to start strait off by telling you that you will be voting con because pro has not fulfilled BOP, they haven't shown how MInecraft is a bad game, at most they have shown why they do not enjoy it. Because of this you vote pro.

Now I will respond:

Multiplayer: again no refutation

Lag: again this isnt due to the game, its due to physical aspects of its host, you cannot show that this makes the game bad, and you haven't shown this is the games fault so I win this point as well.

Graphics: this has gone un-refuted throughout the debate. My opponent even states there is realist lighting, and since this games goal isnt to have rounded edges my opponent isnt showing why the game is bad, but instead he is suggesting that it should be a completely different game.

Combat: again, vanilla fighting is par with other games of this nature, and mods allow growth. My opponent does not understand the concept of hacking or virus injection. They also have not refuted that there are launchers that come with modifications that are risk free.

Music: Its common sense the music adapts, my opponent conceded this and now claims there is no evidence. If anything my opponent doesnt win this point because he hasnt provided evidence and he holds BOP.

Glitchy: My opponent doesnt understand the history of MC, so i will clarify, not that it matters because they havent shown how the game is bad or supported this point.

Minecraft started development after the creator (Notch), played a building simulator. After several years and several million dollars made, Minecraft was purchased by MIcrosoft.

On a completely separate note: Oracle a company not related to Mojang or Microsoft, developed Java. A programming language that would close unused processes, unlike C++ where you have to deconstruct objects. They have no relation.

Story line:
There is no story line in minecraft, Dialog apears after killing a mob in the game. Thats it, the text was a tease from Jeb_ the current Developer for MC. This point falls null.
Debate Round No. 5
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by Preston 1 year ago
Preston
NO, con doesn't, this is a beginners misconception.
https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com...
Posted by IsaacBigEars 1 year ago
IsaacBigEars
Con also has the burden of proof to proof that minecraft is a bad game. And did we just got 2 dislikes on our debate lol? Anyway thanks for that challenging debate:)
Posted by Preston 1 year ago
Preston
hahaha, you're new to this :p
Pro holds the Burden of Proof, notice that the resolution is "Minecraft is a bad game."
You are Pro, so you are agreeing with it. However I am con, i could argue it is a decent game, good game, neutral game, ect.

So you are the one who has to prove a point, not me, if it all comes out as a tie, i still win because you didnt prove a point :P
Posted by IsaacBigEars 1 year ago
IsaacBigEars
Con has a lack of sources and had forgotten one thing, to support on why minecraft is good. Debates are not always rebutting each other.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by cathaystewie 1 year ago
cathaystewie
IsaacBigEarsPrestonTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
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Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: I feel that this was an engaging debate although one that definitely has room to improve upon. Personally, I think PRO confusing his BOP was not so much of a problem as PRO failing to differentiate between a subjective and objective argument. Two of PRO's arguments (addictiveness, music) were very much opinionated and substantiated with his own interpretation with what 'good' and 'bad' was instead of following a more tangible criterion. CON didn't pick up on this but he was able to rebut all of PRO's main arguments with proficiency, particularly pointing out that PRO tends to confuse the nature of the game with the practical implications of the game (lag argument). Ultimately, I think this debate could use some more clarification in terms of from which perspective do we judge 'sucks', as things got a bit hazy when there was a clash regarding the addictive argument, where PRO argued that this would be detrimental to the user but CON argued that this would be beneficial to the company.