The Instigator
information2012
Pro (for)
Losing
1 Points
The Contender
imabench
Con (against)
Winning
35 Points

Mitt Romney News: He Is Lying His Way To The GOP Nomination

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 6 votes the winner is...
imabench
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/5/2012 Category: Politics
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,166 times Debate No: 20886
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (2)
Votes (6)

 

information2012

Pro

Mitt Romney seems to be lying his way to the GOP nomination. I have put some links together from the internet to support this idea.

You can see them here:
http://bit.ly...

He should not be President.
imabench

Con

I Accept this debate and will argue that Mitt Romney is NOT lying his way to the GOP nomination.

Pro's BOP is to prove that Mitt Romney is lying his way up to the GOP nomination, My BOP is to show how Mitt Romney is using other common tactics to win the GOP Nomination.

Other than that,

Debate Round No. 1
information2012

Pro

Do you call these tactics common? I think not.

http://redd.it...

Romney has a monster advantage over the other GOP candidates, because he still holds his connections to Bain Capital. And Bain Capital owns Clear Channel Radio, the syndication machine for Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck and many other conservative talk show hosts.

In Florida, Romney used his Clear Channel connections in the Spanish-speaking community to smear Newt Gingrich in a Univision interview.

Control of the media's message is the way Romney is getting it done. Not even Obam had that kind of fix in 2008.

The conservative media is owned by Bain Capital and Romney cronies.
imabench

Con

"Romney has a monster advantage over the other GOP candidates, because he still holds his connections to Bain Capital. And Bain Capital owns Clear Channel Radio, the syndication machine for Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck"
1) Romney and Bain Capital
Romney hasnt worked for Bain capital since 1999, and Bain had bought a portion of Clear Channel Communications in 2008.

Romney left Bain in 1999
http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://thinkprogress.org...
http://www.rove.com...

Bain didnt buy CCC until 2008
http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://www.clearchannel.com...

Bain is merely a co-owner of CCC, The other owners are the "Thomas H Lee Partners"
http://www.clearchannel.com...
http://www.clearchannel.com...

What does all of this mean? It means that Romney doesnt have any direct influence over CCC because the company (Bain) that bought a part of CCC in 2008 had bought the company 9 years after Mitt Romney had already left the company for his own endeavors.

2) What is Clear Channel Radio?
Clear Channel Radio is a fragment media outlet that makes up a part of the Clear Channel Communications organization. They specialize in communication media and outdoor advertising (billboards and whatnot) but the company does own a large share of shortwave radio stations on XM Radio. How does this company relate to Hannity, Beck, and Limbaugh?

Hannity - Not connected to Clear Channel Communications at all, his contract is actually with CCC's top rival, Cumulus Media, who owns Sean Hannity's radio talk show.
http://en.wikipedia.org... http://en.wikipedia.org...
Beck - Only connected to CCC through Premiere Networks, who operates Beck's program and is its own program that is business partners of CCC.
http://en.wikipedia.org...
Limbaugh - Also only connected to CCC through Premiere Networks, much like Glenn Beck.
http://en.wikipedia.org...

So not only does CCC not own any part of Hannity's radio show, but they are only business affiliates of the media companies that broadcast Beck's and Limbaugh's shows

3) Media manipuation?
Now if it can somehow be argued that Mitt Romney controls Bain (that he left 10 years ago) that co-owns CCC (which bain bought 9 years after Romney left) and CCC (somehow) can control radio hosts who answer to other media corporations completely, are the three radio giants the Pro mentioned even endorsing Romney?

Glenn Beck sure isnt, he remarked how Romney scares him and leans a little towards Gingrich
http://www.theblaze.com...

Hannity meanwhile hasnt said anything about who he is endorsing at all.

Limbaugh on the other hand ALSO endorses Newt Gingrich, not Mitt Romney.
http://www.cbsnews.com...

So to recap at this point, the Pro thinks that Romney is using connections to a company he hasnt worked for in 10 years to control a media corporation that they only have co-ownership of for four years, to manipulate Hannity, Beck, and Limbaugh to endorse Romney but in reality they do not actually endorse Romney at all....

4) Romney tricked Latino Vote against Gingrich
"In Florida, Romney used his Clear Channel connections in the Spanish-speaking community to smear Newt Gingrich in a Univision interview."
The Univision interview in question here was a one-on-one interview with Newt Gingrich and a reporter who was asking questions on behalf of the latino audience. The controversial stances and arguments he gave though were reported and broadcasted by EVERY MEDIA source that heard about it , not just CCC.... That interview was given attention by the New York Times, Occidentaldissent, The Huffington Post, the LA Times, and Univision Communications themselves, the largest spanish speaking news source in Florida is its own independent broadcasting company and in no way is affiliated with CCC

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com...
http://www.occidentaldissent.com...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
http://www.latimes.com...

Romney not only had absolutely no control over how the interview was re-broadcasted, but he didnt even need to slam Gingrich because Gingrich dug his own grave on that one.

5) How does Romney get so much support?
"Control of the media's message is the way Romney is getting it done"

Oh really, have you even considered anything else about how he is doing so well? Romney is seen as the most moderate candidate who has the best chances to go against Obama because everyone else has at one point completely shot themselves in the foot and have lost respect of voters due to mistakes and scandals. Romney could be leading the polls for any number of reasons which include his economic policy, his work regarding the state of Massachusetts, his likeability, economic policy, tax plan, foreign policy stance, it could be anything. Anything EXCEPT a mass conspiracy that he somehow controls the conservative Media...

6) Conspiracy bullsh*t
"The conservative media is owned by Bain Capital and Romney cronies."
According to an article you read on reddit.com

The conservative media is massive, and Bain only co-owns a share of one media company involved in one part of the media where the talk show hosts the company affiliates with dont even endorse Romney, have criticized him on numerous occasions, are not controlled by the companies who broadcast their radio shows, and are not all under the control of Mitt Romney...

For the record, how does this count as "Lying His Way To The GOP Nomination"? As far as im concerned this is another half-brained conspiracy theory that doesnt involve "lying" at all, please stick to the resolution....
Debate Round No. 2
information2012

Pro

Wow. I guess you don't understand just how the world of media works. Looks like you have lost this debate not just out of sheer ignorance, but out of a lack of interest in TRUTH.

Try this for an article reference:
http://endoftheamericandream.com...

And don't make me hold your hand while exposing you to the truth about mainstream media and politics.

And I thought you knew something about the way the world runs.
imabench

Con

1) All arguments dropped

2) " Looks like you have lost this debate not just out of sheer ignorance, but out of a lack of interest in TRUTH."
Oh I am interested in the truth, I did actual research into your claim, found several fallacies in your logic, presented those fallacies to you, and you ignored them like a 4 year old....

3) "Try this for an article reference: http://endoftheamericandream.com...;

I checked out this article, and I must say it is rather unreliable and biased, how do I know this? These are some of the other headlines that have come from this same website...

- 1 - "35 Shocking Facts That Prove That College Education Has Become A Giant Money Making Scam"
- 2 - "All Hail The United States Of Germany? The Rest Of Europe Is Facing Either German Domination Or Financial Collapse"
- 3 - "17 Reasons Why A Vote For Mitt Romney Is A Vote For The New World Order"
- 4 - "You Won't Believe How Corrupt, Lazy And Stinking Rich Our Congress Critters Have Become"
- 5 - "10 Reasons Why Lindsay Lohan Is Right About The Federal Reserve And The Price Of Food"
- 6 - "12 Very Disturbing Examples Of Radical Social Engineering By The U.S. Government"
- 7 - "Solid Proof That Weather Modification Projects Are Being Conducted All Over The United States"
- 8 - "Fukushima Is Continually Blasting All Of Us With High Levels Of Cesium, Strontium And Plutonium And Will Slowly Kill Millions For Years To Come"
- 9 - "Edible Microchips, Biometric Identity Systems And Mind Reading Computers"
- 10 - "Thanks To Obama, The Al-Qaeda Flag Is Now Flying High And Proud Over Libya"
- 11 - "Will The Newly Created "Killer Bird Flu" Someday Be Used As A Bio-Terror Weapon To Reduce The Population?"
- 12 - "How Globalism Has Destroyed Our Jobs, Businesses And National Wealth In 10 Easy Steps"

These are the headlines that come from this website..... So I think it is safe to say this is a very biased source that the Pro is basing his entire "argument" on.....

4) "And don't make me hold your hand while exposing you to the truth about mainstream media and politics."
You havent shown anyone anything..... Other than your sub 40 IQ level.....

5) "And I thought you knew something about the way the world runs."
I thought this would be a good debate with a sensible sane person.......... So it looks like we're both disappointed.....

6) All my arguments still stand....
Debate Round No. 3
information2012

Pro

Hannity: http://www.clearchannel.com...

So, you're wrong. And you're wrong to live in denial about the corporate fascism that dominates the media and how that effects what you and all your liberal friends hear on the radio and see when on TV which you worship as a source of truth.

You are trying to debate me using mainsteam information sources, but that just won't work.

You don't believe in Jesus Christ, so debating for you has to do with attachments to the logic of this world.

Try God.
imabench

Con

I looked into it, and many media broadcasting groups actually employ Sean Hannity
Cumulus,
http://lakecharles.cumulusradio.com...
Clear Channel Radio,
http://www.clearchannel.com...
KSFO,
http://blogs.sfweekly.com...
and WABC
http://wabcradio.com...
http://www.ksfo.com...

So Sean Hannity doesn't answer to any one media outlet.... Such as CCC..... And neither do most other talk show hosts

"You are trying to debate me using mainsteam information sources, but that just won't work."
Yeah it does, I'm beating the hell out of you with them right now....

"You don't believe in Jesus Christ, so debating for you has to do with attachments to the logic of this world."
Now that first part seems a little mean.... But I do agree with that second part where I use logic for my arguments unlike you who uses hate speech.

"Try God."
Try pulling your thumb out of your own a** long enough to actually answer my other arguments....

(List of forfeited arguments)
1) Romney hasn't worked for Bain in 10 years and thus cannot exercise any actual influence over them
2) Bain only bought CCC in 2008, many years after Romney was already gone
3) Bain still only owns a part of CCC, not all of it
4) CCC doesn't actually operate any of the talk show hosts you mentioned, they are only affiliated with other media sources that do
5) All of those hosts aren't forced to say what CCC wants them to say
6) These hosts don't even endorse Romney, most of them like Gingrich
7) The Univision Interview wasn't a product of CCC's manipulation, that was a story reported by many major news sources throughout the country besides CCC
8) Romney could be getting support because of his stances on issues and policies, not just through some fake conspiracy you came up with
9) The Conservative Media is not owned by any one corporation, and even Bain only co-owns a fraction of it.
10) None of this counts as "Lying his way to the GOP Nomination"
11) Your sources are overwhelmingly biased and unreliable
Debate Round No. 4
information2012

Pro

Here are some more conspiracy sites that you should ignore, if you insist on using MSNBC, CBS, CNN and Fox as your sources for truth (not to mention IckyPedia.com):

http://rense.com...

http://stevequayle.com...


By the way, if you're calling belief in God "hate speech," you really have serious spiritual problems. And there is no way for you to rationally except the truth of the Bain Capital & conservative media collaboration.

So, you might win a debate, but you will certainly lose out in life - walking around believing the mind control that you so willingly digest from the corporate media.

imabench

Con

lol, u mad bro?

Debate Round No. 5
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by imabench 2 years ago
imabench
I knew someone would give him a mercy point... :P
Posted by 1dustpelt 2 years ago
1dustpelt
I just want Obama out of office. NOW!
6 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Vote Placed by Mak-zie 2 years ago
Mak-zie
information2012imabenchTied
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Total points awarded:16 
Reasons for voting decision: All presidents lie, that's pretty much a fact.
Vote Placed by johnnyboy54 2 years ago
johnnyboy54
information2012imabenchTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: Words do not describe how horrendous pro's argument's were. Con destroyed him.
Vote Placed by 1Historygenius 2 years ago
1Historygenius
information2012imabenchTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: What CP and Royal said.
Vote Placed by royalpaladin 2 years ago
royalpaladin
information2012imabenchTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: Con's points were infinitely stronger, and Pro did not even attempt to attack them, so he loses arguments. Con's points were better sourced, so he wins sources. Finally, Pro attacked Con on religious and political grounds ("mindless liberal"), so he loses conduct. Finally, Pro used poor grammar when he started sentences with "and", which is incorrect because "and" demarks a subordinate clause and subordinate clauses cannot stand on their own as sentences. In addition, Pro misspelled Obama.
Vote Placed by Volkov 2 years ago
Volkov
information2012imabenchTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: What CP said.
Vote Placed by ConservativePolitico 2 years ago
ConservativePolitico
information2012imabenchTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro didn't even bother to back down from his points after Con proved them false. Pro didn't even present a case beyond the first round. Easy win for Con.